Post removed

[marble falls]

1. So, what subject is it that so many people disagree with you on?

[revmclaren]

2. Sorry..post glitch

[revmclaren]

4. By seeing the change in DU over the 12 years

I've been here, I feel and see a drastic change. Of course IMHO. We'll see what the poll reveals.

[RandySF]

3. Even DWS jumped on Biden today.

It’s a shit show.

[revmclaren]

5. It's 2016 2.0.

DU has always been a microcosm of the real world unless, like 2016, some decide to put their thumbs on the scale.

Many names are different, but the message is oh so familiar...IMHO.

[hlthe2b]

6. Debbie Wasserman Schultz? (Most won't know DWS)

I came in on the end of an interview with her--assumed it had something to do with Biden's updated Israeli policy, but had missed it all. But she looked as though she had been or was crying... What on earth?

[revmclaren]

9. I'm old and in poor health. I will vote for Joe Biden

as will my family, but if the youth of our nation, and the purists do what they did in 2016, and the orange traitor is elected, then my life will only bare the hell that this country will become for a short period of time. But the young will be my age before they recover...if they ever do....I will morn for them.

[RandySF]

13. She said she wants Biden to clarify his support for Israel.

JFC let the man do his job.

[hlthe2b]

42. Ahh Was she crying or was that just me (or my lousy tv)?

[LeftInTX]

47. You can watch the interview here:

Her voice is fine. Her make up isn't smeared. It appears she has redness around her nose, which I think she might be covering up. But I see the redness in previous pics too. (rosacea? allergies?) Her eyes are naturally kinda glassy.

I didn't really see anything that jumped out at me. I expect that she would hold firm on Israel stuff, she always has. She wasn't over the top. Just questioning.
https://www.msnbc.com/katy-tur/watch/-problem-of-imprecision-in-biden-s-communication-on-israel-rep-wasserman-210692165510

________________________________________________________________________________


Pics:
https://www.sun-sentinel.com/2020/01/19/debbie-wasserman-schultz-talks-about-trump-iran-venezuela-floridas-two-senators-and-more-opinion/

https://www.congress.gov/member/debbie-wasserman-schultz/W000797

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/democratic-party-chairwoman-debbie-wasserman-914056/

[hlthe2b]

48. Thanks!

[paleotn]

79. Exactly. He's been quite clear.

They choose not to listen. How many times does he have to say they've gone to fucking far before they realize he's serious?

[Kaleva]

7. Jackpine Radicals is no more?

[revmclaren]

8. I think they may be on X, but no website.

Their past posts, along with past posts of DU can be found on archive.org.

[Kaleva]

11. I just did some Google searching

And found one place where former members talked about it's demise and other things.

https://ohiobarbarian.substack.com/p/jackpine-radicals-in-memoriam-thread

[revmclaren]

22. Yes. There are some ex JPRers who post there once in a while.

But they are not 'nesting' there.

So far, they haven't all found a site to 'infest' yet like before...at least to my knowledge.

[Kaleva]

12. I just did some Google searching

And found one place where former members talked about it's demise and other things.

https://ohiobarbarian.substack.com/p/jackpine-radicals-in-memoriam-thread

[ProfessorGAC]

41. Gone

I'd go there just to check how nuts it had gotten & sometime in the past several months and got a web page saying the domain was for sale.

[OutNow]

10. Hey, I'm a Democrat - Discord and Disagreement what I expect

Attempts to silence disagreement is what Republicans do.

[revmclaren]

14. You were around in 2016.

So you saw the mess it was here...the hatred...the antisemitism...the Russian propaganda.

Disagreement is expected here...discord and personal attacks are not. I'm afraid there will be far worse as the election draws near.

[Beausoleil]

19. I am reminded of this famous quote

I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat.

Will Rogers

IMO disruptors don't really add anything to discussions.

[revmclaren]

20. And they are usually addressed in the posts.

I have just seen a higher level of hostility and WTF statements that I never thought I would see here.

[Beausoleil]

23. Agree

The divisiveness lately is truly disheartening.

Election years are like that around here. The Hamas attack has made it exponentially worse.

Doesn't make it OK, though.

[iemanja]

15. Because people disagree with you on an issue they are disruptors?

That is an intellectually weak position.
What these disagreements have shown me is that some on this site are far less liberal than I would have thought, but we are, after all, a big tent party.

[revmclaren]

17. No...it isnt.

Last edited Fri May 10, 2024, 07:47 PM - Edit history (1)

You were a major poster here during 2016. You saw what it was like.

The MIRT team has been very busy lately from what I have observed.

This poll is for letting DUers vote on whether they see signs of returning disrupters.

The poll is pretty self answering.

[Cha]

24. YOu're Right, Rev.. We have been Very Busy.. So Many Disruptors!

But we're On It

[revmclaren]

27. Thank you.

[Cha]

28. You're So Welcome

[iemanja]

30. I oppose the war in Gaza

I find the IDF's behavior to be atrocious and mass murderous. I also supported Hillary Clinton in the primaries of 2016. I am not a troll. I do not spread propaganda. I do disagree with you, and I find your assertion to be offensive. I see these kinds of charges repeatedly, regarding issue after issue. Some people find it impossible to tolerate dissent.

Now, MIRT may be banning trolls, but there are also long-term posters who have the audacity to disagree with you on the Gaza issue. Get out the smelling salts.

[mjvpi]

34. I am not a frequent poster, but as a Humanist, I too am appalled by the war in Gaza.

I admire Senator Bernie Sanders. I proudly voted for Clinton and Biden. Lately, I have felt that a hostility towards decent that I felt when I expressed support for Sanders.

I am not a Troll. I’m an American life long Democrat.

[revmclaren]

37. Not about Sanders or gaza. About hostility and JPR.

I am perplexed that some are taking this poll so personally.

[mjvpi]

43. I am stating that I have had hostile responses on both of those subjects. 2016/Sanders. Now/Gaza.

[revmclaren]

44. Understand.

Hostility has no place in intelligent debate.

[revmclaren]

35. Hmmm. Interesting reaction.

This post wasn't about gaza. It was my observations about JPR and hostility.

I have a terabyte drive of posts from the dark times. Both here and on JPR...I even have the full members list saved from that vile site.

But again, I simply psted a poll. I'm not the one who made it personal.

[iemanja]

36. Nice try

but a fail.

[revmclaren]

38. What fail? Please explain.

[iemanja]

39. It's unfortunate

that you can't be forthright for the reason behind your post. It confirms my initial thoughts. I won't elaborate further. Have a good evening.

[Nixie]

74. Your observations are not a fail.

It was an overnight shift here about Hillary long before the General. It's bogus for anyone to insinuate it was only about supporting her in the General as was done in this poll thread.

[iemanja]

16. The problem with 2016 is that the refused to back the party's nominee

Not that they disagreed with some people over issues.

[revmclaren]

18. It was much more than that.

Russian disinformation, posting negative memes about democrats and DUers, etc.

I've been tiptoing through my personal archives and those online, and not supporting the nominee was only a part of it.

You are of course free to start your own poll on the subject.

[iemanja]

26. I don't need a "pole"

Either a Geographic one or a six foot one. The behavior you describe pervaded the site throughout the primary but was tolerated. It was when they refused to support the nominee that people were banned.

Now, your assertion would appear to be that those who disagree with you are advancing "propaganda" by the mere fact they disagree with you. I see no appropriate or acceptable reason for advancing such a claim.

[revmclaren]

29. Im not asserting a thing.

Choice 5 in the poll asks bluntly if anyone sees disrupters.

I have made it very clear in my statements that it is IMHO (My Humble Opinion) only.

We are allowed to have them here you know. We're not Repubicans you know. Weren't those your words or something to that effect.

[iemanja]

31. No, if fact, they weren't my words

[iemanja]

33. No, I didn't.

[revmclaren]

40. My apologies...

I misread the poster. I will delete.

[betsuni]

21. What's really annoying is the rule of go-to personal insults, insinuating or coming right out and

accusing others of not being liberal/progressive, being right-wing/Republican/centrist, stupid, old, not caring, wealthy, etc. For supporting Democrats and debunking disinformation.

The don't-care-about-dead-babies thing that Obama, Hillary (saw it yesterday -- Hillary loves bombing children, although I missed when she was president), and now Biden is accused of. They couldn't insinuate racism with Obama, but of course did with Hillary and do with Biden.

[revmclaren]

25. Yes. It's like walking on land mines

sometimes.

I see this building up to a horrendous climax everywhere just before the election, and then a fading into the background for many. Then denial, excuses, rinse and repeat.

[Nixie]

70. It's the disinformation campaigns that are so obvious,

and they go just as you mentioned...smear campaigns light on context of our party. I vote with the majority of my party in statewide and national elections, yet this is the only place that calls us RWers or trolls for doing so.

The disinformation campaigners always target Democrats with very little care about Republicans and how they are being used by them.

[betsuni]

72. Would be nice if a forum for supporting Democrats could be that.

[JustAnotherGen]

45. What is jackpine radicals?

[revmclaren]

46. It was the evil stepsister to DU.

It was formed in 2016 as a safe haven for anti Clinton/Democrats to flee to after they played havoc with this site. They voted third way or wrote in Sanders when Clinton became the nominee.

Later posts at JPR showed the pride they took in helping elect tRump.

The site let out its last gasp spring of 2023.

[betsuni]

50. Was for nothing, only against Democrats, all conspiracy theories all the time. Hillary murdered Seth Rich

and was out to murder everybody, bolts from her full body brace fell out of her pants, they pathetically pleaded for help to comb through hacked emails because there had to be evidence of horrible evil crimes -- their whole ideology based on evil corruption of Democrats and yet they only had conspiracy theories. Trump was fine. Of course Russian interference was a hoax because Russia is very nice.

Got really mad when Bernie Sanders endorsed the Democratic nominee for president in elections and took his photo off the front page, maybe to "teach him a lesson" about being a True Progressive. Loved Elizabeth Warren until she ran for president and then five minutes later she was Hillary 2.0, Pocahontas, capitalist, enemy, establishment.

Nuts!

[revmclaren]

62. Truly nuts.

What I call 'the dark times' now.

[AllyCat]

77. Additionally, it was named after a long-time WI DUer

Jackpine Radical. He died about a decade ago.

He would not have condoned their actions here and cannot imagine he would have wanted his handle as the name of their 45-loving site.

[Patton French]

49. Well, I wasn't here in 2016

So I guess I’m not qualified to vote. With respect to discord, definitely with respect to Israel. Some very “out there” things being said. Disrupters? Who knows.

[bucolic_frolic]

51. Disruptors of all types post ambiguities to gaslight your mind into neutered self-doubt

Last edited Sat May 11, 2024, 06:32 AM - Edit history (1)

I'm not aware of past invading hordes but can detect a Russian bot at will. Unfortunately some here play along or are duped. Weak posts that seek to divide us should be banned, IMHO.

[Think. Again.]

52. I wasn't here in 2016...

...so I won't take the poll, but from my newbie point of view, it seems troll activity flares up around any hot topic being discussed, I guess with the intent to chill any positive progress made from those discussions.

I can usually tell when a poster pops in with a clear attempt to sideline a discussion by bringing some barely related gaslighting statement or question, that the discussion has hit a sensitive spot on their radar.

[betsuni]

53. ...

[Think. Again.]

54. Yes! Like that!

[Think. Again.]

56. Perfect examples! Thank you!

[betsuni]

57. This OP should be kicked and you've helped! Thank you ever so!

[Think. Again.]

59. It SHOULD be kicked...

...I was just thinking about the troll activity this morning when going through weird, nonsense responses to some of my posts from last night and then came across this OP in latest discussions.

Glad I'm not the only one bothered by the obvious, and sometimes not so obvious, trolling we have to deal with.

[revmclaren]

60. A simple little poll created by my musings while

switching back and forth between current DU posts and those on archive.org has morphed into a microcosm of the very thing my post questions.

Hi betsuni

Yes, the kicks from some unexpected sources is keeping alive a poll/post that I thought would have fizzled long ago.

I must have struck some kind of cord

[Nixie]

67. Yes!

That was a big help!

[Jedi Guy]

81. Oh, the irony... N/T

[RandiFan1290]

58. I think it's the 2008 PUMA crowd

Last edited Sat May 11, 2024, 08:04 AM - Edit history (1)

A hit dog will holler!

[revmclaren]

61. Thats a term I haven't heard or seen posted here in oh...at

least 8 years.

I've been seeing a lot of it while reading the archives though. This post is full of surprises. I really didn't expect to see it this morning.

[betsuni]

64. Who?

[revmclaren]

65. .....

[revmclaren]

63. 354 am: Replies: 62 Views: 1214

Time to get some rest.

Getting ready for a yard sale Sunday.

Will respond more afternoon or evening.

[Celerity]

66. Passed on the options, and the so-called 'disruptors' are often only called that by some who simply disagree with them

[Nixie]

68. Is this irony?

[betsuni]

69. "Disagree" has a new definition. There are no facts anymore, only emotions.

[Nixie]

71. Yes, such irony there, as usual tho. I find the beginning

of the "disagree" part is overlooking election results that prove the "disagree" part wrong, but the disinformation continues.

[Doc Sportello]

76. No it's completely accurate

Take this "poll" for instance. There is clearly an agenda here to paint those who disagree with them on the Israel-Gaza issue as "disruptors". I know of one poster who returned recently who makes reasoned, fact-based posts on the issue and is attacked relentlessly. There is nothing disruptive about that, other than it disrupts the perspective of those who defend Israel with nothing but one sentence memes no matter the action or outcome.

[AllyCat]

73. I actually have a list.

[ecstatic]

75. No. The usernames are not unfamiliar.

It's not that people have changed or that there are new users creating chaos. The issue is that we just didn't know how our fellow duers would respond to various events and now we're learning.

It's unfortunate because I see users who I agree with on 99% of things, but we're not on the same page with regard to what's happening in the Middle East.

I finally understand why certain topics were kept on specific forums. However, by keeping those topics separate, it created a false sense of agreement that may not have been there.

[DFW]

78. JPR and its recent member clonings only serve(d) to remind me

“Get a life” is not enforceable in a court of law.

All of us, both long-term and recent arrivals need to remember that. Some take advantage of the fact, some suffer because of it. Finding the middle ground is up to the site administrators and owners.

[Freethinker65]

80. I was here during the JPR days and had actually forgotten the name.

I think there have always been agenda driven counter arguers on DU, especially during election season. I got a warning and had my post deleted for posting "nyet" to an obvious troll propaganda question years ago. I almost quit DU because of it (thought DUers wound understand my "nyet" answer was a an alternative to "don't feed the trolls" ).

I can't imaging people wasting time coming to a social media political opinion/user news aggregating site just to try to cause trouble, but it obviously happens. Having those same people return to DU years later after being tombstoned/banned seems rather pathetic to me. One would think they would move on to other sites, or, play it less safe and interact with actual people in the real world.

However, I have found myself putting more people on ignore lately?

[Torchlight]

82. I figure there may be active trolls. Heck, I asume there are.

I doubt any are sponsored or professionals, but the amount of "this looks bad for us" and the bad-faith responses often clues me (takes me while, sometimes) and they wind up on ignore, their sancomony inconsequential.

[Silent3]

83. Besides the Israel/Gaza conflict, which I think simply exposes some deep divisions which have always been there...

…I don’t see anything as bad as the Jackpine Radicals days.

I’m saying that even after I think I personally got a bit of treatment myself that was an awful lot like the way the JPR crew would swarm anyone who they felt had stepped outside their orthodoxy.

We nearly all seem to all be solidly behind the absolutely vital need for Biden to win in November, and for Democrats to keep the Senate and regain the House.

If the JPR crew, or anything close to it were here now, there would probably be a big noisy contingent screaming horrible things about Biden, supporting nuts like RFK Jr., and quite happy to “burn it all down” rather than support (in their view) less than ideologically perfect candidates.