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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsUp to a year in jail for stealing a Trump banner? My daughter has legal issues.
I posted about this in August, 2020.
My 19 year old daughter was driving with my wife in a very conservative county of Illinois. She sees this lawn that's all filled with Trump and Blue Lives Matter signs. My impetuous daughter jumps out and grabs a Trump banner, gets back in the car, and runs off.
I then get woken from a nap by the McHenry County police saying that my car was used in a crime. I say, that's the car that my wife drives that car but she would never do that. Maybe my daughter? The police lady asks for my daughter's number and says that if the banner is returned, there will be no charges. I stupidly provide her number.
The police lady called my daughter three times, and my daughter hung up on her three times. My daughter has already burned the banner. I told my daughter to call the policewoman or knock on the owner's door and apologize and ask what can be done to not press charges. She ignores me.
In the weeks ahead, we got all kinds of solicitations from law firms - some with a case number, but none from McHenry County. We just ignore all the non-official mail.
Flash forward to January, my daughter calls 9-1-1 for a distressed woman at a gas station whose boyfriend is abusing her. When the police take my daughter's witness statement, they run her name. Suddenly, my daughter's in handcuffs for missing a court appearance. They let her go on a "no-bond release" with a court date in McHenry County. The policeman tells my daughter that she'll probably get a $300 fine.
When my daughter goes by herself to court, 2/1/21, the judge asks her if she wants to defend herself, get a lawyer, or be given a public defender. The judge tells my daughter that she's facing a "class A misdemeanor" with a penalty of up to a year in jail. The judge gives my daughter a continuance to decide. Next date is on 3/5/21.
This is a really conservative county, and I'm worried that if my daughter gets a public defender, that a MAGA judge could still give her jail time or an onerous fine. I can't afford a lawyer.
Would a GoFundMe be successful? I don't want to grift good-hearted people. What do you do when you get more than you need from a GoFundMe? I imagine you can set a limit. I'm imagining $3000 for a good lawyer. IDK.
I don't know what to do. If anyone wants to tell me how stupid I was to give the police my daughter's #, I'll save you time. I was stupid!
OY VE!!!!
BeerBarrelPolka
(1,202 posts)DU mail sent.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)marble falls
(56,353 posts)Kali
(54,990 posts)in general the law isn't one of them. I would get an attorney.
Hela
(436 posts)Your daughter's attitude in all court-related communications will go a long way to eliminating any sentencing risks. She sounds defiant. No matter what else she thinks about the people she took that flag from, she stole and destroyed personal property. She needs to appear to be sorry for it and willing to make restitution. And not just mouthing the words. Judges can see through that shit.
As a formerly stupid 19-year-old, and the parent of two twenty-somethings, I understand acting emotionally and thoughtlessly. But if she lets it, this could affect the rest of her life. Whether she is truly sorry or not, she has got to act like she is. Hanging up on the police three times can still be framed as being scared of consequences because she let her emotions get the best of her behavior. If she appears defiant and angry in court, any judge (conservative or not) is going to give her a bigger fine/longer sentence.
Tell her she's got to suck it up and win an Oscar for this court appearance. She absolutely does not want any jail time on her score card.
As far as lawyers go, call around or google "McHenry County misdemeanor lawyer." Many will give you a free consultation. At this point, it's still a simple misdemeanor. Her performance will determine how much farther it goes.
*I don't even play one on TV!
Sounds like shes going to learn a lesson.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)She is very defiant, but she is a good actress. She feels like Trump was an incarnation of Hitler and the other fascists of history and anything done to thwart him - even illegal - is justified.
Ms. Toad
(33,915 posts)And I am a lawyer.
Mariana
(14,847 posts)Beakybird
(3,329 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)And I hope your daughter is not blaming any of this on you.
She needs to take responsibility for her own actions.
Ill bet, especially in these Covid times, that she wont do any time. Probably a speech and a fine.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)cwydro
(51,308 posts)You did nothing wrong. Damn, her mom shouldnt have let her back in the car until she put the banner back. My mother would have had a fit if Id tried something like that.
Youre a good parent obviously, but Id let the two of them handle the consequences.
Just my opinion, but you did nothing wrong at all.
MineralMan
(146,189 posts)over this. I'd think a public defender could handle this just fine. There might be a fine, but if she pleads youthful ignorance, that might be reduced as well.
What she should not do, regardless of her lawyer, is present any kind of attitude in court. Instead, she should apologize sincerely. show contrition, and blame it on her youthful ignorance of such things.
She also needs to show up for the hearing, on time, and dressed nicely. She should say, "Yes, your honor" and "No, your honor" but not try to make any excuses - just apologies.
She won't go to jail.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)Exactly.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)Apparently, your county is modeled on North Korea.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)In every county in the United States. And should be.
The OP's daughter is not Otto Warmbier. His red county is not North Korea.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Beakybird
(3,329 posts)iscooterliberally
(2,849 posts)I had all sorts of problems with my kids when they were in high school and just after. Find a good criminal defense lawyer that works in the courthouse and knows the judge you'll be dealing with. Even it if costs $3000 to $5000 to get that lawyer, do it. Raise the money however you can. I know it's hard. I had to write a $4K check to a lawyer when my son got arrested in high school. He got caught selling a nickel bag of cannabis to one of his friends. It turns out the cops in our neighborhood were preying on high school kids. They were beating them up and stealing their money. Then they would get them to buy and sell weed to other kids and go raid their houses too. It was horrible. I was so mad at my son for what he did, but I had to get the best possible outcome so it wouldn't ruin the rest of his life. What's done is done, but now you have to do what's best for your daughter.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)iscooterliberally
(2,849 posts)I used a public defender once and it was a disaster. But hey, you do you.
obamanut2012
(25,905 posts)PDs are quite often a private attorney, who volunteer their time to help folks. When they aren't, they are folks dedicated to Public Law and fighting for justice. They are incredibly overworked, with salaries as low as 35-40K, and they fight the good fight. Hillary Clinton was one of the former.
We have some folks on DU who are PDs. I bet they are psyched you're telling them they aren't a real criminal defense attorney, but some kind of weird fake one who sucks at the law.
"But hey, you do you." -- what does that even mean? Is that some kind of edgelord insult that isn't an insult? Is "me doing me" mean that if I break the law I should get a PD or not? Please explain, so I know whether or not you are making a joke, so I should laugh, or you are "burning" me, so I should feel mocked and sad and ashamed.
MineralMan
(146,189 posts)Ms. Toad
(33,915 posts)That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with hiring private counsel - but there are very fine attorneys who are public defenders, just as there are private attorneys who are just putting their time in to make a buck.
Many public defenders are strong democrats with a heavy interest in civil rights who do that work because they are acutely aware that the deck is stacked against defendants (particularly against black and brown defendants and those who cannot afford private counsel) and who have chosen to do this work (generally) at lower pay, with fewer resources, and people who scoff at them as not real attorneys.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)be a good local one with a good relationship with the court. And that this is settled by professionals before being spread around in local social and/or other media.
We also live in a very conservative county where getting on the wrong side of the authorities, even as minor as this -- and notably even if innocent, is almost a guaranteed bad losing position.
The plus side is that it's a valuable learning experience. Like our 16-year-old daughter rolling her new car on a slippery on-ramp and walking away.
WA-03 Democrat
(3,017 posts)Find an attorney that knows everyone that works in that court. If they know each other things will go smooth. Getting a high priced lawyer who has never tried a case there would be a mistake. I have done it -huge mistake. The Google search of your courthouse and attorneys is a good idea.
No Trump flag is worth jail time but it is sealing property. Someone who truly regrets this mistake and respects the judicial system will not see jail time. Community service and probation only. Have her practice in front of the mirror. Dress conservatively, be on time and answer all questions as shortly as possible. Humbly asking for mercy is the name of this role.
Other people are correct about the snowball effect. She is now really in the system and she needs to get it resolved.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)WA-03 Democrat
(3,017 posts)and that you are sorry that this matter was not attended to sooner. Judges remember folks who dont show. Also, tell your daughter not to lie. There are ways to explain things in a more gentle manner but own the bad facts so the judge doesnt think your blowing smoke. A competent attorney can get you out of a lot. Lying is not one of them.
Best of luck and with the right guy or gal representing your daughter this may very well be worked out before the court date.
sir pball
(4,726 posts)Notices of appearance aren't just dropped in the mail, they're either sent certified or outright served by the court - either way there's definitely a paper trail that makes "I never got the letter" a hard sell. Should probably ask the court what address they were trying to contact, it would do well to make sure that any future notices or communications are sent to the right address and properly recieved.
scarletlib
(3,400 posts)sir pball
(4,726 posts)I might consider the public defender for this case, but if not, as others have said, absolutely get a local guy who deals with the court on the regular. Honestly for an small-beans open-and-shut (assuming your daughter will plead guilty) case, it probably won't even be that pricey.
In my wayward youth I had...more than one but less than ten misdemeanors that had a theoretical penalty of a year in jail, but nobody ever even mentioned the thought of locking me up. The worst I ever got was a hundred hours' community service, and that was only because the judge explicitly said he was convinced we were responsible for more serious incidents that had been happening in the area but (obviously) had no evidence. I don't doubt the arresting officer was probably in the ballpark with a few hundred dollar fine.
Oh, and tell your daughter to suck it up and be nice, do exactly as she's told by the Court. I like a rebellious streak, but hanging up on cops and ignoring court appearances is a REALLY bad idea, doubly so when you're actually guilty.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)So we're going to lawyer up. Probably do a GoFundMe to raise 2-3k hopefully.
sir pball
(4,726 posts)I'd expect the Trumper "victim" to press for jail time, but even in the deepest red parts, a judge will laugh that out of court. My educated guess would be restitution, so like $20, a small fine, and probably 10-15 hours service.
Don't overspend on a lawyer - you're being rattled by the prosecutor, as is their intention...a $750 local guy is gonna get you the same result as a $3500 bigshot defender seeing as how there's no factual defense here.
mackdaddy
(1,520 posts)If you get your own good lawyer you can at least minimize further legal damage.
If all goes well you can put this behind your family fairly quickly. If you get a not-so good lawyer and you either get a Trumper type judge, or just piss him off, they can rain down the maximum on daughter AND your wife. See "get away driver".
And also, Do NOT talk to the cops without an attorney! You basically confessed to everything, and they may not have been able to bring charges at all otherwise. Sorry.
This video has been around for a few years, but still important.
PS I don't even play a lawyer on the intertubes, but I have been there with friends and family through the courts a few times.
Beakybird
(3,329 posts)whistler162
(11,155 posts)a good local lawyer and also a nerf bat or water spray bottle for the next time she pulls a dumb stunt.