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Jirel

(1,993 posts)
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 01:26 PM Jan 2020

The Robert Hyde story is important - but not for the reasons most people are talking about.

DU and social media are on fire this morning about the Robert Hyde story, talking about how the Dump administration was involved with stalking and maybe even putting a hit on Marie Yovanovich via Rethug PR guy and wannabe CT congressman Robert Hyde. Half are talking about his communications with Team Rudy, and the other half are complaining that this isn't the top story of the day. But all this chatter is missing perhaps the only ultimately important issue - the mentality of Team Rudy and, by extension Team Trump.

For the probably 3 people who haven't heard this part of the story yet, Hyde was dragged out of Trump's Doral roach motel for a psychiatric hold for 9 days in May 2019. The details can be found at:
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/01/new-figure-in-ukraine-scandal-was-taken-into-police-custody-at-trump-resort-last-year/

This was likely an acute psychotic episode, shortly after his stalking and "hit job" communications with Lev Parnas in March/April 2019.

While some people are putting this together to mean that Hyde was actually having Yovanovich followed, etc., then had a breakdown, possibly fueled by his cloak and dagger misdeeds in Ukraine, this is at least somewhat outlandish. In all likelihood, Hyde was already having issues with reality 1-2 months earlier.

Of course it all needs to be investigated regardless of Occam's Razor. HOWEVER, these are the important issues that are being lost in the noise:

1. Hyde is RIGHT NOW running as a Republican for the 5th district House seat in Connecticut. He is being backed by the Rethuglican Party. Absent even knowing all the rest, the Rethugs are trying to get a dude elected who recently spent 9 days in a psych ward with paranoid delusions that the Secret Service was hacking him, and the Doral landscapers were actually there to monitor/harm him. Only after he made a much more public idiot of himself in December 2019 with a repugnant tweet about Kamala Harris, did a few Rethug politicians suggest he end his campaign. What does this say about the GOP?

2. Whether or not the information and comments Hyde was feeding to Team Rudy in March 2019 was all a fabrication of a busted brain, Team Rudy kept him on the team, and was acting at least in part through him and based on that information. Rudy is a former federal prosecutor. He know damned well that language like "They will let me know when she’s on the move… They are willing to help if you/we would like a price....Guess you can do anything in Ukraine with money… what I was told," is an invitation to commit a crime. Legitimate actors, especially ex-prosecutors, would have immediately triggered to that kind of language. An honest one would have reported the communication to the FBI and immediately cut ties. A somewhat less honest but competent one would have immediately cut him loose for being an overly talkative and incompetent goon, and told him never to contact him again... and by the way, forget the political aspirations and any help you might get from us YOU DUMBF***. That Team Rudy just kept running with this incompetent, dangerous, possibly nuts guy speaks volumes about Team Rudy, and of course Team Rudy's bosses. RUDY is the one who needs a lot more investigation.

37 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The Robert Hyde story is important - but not for the reasons most people are talking about. (Original Post) Jirel Jan 2020 OP
Excellent post malaise Jan 2020 #1
Crazy assholes are capable of immense harm dalton99a Jan 2020 #2
Very important aspects of this surreal story! Pacifist Patriot Jan 2020 #3
Trump's advice needs to be followed "Ask Rudy" - put the squeeze on him. nt AnotherMother4Peace Jan 2020 #4
Just when you think it couldn't get crazier... N_E_1 for Tennis Jan 2020 #5
Oh, 3-4 years ago I was thinking I'd throw this away if it Hortensis Jan 2020 #34
What does that say when you can't tell if someone is mentally ill, or just Baitball Blogger Jan 2020 #6
The State Department told her to get rusty fender Jan 2020 #7
I can't believe any of this is happening StarfishSaver Jan 2020 #8
The State Department would have investigated the authenticity of the threats meadowlander Jan 2020 #9
Important point. Jirel Jan 2020 #25
I'm going with mercuryblues Jan 2020 #10
Noting that Rudy was a federal prosecutor understates things JHB Jan 2020 #11
Yes, and by the 1990s, the crime busters, including him, Hortensis Jan 2020 #35
Hyde is NOT being backed by the Connecticut Republican Party NewJeffCT Jan 2020 #12
well that's good at least IcyPeas Jan 2020 #19
That was only as of December 3. Jirel Jan 2020 #26
You can't be completely sane and do what he was doing. tinrobot Jan 2020 #13
New from Natasha Bertrand: Republican consultant had restraining order against Hyde - he violated it Dennis Donovan Jan 2020 #14
+1. Where did he get all that money? dalton99a Jan 2020 #16
Great question - was he used as a "front" donor (the $$$ was in his name to mask true donor?) Dennis Donovan Jan 2020 #18
He opened a DC consulting business in 2018. Jirel Jan 2020 #29
Sounds like he neglected his old business to give money to Trump to get contacts muriel_volestrangler Jan 2020 #21
Good post canetoad Jan 2020 #15
Whether he actually did it is important greenjar_01 Jan 2020 #17
9 days is a long time. you are lucky to get someone 72 hours involuntarily. mopinko Jan 2020 #20
We called it "pink papered" back in New England and it was only a 72 hour hold. Warpy Jan 2020 #23
Good points. My take on all this, which I find most important and I posted a blog on it Perseus Jan 2020 #22
It does look like brute force is part of the story. So many GOPs flipped to Russiapublican so fast. lagomorph777 Jan 2020 #31
That is a very good point, so many of them flipped very fast Perseus Jan 2020 #32
"... Team Rudy kept him on the team" Texin Jan 2020 #24
Patsy? A Lee Harvey guy? nt. druidity33 Jan 2020 #33
Both things could be true. The Velveteen Ocelot Jan 2020 #27
K&R MaryMagdaline Jan 2020 #28
Nixon/Lee Atwater normalized the act of open racism/bible thumping... magicarpet Jan 2020 #30
Hyde was never "backed" by the republican party for the 5th District Seat onenote Jan 2020 #36
Do we know he was NOT being targeted? Qutzupalotl Jan 2020 #37

malaise

(267,815 posts)
1. Excellent post
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 01:32 PM
Jan 2020

Get thee to the greatest page

By the way Don the Con should be in a psychiatric ward permanently

N_E_1 for Tennis

(9,593 posts)
5. Just when you think it couldn't get crazier...
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 01:43 PM
Jan 2020

It does! Swear to god... if this was a movie I’d start to wonder... “How twisted are these writers? Having a hard time believing this could happen.”

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
34. Oh, 3-4 years ago I was thinking I'd throw this away if it
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:17 PM
Jan 2020

was a novel, outrageously impossible to the point of being tediously unbelievable.

Baitball Blogger

(46,575 posts)
6. What does that say when you can't tell if someone is mentally ill, or just
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 01:44 PM
Jan 2020

an honorary member of the Republican party?

 

rusty fender

(3,428 posts)
7. The State Department told her to get
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 01:50 PM
Jan 2020

out of Ukraine on the next plane. Someone or a group of someone’s posed a danger to Yovanovitch. It may not have been Hyde.

meadowlander

(4,358 posts)
9. The State Department would have investigated the authenticity of the threats
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 02:16 PM
Jan 2020

for, by example, determining if her phone and computer had actually been hacked.

The real story is why can't we see the outcomes of those investigations? Because Trump is blocking everything. If there was anything exculpatory we would have seen it already.

Jirel

(1,993 posts)
25. Important point.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:23 PM
Jan 2020

Since the material has been seen by prosecutors, and at some point the state department (even if only now), there should be public follow up, and we should be demanding transparency.

mercuryblues

(14,491 posts)
10. I'm going with
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 02:45 PM
Jan 2020

Hyde didn't complete the job he was sent to do. He became paranoid about what harm might come to him. With this crew they are 1 fry short of a combo meal.

He seems like a loose cannon. Just the type of person that cabal would latch onto to create pandemonium. A great fall guy if their plans succeeded. An investigation might lead to him and his paranoia. It would have been easy to smear him and call him a "lone wolf." Everyone tsk-tsks and washes their hands.

JHB

(37,131 posts)
11. Noting that Rudy was a federal prosecutor understates things
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:01 PM
Jan 2020

Rudy was the federal prosecutor who indicted 11 organized crime figures, including the heads of New York's so-called "Five Families", under the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act (RICO) on charges including extortion, labor racketeering, and murder for hire.

Not to mention his uncle was a loan shark and his father was his uncle's enforcer.

The man knows mobster-speak better than he knows English. No way he didn't know what what was implying.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
35. Yes, and by the 1990s, the crime busters, including him,
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:20 PM
Jan 2020

had damaged American organized crime families to the point that people like Trump, who laundered money for them, hooked up with the new organized crime figures rising in Eurasia after the fall of the Soviet Union.

NewJeffCT

(56,827 posts)
12. Hyde is NOT being backed by the Connecticut Republican Party
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:03 PM
Jan 2020

They condemned his comments about Senator Harris after he made them and asked him to withdraw from the race for the the US House - there are 4 or 5 other Republicans in the race as well.

Jirel

(1,993 posts)
26. That was only as of December 3.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:26 PM
Jan 2020

There’s a lot of space between Mid-May when he wound up in the psych ward, and early December when a number of Rethugs washed their hands of him... and only because of the reprehensible tweet.

tinrobot

(10,848 posts)
13. You can't be completely sane and do what he was doing.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:08 PM
Jan 2020

Sane people tend to follow the norms of society. He wasn't doing that.

My guess is that, yes, he was serious about following her and perhaps doing harm. Why? Because he's crazy.

When that failed, he started worrying about polonium in his sushi. Again, because he's crazy.

Simple.

Dennis Donovan

(18,770 posts)
14. New from Natasha Bertrand: Republican consultant had restraining order against Hyde - he violated it
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:09 PM
Jan 2020

...and GREAT question from Michelle Goldberg:



Michelle Goldberg ✔ @michelleinbklyn

One question that needs answering immediately is who if anyone was paying Hyde's expenses in Ukraine

Natasha Bertrand ✔ @NatashaBertrand

"The Intercept obtained police records showing that Hyde violated a restraining order issued by a Washington, DC superior court judge at the request of a Republican consultant who says that Hyde stalked her and intimidated her family over the last year." https://theintercept.com/2020/01/15/trump-supporter-who-discussed-surveillance-of-ambassador-marie-yovanovitch-has-history-of-stalking-mental-health-issues/

2:02 PM - Jan 15, 2020

dalton99a

(81,068 posts)
16. +1. Where did he get all that money?
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:12 PM
Jan 2020
Then in September 2016, Hyde began cutting checks to the Republican National Committee’s, Trump campaign and a joint fundraising committee for Trump and the GOP on a near daily basis — sometimes multiple checks over $1,000 in a day, FEC records show.

Hyde contributed $23,293 to the Trump campaign and Republican causes in the 2016 election cycle, FEC data shows. He also gave $25,000 to Trump’s inauguration, according to data shared by the Center for Responsive Politics.

In February 2019, he was evicted from a commercial address in Simsbury, Conn. where his landscaping business was formerly based, for failing to pay rent, court records show. Hyde said in an interview Monday he was never evicted and was unfamiliar with the address, although he listed it on paperwork for individual contributions he made in 2016, FEC records show.

An Old Saybrook marina sued Hyde for not paying for storage fees and services for his boat in January 2019, court records show. Hyde was ordered to pay the marina $4,708 in March. Hyde owns or owned a 36 foot motor boat that he registered in Connecticut in 2017, public records indicate. Hyde said in an interview Monday he does not own a boat and was unfamiliar with the lawsuit. But the legal complaint provided the address Hyde’s business is registered to in Connecticut, court records show.

In 2011, Hyde was arrested by Avon Police for reckless endangerment after his landscaping company’s work resulted in a tree falling on power lines.


https://www.ctinsider.com/politics/ctpost/article/CT-congressional-candidate-in-Trump-s-inner-14852723.php

Dennis Donovan

(18,770 posts)
18. Great question - was he used as a "front" donor (the $$$ was in his name to mask true donor?)
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:15 PM
Jan 2020

Or, maybe landscaping's a better gig than I thought?

Jirel

(1,993 posts)
29. He opened a DC consulting business in 2018.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:28 PM
Jan 2020

That’s Rethug-speak for “send me your money, and dirty deeds done not so cheap.”

muriel_volestrangler

(101,154 posts)
21. Sounds like he neglected his old business to give money to Trump to get contacts
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:30 PM
Jan 2020

That article was written before his work on surveillance of an American ambassador came to light, of course. But it mentions his "special operations training", and his own website talks of work on a "security detail" in Iraq. So he will have met many mercenaries there, who could do the surveillance in Ukraine, or have contacts who could.

And other articles note he's $2,000 behind in child support payments. He's the kind of guy for whom sucking up to Donald Trump, and talking of action against US ambasadors, is more important than his own kid.

canetoad

(17,088 posts)
15. Good post
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:10 PM
Jan 2020

On yesterday's Rachel Maddow show she suggested that Hyde may be a 'fabulist', ie was pretending to be able to engage assassins just to big-note himself.

And...a belated welcome to DU.

 

greenjar_01

(6,477 posts)
17. Whether he actually did it is important
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:15 PM
Jan 2020

The rush to say he's just a crazy person is certainly interesting, as is the rush to say he was involved in some manner of assassination plot. Both seem equally unfounded at this point, though the purveyors of the first are quickest to wrap themselves in "seriousness" and "reasonableness."

mopinko

(69,806 posts)
20. 9 days is a long time. you are lucky to get someone 72 hours involuntarily.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:27 PM
Jan 2020

i suppose having the ss drag you in adds to the likelihood that you are gonna get that 3 days at the least. but 9 is an odd number. likely he agreed to the standard 30 day offered if your 72 hours doesnt go well, but he checked himself out.
wonder what he did next.

Warpy

(110,909 posts)
23. We called it "pink papered" back in New England and it was only a 72 hour hold.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:56 PM
Jan 2020

After that, the person had to be let go or turned over to the cops to face charges.

72 hours isn't enough for a complete evaluation, let alone stabilizing someone on medication.

They'd have had to talk him into 9 days of treatment and allowing the drugs to kick in, at least a little.

 

Perseus

(4,341 posts)
22. Good points. My take on all this, which I find most important and I posted a blog on it
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 03:34 PM
Jan 2020

is one where we can use Lindsey Graham as an example. For some time we have been wondering what happened to Graham who had been such a critic of the con for so long, he said truths about the filthy character of the con and his family, and he was very aggressive about it too, but then one day he went out to play golf with the creature, and at the end of the round he had become a changed living thing, he went from a senator, friend of John McCain who seem to detest the creature but now he had become a lapdog, and has been the best lapdog the creature could have found in the Senate.

I believe that Graham, like many other GOP members have been threatened, not only them personally, but their families. trump and Putin work like the mafia, they don't believe in inviting someone to play golf to discuss the issues and try to convince the other person why they should come to their side of the issues, they go for the sure thing, you are with us or you and your family will have a lot of trouble, and that ladies and gentleman will convince a lot of people right after hole #1, right after you hit your drive, then you play the other 17 holes like a lapdog.

I believe many GOP members and their families have been threatened, there may some kompromat, but I believe more now after Lev Pernas information that "forza bruta" which the "cosa nostra" has used so effectively for so many years is the modus operandis of these crooks, and that is what I have concluded from last night's information.

I believe this is more sinister than just a few GOP members turning their heads the other way. Many of those republican politicians are very intelligent people, they know trump is a crook and a criminal, but they have been threatened and they know the threat is not an empty one.

 

Perseus

(4,341 posts)
32. That is a very good point, so many of them flipped very fast
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:04 PM
Jan 2020

And I can understand someone being threatened changing very quick.

Texin

(2,585 posts)
24. "... Team Rudy kept him on the team"
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:13 PM
Jan 2020

And ask yourselves why that was. Rudy likely brought him into his "circle" knowing he was an on-again-off-again psychotic, but hey, he was a big donor and one of tRump's staunchest acolytes. So a very useful idiot, and one who is unstable enough to take the ball and run with it -- even it meant obtaining a Ukrainian hitman to take out Yovanovitch, probably because they believed they could create an argument for plausible deniability insofar as ordering him to get that done. Now, I am not saying that I actually think they gave him an order to try to "go shopping". I'm just saying he is the type of person who acts as a rogue agent, and for the likes of the Potomac mob, those kinds of people are frequently useful - before they become unuseful and inconvenient.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,280 posts)
27. Both things could be true.
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:26 PM
Jan 2020

He could have been both barking mad and working with Parnas and Giuliani to stalk and maybe do something else to Yovanovich.

MaryMagdaline

(6,849 posts)
28. K&R
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:26 PM
Jan 2020

Our entire State Department, defense, public servants are exposed to the lunacy which is running through this administration, starting from the top

magicarpet

(13,941 posts)
30. Nixon/Lee Atwater normalized the act of open racism/bible thumping...
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 04:42 PM
Jan 2020

trDump/Giuliani normalized the act of open assassination/murder.

The new next low by the Mafia Thug The Donald.

onenote

(42,377 posts)
36. Hyde was never "backed" by the republican party for the 5th District Seat
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 06:42 PM
Jan 2020

The party's preferred candidate is David Sullivan, a former federal prosecutor who has shown himself to be the only one of the four or five republicans competing to be the party's nominee who can raise any money (although he's massively behind the Democratic incumbent in that regard).

But you're absolutely right about Team Rudy.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
37. Do we know he was NOT being targeted?
Wed Jan 15, 2020, 07:47 PM
Jan 2020

His other behavior seems sociopathic but not psychotic. Factors such as stress and substance abuse (and maybe working with criminals) can bring about temporary psychotic breaks.

Considering he knew a lot about the Yovanovich plot, it’s not inconceivable that he was targeted for realz because mob.

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