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Roland99

(53,342 posts)
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 10:50 AM Oct 2019

From court today: Impeachment is NOT just about Ukraine

The HJC is in court to obtain mueller grand jury materials. As part of the arguments came this nugget:




Letter says Pelosi has not limited the impeachment inquiry to Ukraine. He explains how the 6 committees will get together and share their potential articles against Trump to House leadership. Then HJC will report any articles to the full House.
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Roland99

(53,342 posts)
1. Also, Letter to Judge Howell re: vote to move auth impeachment
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 10:52 AM
Oct 2019



Judge Howell posits that this could be resolved if the House would just vote to authorize an impeachment inquiry. "You'd probably rule for all of us. We'd be done," Letter says. But he notes there's no House rule, or anything in Constitution or statute, saying this is required.

Roland99

(53,342 posts)
6. She was appointed to this position by Obama
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 11:11 AM
Oct 2019

But she presided over much of Mueller’s case and might be protective

Roland99

(53,342 posts)
9. She doesn't like dept stance claiming grand jury materials shouldn't be provided!!
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 02:22 PM
Oct 2019



Spencer Hsu

@hsu_spencer
· 2h
DEVELOPING Trump Justice Dept. asks U.S. judge to reject House Judiciary Committee request for Mueller grand jury materials, argues courts in 1974 wrongly gave Congress the Watergate grand jury 'roadmap' that led to President Nixon's impeachment.

Spencer Hsu

@hsu_spencer
"Wow, O.K.," responded U.S. Chief District Judge Beryl A. Howell of Washington, D.C., sounding unpersuaded. "As I said, the department is taking an extraordinary position in this case."

kentuck

(110,950 posts)
7. The Mueller Report can still be used as evidence.
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 11:15 AM
Oct 2019

All the testimony was taken under oath and there was a lot of evidence gathered.

No Committees are required to question these witnesses again. They have the sworn testimonies. That is all they need to file charges.

There were ten charges of obstruction of justice with 5 of those charges being very strong.

There was a lot of evidence of the Trump campaign colluding with the Russians. It wasn't just Paul Manafort. There were people that were helping the Russians attack our election system. His present campaign manager, Brad Pascrale, served as the digital media director in the 2016 campaign, before he was promoted to his present position.

If the House does impeach, and it goes to the Senate for a trial, how many charges should the Senate have to address? I think it would be a mistake just to send this one charge from the Ukraine investigation. The Senate should have to address each and every charge from the Mueller Report, as well as the new charges from the Ukraine betrayal, if it was introduced to the trial. Or whatever other charges that might arise between now and the time of the trial?

In my opinion, it is very important that they address as many charges as possible and make the Senators address each and every charge, in the Senate trial. This should be a requirement that the Democrats could demand? The Chief justice would be the final arbiter in any disagreements.

Both sides will have a strategy if there is a Senate trial.

Midnightwalk

(3,131 posts)
8. Let's play make a schedule
Tue Oct 8, 2019, 11:35 AM
Oct 2019

If the committees work extremely fast they might be done by thanksgiving. Too close the Christmas break to have full house meetings and a vote beforeChristmas in my opinion

So I’d guess the plan is to have the committee s work up to Christmas.

When does the house get back from break? Mid January? Figure four weeks for the full house to hold hearings. That puts a house vote in mid to end of February.

Super Tuesday is March 3rd. A good number of primaries are done by the time the senate begins a trial and it is very late to mount a primary challenge.

I know I’m guessing a lot in the above. If anything I think the dates could be later.

Having the senate trial after Super Tuesday gives us a chance that some senate republicans up for re-election grow a spine.

How late can the votes be? Too close to November might make the public say sort it out by election not impeachment. I don’t know what other factors they are thinking of but public opinion will influence the dates in my opinion.

I know doing the right thing matters the most, but I also think speaker Pelosi has a much better version of a schedule mapped out with a million times more insight.

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