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Thu Nov 25, 2021, 11:37 PM

Was Kyle's shooting self defense?

No, not that Kyle. This Kyle:
Kyle Carruth attorney makes case for self-defense after deadly shooting of Chad Read

LUBBOCK, Texas — The attorney for William “Kyle” Carruth made a statement Wednesday in response to the release of video of a November 5 deadly shooting.

Carruth was named in family court records as the man who shot and killed Chad Read, 54, in the 2100 block of 90th Street. Police have not filed charges nor have police said publicly if investigators believe the shooting was self-defense.

The video was released by the attorney for Read’s widow, Matthew L. Harris. It depicts the confrontation between Read and Carruth in the moments before the shooting. In the video, Carruth told Read to leave. Carruth steps out momentarily to get a gun while Read had heated words with a woman identified in family court records as Read’s ex-wife.

More: https://www.everythinglubbock.com/news/local-news/kyle-carruth-attorney-makes-case-for-self-defense-after-deadly-shooting-of-chad-read/

There's video of the incident out there, so be forewarned. It does show the shooting. (And bizarrely shows everyone just being nonchalant, for some reason. This case seems to have some small town weirdness to it.

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Arrow 10 replies Author Time Post
Reply Was Kyle's shooting self defense? (Original post)
Dr. Strange Nov 25 OP
Lucid Dreamer Nov 26 #1
Igel Nov 26 #2
Kaleva Nov 26 #5
Woodswalker Nov 26 #3
dchill Nov 26 #4
Kaleva Nov 26 #6
LiberatedUSA Nov 26 #7
Lurker Deluxe Nov 26 #8
Dr. Strange Nov 26 #9
KY_EnviroGuy Nov 26 #10

Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 01:22 AM

1. The 17 second vid was not definitive enough for me to make a decision.

The 17 second vid was not definitive enough for me to make a decision.

Even playing it 1 frame at a time it was pretty useless.
I'll wait for more evidence to make the call on justified self defense.

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Response to Lucid Dreamer (Reply #1)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 02:07 AM

2. More video.

https://www.everythinglubbock.com/news/local-news/wife-of-chad-read-releases-video-of-deadly-shooting-ssj/

Custody conflict, apparently the father showed up at the time he thought he'd get his son but ... son wasn't there? wasn't ready? was told to come back later?

People on DU have said that various and sundry should have fired a warning shot. This guy did. And it didn't matter.

Whether it's legally self-defense will depend on the details of TX law. Was it really that guy's property? Was he reasonably in fear?

Personally, they looked like a couple of stags facing off during mating season.

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Response to Igel (Reply #2)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 03:48 AM

5. Firing a warning shot can land one in jail here in MI.

"Investigators say the suspect claimed he was firing warning shots because he thought the troopers were someone “scoping out” the area.

The suspect was taken to the Genesee County Jail on charges of felonious assault and reckless use of a firearm. He was not identified because he hadn’t been arraigned in court on the charges as of Wednesday afternoon."

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/thetford-township-man-accused-of-firing-warning-shots-at-michigan-state-police/ar-BB1googj

"Although the firing of a warning shot is not per se legally forbidden, one should be aware that if they fire a warning shot, it is highly likely that their conduct will be judged under the legal standard that they have used deadly force and not just mere force.

This means that a person may only be allowed the legal argument of justification if a warning shot is fired in situations in which deadly force is justified under the Michigan Self-Defense Act....

Every gun owner should be aware that one likely argument a prosecutor may put forth against a defendant at trial is that the simple discharge of a firearm is an assault, because it puts a person in reasonable fear of a battery, and the person firing the shot clearly had the ability to follow through on the threat.

Additionally, a prosecutor may argue that this action can cause death or serious bodily injury. Such an argument, if successful, will shift the analysis of warning shots into the use of deadly force arena and whether a person intended that action or not."

https://www.baronedefensefirm.com/gun-laws-on-warning-shots.html

Your comment:

"People on DU have said that various and sundry should have fired a warning shot. "

I haven't seen such posts but it's really bad advice.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 02:17 AM

3. This is how things

Go in a society that's armed. Every case is unique. Many shootings are justified. Without firearms the physically stronger individual would rule every situation. On the other hand you have Kyle Rittenhouse and we all know how that went. It just seems in European societies where people aren't armed to the extent that we are there's also less of the physical in your face confrontation that this man displayed. American machismo I guess. Women display it now too.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 02:59 AM

4. Two real smart guys. Now one is dead. One real smart guy.

Too many guns, too many Kyles.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 04:08 AM

6. In the 2nd video, I see two guys trying to prove who has the bigger dick.

The guy with the gun ended up winning the argument.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 05:38 AM

7. I think I it was a set up.

They were so calm and collected after killing him, the way she moved back and was ready for filming like she new something was going to happen as soon as he went in side. They knew he was coming for his court appointed visit.

It is all very suspicious. It is Texas, so he might get away with it, but the man wasn’t posing a deadly threat until Kyle aggravated the situation. I think it is a bad shoot, but it is Texas. I don’t know how this is going to go.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 07:00 AM

8. I would say no

The physical confrontation is what it is and obviously the man was "afraid". If the physical conflict escalated and the man pulled a concealed and shot him the "self defense" could possibly work.

However.

The man retreated from the physical confrontation and went inside and armed himself and came back and reengaged in the confrontation.

Had he went inside. armed himself and stayed inside:

Told his wife (or whatever she it) to come inside and the man prevented her from doing so and physically assaulted her, or the other party attempted to forcefully enter the house, he could "defend".

I would say this is not self defense.

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Response to Lurker Deluxe (Reply #8)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 02:08 PM

9. Agreed.

Had he went inside. armed himself and stayed inside:

Told his wife (or whatever she it) to come inside and the man prevented her from doing so and physically assaulted her, or the other party attempted to forcefully enter the house, he could "defend".

I would say this is not self defense.

I think if the deceased had in fact been there to pick up his kid at a court-ordered time and location, then it becomes even more clear. I'll be interested to see the full facts come out.

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Response to Dr. Strange (Original post)

Fri Nov 26, 2021, 02:27 PM

10. Not appropriate for me to make that judgment call.

I'm not an on the scene skilled police detective with access to witness and evidence, so it would be pure soap opera for me to even guess.

KY......

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