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oberliner

(58,724 posts)
Sun May 27, 2018, 10:58 AM May 2018

The Border Patrol Was Monstrous Under Obama. Imagine How Bad It Is Under Trump.

On a December morning, Border Patrol agents confronted a 15-year-old high school student named Jahveel Ocampo at a rest stop in California while she and her friends were on their way to the mountains to see the winter’s first snow. Jahveel was a young child when she came to the United States from Mexico with her parents, and she grew up undocumented in southern California. She was a mother to a 2-year-old child, who was a U.S. citizen.

An agent in a blue jacket asked whether Jahveel was an “illegal.” He handcuffed her and drove her to a Border Patrol station in the border town of Campo. There, he slapped her twice on the buttocks and ordered her into a cell. He and another male agent told her to sign an “order of voluntary departure,” a deportation order. She refused.

Then the threats began. One agent said, in Spanish, according to the complaint she filed later, “Right now, we close the door, we rape you and f*** you. If you cooperate with us, we can deport you to Mexico. Otherwise, we will take you to jail and deport your entire family.” They told her that her child would end up in foster care.

Terrified and alone, Jahveel signed.

If you assumed this abuse happened during the Trump administration, think again. Jahveel was threatened in 2009 by President Obama’s Border Patrol, and her treatment was not an isolated incident. Her case is part of a pattern of physical, sexual, and emotional abuse by Customs and Border Protection officials against child immigrants that existed long before President Trump emboldened the agency by unleashing its officers to enforce his draconian immigration policies.

https://www.aclu.org/blog/immigrants-rights/ice-and-border-patrol-abuses/border-patrol-was-monstrous-under-obama-imagine
61 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Border Patrol Was Monstrous Under Obama. Imagine How Bad It Is Under Trump. (Original Post) oberliner May 2018 OP
I'm certain that wasn't Obama's policy. Aren't you? MineralMan May 2018 #1
Of course not oberliner May 2018 #2
OK, then. Obama did not encourage such behavior, in the way Trump has. MineralMan May 2018 #4
The title emphasizes exactly that point oberliner May 2018 #5
Whatever, oberliner... MineralMan May 2018 #7
I don't understand what your take is here oberliner May 2018 #10
I did read the article. MineralMan May 2018 #15
Anyone paying attention understands. MrsCoffee May 2018 #19
+100 MineralMan May 2018 #22
The article is from the ACLU and it says the Border Patrol was monstrous under Obama, which it was oberliner May 2018 #36
OFFS it says the BORDER PATROL was monstrous NOT OBAMA. m-lekktor May 2018 #45
It's hard to read it and not get emotional oberliner May 2018 #20
Seems to be the question-o-the-day. George II May 2018 #38
That entire agency needs to be shut down, fumigated and rebuilt. shanny May 2018 #3
Yes, agree 100 percent oberliner May 2018 #6
Law enforcement agencies tend to attract authoritarians. The Velveteen Ocelot May 2018 #8
Yes, indeed oberliner May 2018 #9
This gets posted on DU while trump is falsely blaming Obama for separation of children from parents. George II May 2018 #11
This is a report from the ACLU and it does not blame Obama for separating children from parents oberliner May 2018 #12
Sure. George II May 2018 #16
Did you read the article? oberliner May 2018 #17
Sure did. Several days ago. George II May 2018 #21
What are your thoughts? oberliner May 2018 #37
trump isn't the only GasLighter. Cha May 2018 #13
The ACLU is gaslighting? oberliner May 2018 #14
The ACLU published that four days ago, and you post it as trump's accusations against Obama.... George II May 2018 #18
That's pretty recent oberliner May 2018 #25
I'm not fooled. George II May 2018 #30
About the author oberliner May 2018 #32
Remember, ICE and Border Patrol are two separate agencies Fiendish Thingy May 2018 #23
Agreed oberliner May 2018 #26
Obama was "known" as the Deporter-in-Chief (statistically). yallerdawg May 2018 #24
That is correct oberliner May 2018 #27
Thank you for posting this Oberliner. I think we shouldn't blindly approve of mucifer May 2018 #28
You're welcome oberliner May 2018 #34
Yep TimeSnowDemos May 2018 #29
Time for the Ferrets are Cool May 2018 #31
Obama did try to change things with his immigration bill that passed the Senate. Trust Buster May 2018 #33
Yes, he did oberliner May 2018 #35
Noam Chomsky once called Obama the most extensive global terrorist the world has yet seen. ucrdem May 2018 #39
This headline does not reflect poorly on the ACLU oberliner May 2018 #40
It's disgusting. They know better and so do you. nt ucrdem May 2018 #41
In what way is it disgusting? oberliner May 2018 #42
You acknowledge Obama tried to change things. The headline implies he is complacent. sunRISEnow May 2018 #46
The headline does not imply that oberliner May 2018 #47
I disagree. I think it does taint Obama with this, though he tried to address it. sunRISEnow May 2018 #49
Check out these two recent DU posts oberliner May 2018 #51
That is the intent of the thread BannonsLiver May 2018 #54
The intent of the thread is to highlight the ACLU report oberliner May 2018 #56
Right. sunRISEnow May 2018 #57
If you've read the full ACLU report, I'd be interesting in hearing your thoughts oberliner May 2018 #59
Yes it does seeing no acknowledgement in change in title, you know that uponit7771 May 2018 #50
No, of course it doesn't oberliner May 2018 #52
The headline states: "The Border Patrol Was Monstrous Under Obama." Period. Hard stop. George II May 2018 #61
It certainly does reflect poorly on the ACLU, it's very disappointing. George II May 2018 #60
Never sign what they want you to sign; insist on a hearing treestar May 2018 #43
Very good points oberliner May 2018 #44
Apparently DUers don't like that you used the actual title of the ACLU report. m-lekktor May 2018 #48
These two recent DU posts are also illustrative of something oberliner May 2018 #53
I normally wouldn't have seen this post, but... demmiblue May 2018 #55
By the way, here is a link to their full report oberliner May 2018 #58

MineralMan

(146,192 posts)
1. I'm certain that wasn't Obama's policy. Aren't you?
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:06 AM
May 2018

Law enforcement, in general, tends to attract sadistic, brutal types. Poor training and supervision often allows that brutality and sadistic behavior to continue and go unpunished. It is not within the policy of that organization, nor of any other law enforcement organization.

It was not Obama's behavior or leadership that caused that incident. It was the nature of the people who did it.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
2. Of course not
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:09 AM
May 2018

The ACLU piece is just pointing out how awful the Border Patrol has been behaving with impunity for years/decades, and how it will probably get even worse throughout the Trump administration.

MineralMan

(146,192 posts)
4. OK, then. Obama did not encourage such behavior, in the way Trump has.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:15 AM
May 2018

In fact, Barack Obama tried hard to make life easier for immigrants, documented or not.

I see what you did, though, in your thread title. So, I mentioned it.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
5. The title emphasizes exactly that point
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:18 AM
May 2018

It was monstrous then with a POTUS who cared, imagine how awful it is now with Trump as president (who explicitly doesn't).

(The thread title is the verbatim title of the ACLU article).

Read the last paragraph:

President Trump was endorsed by the Border Patrol union, which had never previously endorsed a presidential candidate. If the abuses were this bad under Obama when the Border Patrol described itself as constrained, imagine how it must be now under Trump, who vowed to unleash the agents to do their jobs.

MrsCoffee

(5,801 posts)
19. Anyone paying attention understands.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:45 AM
May 2018

Trump is committing genocide and tries to blame it on Obama and someone comes along and posts an article that calls Obama monstrous.

I think most people here will understand.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
36. The article is from the ACLU and it says the Border Patrol was monstrous under Obama, which it was
Sun May 27, 2018, 12:09 PM
May 2018

It also says it's much worse under Trump.

I am grateful that people like Mitra Ebadolahi, who wrote this piece for the ACLU, are out there doing the work she is passionate about.

Here's her bio:


Mitra Ebadolahi (@MitraEbadolahi) has been with the ACLU since 2011. As a Border Litigation Project Staff Attorney, she focuses on identifying, documenting, and litigating human and civil rights violations along the U.S.-Mexico border. Her litigation thus lies at the intersection of immigrants' rights, racial justice, and police practices.

https://www.aclu.org/bio/mitra-ebadolahi


There are systematic problems that existed before Trump and will exist after he is gone unless we are willing to really do something about them.
 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
20. It's hard to read it and not get emotional
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:45 AM
May 2018

I support the ACLU bringing these shameful actions to light.

I applaud those who have been fighting this fight for a long time now.

Critical to recognize that this must be fixed - which will involve more than just getting rid of Trump.

To some of us, this is more than just politics.

 

shanny

(6,709 posts)
3. That entire agency needs to be shut down, fumigated and rebuilt.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:14 AM
May 2018

Unfortunately, it is not the only one.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,280 posts)
8. Law enforcement agencies tend to attract authoritarians.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:21 AM
May 2018

It gives people who like to assert control over others the opportunity to do so legally, and often with little constraint. It's why police brutality is so common, and why it seems to be so hard to prevent or control. As an example, my city, Minneapolis, is reliably liberal in its voting habits, but its police department nevertheless has been staffed by a whole lot of racists and thugs for decades, and despite efforts by various mayors and police chiefs the problem still exists.

Too many people who want to be cops choose that career mainly because they like to dominate people. ICE and the Border Patrol seem to attract authoritarian assholes with the same racist, immigrant-hating mindset as Sheriff Arpaio, and if it's even worse now it's because it's obvious that Trump likes it that way and nobody is even going through the motions of trying to rein them in.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
9. Yes, indeed
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:25 AM
May 2018

Hence they need to be constrained by more compassionate people higher up the food chain.

The ACLU has been trying to shine a light on these abuses for a very long time, and I applaud them for that.

It's sad and shameful that things are trending even worse now (and they were already monstrous).

George II

(67,782 posts)
11. This gets posted on DU while trump is falsely blaming Obama for separation of children from parents.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:33 AM
May 2018

smh.....

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
12. This is a report from the ACLU and it does not blame Obama for separating children from parents
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:35 AM
May 2018

It documents the abuses of the Border Patrol under the Obama administration and expresses horror at how much worse it will be/is under Trump.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
17. Did you read the article?
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:43 AM
May 2018

That's the only way to know what it says.

Do you think the systematic problems with Border Patrol throughout the 2000s and 2010s are being made up by the ACLU?

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
14. The ACLU is gaslighting?
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:39 AM
May 2018

Seems like that's what you are suggesting - which is odd.

How about we address the fact that the Border Patrol has been systematically flawed (to put it mildly) for years/decades?

George II

(67,782 posts)
18. The ACLU published that four days ago, and you post it as trump's accusations against Obama....
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:44 AM
May 2018

...is gaining traction.

Smh.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
25. That's pretty recent
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:47 AM
May 2018

And it makes some critically important points - notably that the Border Patrol has been engaging in the abuse of minors for quite some time. This is a cause that is bigger than politics for many people.

It also makes the point that, though the Border Patrol was monstrous under Obama, it will be/is much worse under Trump.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
32. About the author
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:57 AM
May 2018
Mitra Ebadolahi (@MitraEbadolahi) has been with the ACLU since 2011. As a Border Litigation Project Staff Attorney, she focuses on identifying, documenting, and litigating human and civil rights violations along the U.S.-Mexico border. Her litigation thus lies at the intersection of immigrants' rights, racial justice, and police practices. Previously, she was the inaugural Nadine Strossen Fellow at the ACLU's National Security Project in New York, where her docket included cases challenging torture, mass surveillance, and racial and religious profiling.

https://www.aclu.org/bio/mitra-ebadolahi


She seems like someone worth listening to.

Fiendish Thingy

(15,369 posts)
23. Remember, ICE and Border Patrol are two separate agencies
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:46 AM
May 2018

ICE was created after 9/11 and operates under Homeland Security. As bad as the Border Patrol can be, under Trump, ICE has become a terrorist organization.

yallerdawg

(16,104 posts)
24. Obama was "known" as the Deporter-in-Chief (statistically).
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:46 AM
May 2018

The Republicans have insisted illegal border crossings have to be "zero" before they will do any immigration reform (they lied).

Worse is deporting DACA immigrants, treating refugees as criminals, deliberately separating women from their children and, as described at the very top, treating these fellow human beings like animals as policy.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
27. That is correct
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:49 AM
May 2018

Something important to remember - the system has been broken for a long time. Trump is of course making things much much worse and his cruelty seems to know no bounds. However, even when we are finally rid of Trump, we need to fix the systematic problems that pre-date him.

mucifer

(23,374 posts)
28. Thank you for posting this Oberliner. I think we shouldn't blindly approve of
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:50 AM
May 2018

everything President Obama did just because it was horrific but it's worse now.

President Obama knew about the patterns of abuse and looked the other way.

The thing I can applaud him for was encouraging an overall change in immigration law and for DACA.

But, that in no way excuses what he did as far as protecting the immigrants in custody before they were deported.

Yes, he is better than trump. But, he was also awful on this issue.

Issues we discuss here are often nuanced and we should acknowledge that.

 

TimeSnowDemos

(476 posts)
29. Yep
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:51 AM
May 2018

Sadly there's a real connection between WANTING to patrol borders and being a thug. I don't know why it is, but there's just waaaaaaay too much evidence to ignore. Maybe the border patrol chooses these sorts of people, or maybe they choose the border patrol, but... However it happens, like the police in many instances, the people guarding US borders are frequently awful and think they're above the law.

 

Trust Buster

(7,299 posts)
33. Obama did try to change things with his immigration bill that passed the Senate.
Sun May 27, 2018, 11:57 AM
May 2018

The House refused to even consider it. But Oberliner makes a relevant point that this was a festering problem ripe for Don the Con to throw gas upon.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
35. Yes, he did
Sun May 27, 2018, 12:01 PM
May 2018

I do think this was an issue that Obama tried to address and met with resistance.

As the article points out, now that the Border Patrol is unconstrained under Trump, things are going to sadly get much worse.

Once we vote out the Republicans in Congress and we are free of Trump, we still have to make sure we address these issues.

ucrdem

(15,512 posts)
39. Noam Chomsky once called Obama the most extensive global terrorist the world has yet seen.
Sun May 27, 2018, 12:43 PM
May 2018
On international affairs, Obama's major step --contribution if you like-- was to launch the most extensive global terrorism campaign the world has yet seen

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2015/03/19/noam_chomsky_obamas_drone_assassination_program_is_the_most_extensive_global_terrorism_campaign_the_world_has_yet_seen.html


Didn't make it so. But it reflects very poorly on Chomsky as this headline reflects poorly on the ACLU. Very poorly indeed.
 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
40. This headline does not reflect poorly on the ACLU
Sun May 27, 2018, 12:47 PM
May 2018

It is not even remotely similar to the Noam Chomsky quote.

The ACLU report shows that the Border Patrol was monstrous under Obama, and will be/is worse under Trump (as the headline indicates).

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
42. In what way is it disgusting?
Sun May 27, 2018, 02:17 PM
May 2018

I honestly do not understand what you are suggesting about the ACLU.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
47. The headline does not imply that
Sun May 27, 2018, 02:42 PM
May 2018

It states the fact that the Border Patrol was monstrous during Obama's presidency (examples provided in the report) and suggests, correctly, that it will be much worse under Trump (which is what we are now seeing).

 

sunRISEnow

(217 posts)
49. I disagree. I think it does taint Obama with this, though he tried to address it.
Sun May 27, 2018, 03:05 PM
May 2018

And minimize Trump and his actions. See, they both do it/both parties are responsible/both are basically the same.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
51. Check out these two recent DU posts
Sun May 27, 2018, 03:36 PM
May 2018

Children are being held in cages, like animals

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10663503

Trump's Amerika: First glimpse of immigrant children at holding facility

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10663452

They both show the same awful photos - which are from June, 2014.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
56. The intent of the thread is to highlight the ACLU report
Sun May 27, 2018, 03:43 PM
May 2018

Which everyone who actually cares about this issue ought to read in its entirety.

Here it is for anyone who is interested:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/lplnnufjbwci0xn/CBP%20Report%20ACLU_IHRC%205.23%20FINAL.pdf?dl=0

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
59. If you've read the full ACLU report, I'd be interesting in hearing your thoughts
Sun May 27, 2018, 04:03 PM
May 2018

Since this is clearly a topic that is important to you.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
52. No, of course it doesn't
Sun May 27, 2018, 03:37 PM
May 2018

The ACLU has been documenting this for many years. Look at the photos from 2014 that DUers are posting, thinking they are more recent (see my response above).

George II

(67,782 posts)
61. The headline states: "The Border Patrol Was Monstrous Under Obama." Period. Hard stop.
Sun May 27, 2018, 05:10 PM
May 2018

As though Obama was responsible for that. It could have very easily said "The Border Patrol Was Monstrous before trump." , but that wouldn't have had it's desired effect and probably wouldn't have caught the eye of some.

It's a deceptive and misleading headline.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
43. Never sign what they want you to sign; insist on a hearing
Sun May 27, 2018, 02:23 PM
May 2018

so many people just give up. "Terrified and alone" and so it's their fault she went along with what they want. If we are going to remain the rule of law, we have to stand up for ourselves.

They know they have to give you a hearing.

I say this out of personal experience of people coming to my office after they pled guilty to something, say they didn't do it and felt pressured, and guess what, that is not enough to get rid of the results.

 

oberliner

(58,724 posts)
53. These two recent DU posts are also illustrative of something
Sun May 27, 2018, 03:38 PM
May 2018

Children are being held in cages, like animals

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10663503

Trump's Amerika: First glimpse of immigrant children at holding facility

https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=10663452

They both show the same awful photos - which are from June, 2014.

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