Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

alwaysinasnit

(5,037 posts)
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 07:48 PM Sep 2022

Far-right website Kiwi Farms offline after Cloudflare drops them following public backlash

https://www.rawstory.com/cloudflare-drops-controversial-far-right-website-kiwi-farms-after-public-backlash-site-is-down-report/

Growing public backlash against the Kiwi Farms website has resulted in the website losing a key technological vendor and going offline.

"Reversing course under growing public pressure, major tech security company Cloudflare announced Saturday that it will stop protecting the Kiwi Farms website, best known as a place for stalkers to organize hacks, online campaigns and real-world harassment," The Washington Post reported. "Cloudfare chief executive Matthew Prince, who this past week published a lengthy blog post justifying the company’s services defending Kiwi Farms, told The Washington Post he changed his mind not because of the pressure but a surge in credible violent threats stemming from the site."

Prince issued a statement explaining the action the company finally took.

"We have blocked Kiwifarms. Visitors to any of the Kiwifarms sites that use any of Cloudflare's services will see a Cloudflare block page and a link to this post. Kiwifarms may move their sites to other providers and, in doing so, come back online, but we have taken steps to block their content from being accessed through our infrastructure," Prince said. "This is an extraordinary decision for us to make and, given Cloudflare's role as an Internet infrastructure provider, a dangerous one that we are not comfortable with. However, the rhetoric on the Kiwifarms site and specific, targeted threats have escalated over the last 48 hours to the point that we believe there is an unprecedented emergency and immediate threat to human life unlike we have previously seen from Kiwifarms or any other customer before."

snip...
41 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Far-right website Kiwi Farms offline after Cloudflare drops them following public backlash (Original Post) alwaysinasnit Sep 2022 OP
Here's the original WaPo story. Eugene Sep 2022 #1
Thanks! alwaysinasnit Sep 2022 #3
+10 nt reACTIONary Sep 2022 #18
Good fuck that place vercetti2021 Sep 2022 #2
That's sounds horrible. Nt underpants Sep 2022 #4
i only read about this yesterday when the media exposed them Takket Sep 2022 #5
Eye-opening thread as to how depraved KiwiFarms is Roland99 Sep 2022 #6
+1. A must read. dalton99a Sep 2022 #9
Yikes! hlthe2b Sep 2022 #40
Ben knows too. czarjak Sep 2022 #15
Wow. It might hurry things up if they went after FBI agents. Hortensis Sep 2022 #7
Wow. It might hurry things up if they went after FBI agents. Hortensis Sep 2022 #8
These terrorists are actively trying to kill people. dalton99a Sep 2022 #10
Right on both counts IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #21
"... he changed his mind not because of the pressure ...." area51 Sep 2022 #11
+1 crickets Sep 2022 #14
I'm going to give this guy the benefit of the doubt stopdiggin Sep 2022 #16
Doxxing someone is not "free speech" IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #20
so I'm to assume you disagree? stopdiggin Sep 2022 #23
So I assume you agree? IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #26
A number of things that you itemize stopdiggin Sep 2022 #27
So you want to call me out for "constrained views of free speech"? IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #28
I am sorry that you are angry. stopdiggin Sep 2022 #31
I don't believe you're sorry IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #32
Nah, we all know you aren't sorry about how Ingrid is feeling obamanut2012 Sep 2022 #39
Doxing gets people killed vercetti2021 Sep 2022 #29
then make it illegal. move the standard. stopdiggin Sep 2022 #30
It is illegal IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #33
Ok I get it vercetti2021 Sep 2022 #35
I think they've made it clear they don't care IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #34
Another person ignored vercetti2021 Sep 2022 #36
So doxing online right wing hate mongers is wrong? Zeitghost Sep 2022 #38
When you get Empty Greene joining #DropKiwifarms, you f***ed up. Eugene Sep 2022 #12
Cowardly that it took this long. crickets Sep 2022 #13
Sometimes it comes down to "what would my grandkids say?" RainCaster Sep 2022 #17
And they already have new servers... In Russia IngridsLittleAngel Sep 2022 #19
I hope the FBI is busy tracking these terrorists. Hermit-The-Prog Sep 2022 #22
Probably half the followers are FBI agents watching their leftyladyfrommo Sep 2022 #25
Is it possible that social media people are beginning to leftyladyfrommo Sep 2022 #24
Back from the dead??? ultralite001 Sep 2022 #37
the future is now GusBob Sep 2022 #41

Eugene

(61,592 posts)
1. Here's the original WaPo story.
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 07:54 PM
Sep 2022
Under pressure, security firm Cloudflare drops Kiwi Farms website (Washington Post)

Cloudfare chief executive Matthew Prince, who this past week published a lengthy blog post justifying the company’s services defending Kiwi Farms, told The Washington Post he changed his mind not because of the pressure but a surge in credible violent threats stemming from the site.

“As Kiwi Farms has felt more threatened, they have reacted by being more threatening,” Prince said. “We think there is an imminent danger, and the pace at which law enforcement is able to respond to those threats we don’t think is fast enough to keep up.”


https://wapo.st/3TJll0A

Original WaPo link: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/09/03/cloudflare-drops-kiwifarms/

vercetti2021

(10,150 posts)
2. Good fuck that place
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 07:56 PM
Sep 2022

All the users there actually gotten others to commit suicide and are actively stalking a transgender woman. Bunch of no life fuck sticks need to go touch grass

Takket

(21,421 posts)
5. i only read about this yesterday when the media exposed them
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 08:12 PM
Sep 2022

it is unconscionable that these people were allowed to go on for as long as they have been. they are literally driving people to suicide and terrorizing others. they should be hunted down and imprisoned.

oh and BY THE WAY: This is exactly the fucking shit Biden was talking about in his speech!!!!!!!!!! MAGA rethugs terrorizing people just going about their lives. How the media can clutch their pearls at what he said instead of doing the VERY SMALL amount of journalism it takes to draw a line from his speech to SHIT LIKE THIS, is mind blowing.

Roland99

(53,342 posts)
6. Eye-opening thread as to how depraved KiwiFarms is
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 08:13 PM
Sep 2022


I've been covering bad parts of the internet for long time now.

For years, there was one site extremist researchers warned me not to cover because publicizing it would be dangerous.

But it's time people know KiwiFarms—and how they're chasing political enemies around the world.




Unrolled
https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1565797220531814406.html

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
7. Wow. It might hurry things up if they went after FBI agents.
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 08:40 PM
Sep 2022

No doubt laws have to be passed to allow/enable effective pursuit of these terrorists.

Don't know what's been done so far, but the surge in DVE, domestic violent extremism (as opposed to foreign) and domestic terrorism, has caused a need for amended laws that will facilitate rather than block effectively addressing it. One guess who's been most involved in preventing those laws in the past -- DVEs are overwhelmingly RW.


In any case, these Kiwifarms gangs are RW terrorists with terrorist goals. I hope operating overseas was a mistake.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
8. Wow. It might hurry things up if they went after FBI agents.
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 08:40 PM
Sep 2022

Guessing laws have to be passed, and staffs and procedures further developed, to allow/enable effective pursuit of these terrorists.

Don't know what's been done so far, but the surge in DVE, domestic violent extremism and terrorism (as opposed to foreign), has exacerbated a need for changing laws to will facilitate rather than block effectively addressing it. One guess who's been most involved in preventing those laws in the past -- DVEs are overwhelmingly RW.

In any case, these Kiwifarms gangs are RW terrorists with terrorist goals. Wouldn't it be nice if operating overseas was a mistake?

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
21. Right on both counts
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 05:09 AM
Sep 2022

They're trying to kill people.

They're terrorists.

And it's well past the time for the DOJ to treat them as such.

crickets

(25,896 posts)
14. +1
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 09:30 PM
Sep 2022

It was a business decision weighing the cost of dropping them with the cost of the blowback. Blowback finally won. It will be interesting to see if Kiwi Farms stays gone.

stopdiggin

(11,089 posts)
16. I'm going to give this guy the benefit of the doubt
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 09:48 PM
Sep 2022

I don't necessarily agree with his position - but after reading both of the public statements (before and after) - I'm leading toward someone who had a principled position, and then changed it in the face of either greater evidence, or understanding. And, granted - his original position on 'free speech', 'public platform' issues might have been far more libertarian than a lot of us are comfortable with (particularly in this day and age).

But I don't think (IMO) this was a bottom line, profit/loss business decision.

----- ------

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
20. Doxxing someone is not "free speech"
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 05:07 AM
Sep 2022

Nor is harassment. Nor are death threats. Nor is encouraging someone to kill themselves.

There was no "principled decision", because Cloudflare's spineless CEO clearly has no principles. They should've taken action before it reached this point.

I'm not giving Cloudflare a single thing besides both middle fingers.

stopdiggin

(11,089 posts)
23. so I'm to assume you disagree?
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 10:13 AM
Sep 2022

----- -----

You're not alone. But I'll point out that your post reveals that you harbor a rather constrained view of free speech. Again, not alone - but (to me) a rather troubling, and prevalent, trend among the left, and right.

"Doxing someone is not free speech." ? Okkkkkay.

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
26. So I assume you agree?
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 02:15 PM
Sep 2022

Are you serious? Are you freaking serious?

So doxxing people, swatting people, stalking people, encouraging them to commit suicide, and making plans to set off bombs in restaurants is just fine? Just good ol' freedom of speech? And some of us speaking out against such criminal speech have a "constrained view of free speech"?

Again: Are you serious?

You know what happens if I go and start posting threats like these Kiwi Farms psychos? I wind up with people in dark suits and shiny badges at my door. But, okay. Fine. Cool. Let's just protect their "free speech", especially since it's just "the others" being terrorized by this community.

I'm glad my views are troubling. Far more troubling than the threats toward people like myself. But maybe if we just all went away, it'd be all better...

"In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our 'friends'." - Martin Luther King Jr.

stopdiggin

(11,089 posts)
27. A number of things that you itemize
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 05:35 PM
Sep 2022

are quite clearly crimes (and thus by definition ..). But you also rather prove my point by including some things (doxing) that are not criminal at all. Do I approve of the practice? I do not. But, by most legal accounting, reprehensible speech, ugly speech, even inflammatory speech (to some degree) - still enjoys protection under free speech. Are there places where lines could and should be draw? Clearly. But just because I find something troubling, reprehensible, or even (to my mind) potentially dangerous - does not draw that line.

So, in answer to your question - yes, I am serious. Quite.

And, if you'll read back through my posts - you'll find that nowhere in them will you find a defense of the content on Kiwi Farms. My comment was on the motivations and motives of CloudFare CEO Prince (and even pointed out that his positions might differ from mine).

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
28. So you want to call me out for "constrained views of free speech"?
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 06:28 PM
Sep 2022

"Kiwi Farms launched in 2013 and quickly grew into a popular internet forum for online harassment campaigns. At least three suicides have been tied to harassment stemming from the Kiwi Farms community, and many on the forum consider their goal to drive their targets to suicide. Members of the LGBTQ community and women are frequent targets."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/09/03/cloudflare-drops-kiwifarms/

Three suicides... CEO Prince chose profits and protecting criminals over at least three lives.

Here's a tweet from two days ago. By my count, we're now up to at least four swattings, and a bomb threat - the very bomb threat that caused Prince to grow a set and finally do something.



But, thank goodness there are no crimes going on here. No. Because it sure feels like the only "crime" here is me with my "constrained views of free speech"...


Oh. Wait. Wait... What was that fourth charge listed? I'd also like to add that doxxing is a crime in California (Penal Code 653.2). And (PC 646.9) covers direct cyber harassment. Now, I sure can't quote the laws in every state and every country, but there certainly are states and country where harassment and doxxing are crimes.

Yet you want to criticize... me? Not Prince. Not Cloudflare. Not KF. ME. I get the finger pointed at me about "constrained views of free speech" like I'm a fascist bitch or something. Not KF who has caused at least three deaths and want to cause a lot more. Not Cloudflare for turning a blind fucking eye on years of this shit until it reached the point of "Just rang up a couple of lads and asked them to plant bombs..."

Your responses, and the way you've spoken to me, have sure given me the impression that you are more concerned about "free speech" than people's safety and lives. These people are threatening the lives of people like me, and I have to hear about "constrained views of free speech"? How about my goddamned right - and the rights of others like me - to not fucking have our lives threatened?!

The threats made by KF and LibsOfTikTok are as much "free speech" as yelling fire in a crowded room when there is no fire. They have gotten people killed, and are going to get more killed unless someone stops this. I'm sorry if there is "free speech" that needs to be "constrained" in the name of not getting people killed.

If you're troubled by what these cyberterrorists have done, you've done a poor job of expressing it. Because it sure feels like you think I'm the problem here.

And if you think I'm angry... Yeah. I am. Angry at what the hell Cloudflare allowed to happen. Angry at these waste of genetic material who have devoted their lives to ruining other people's. And, frankly, pretty upset at the things you've said to me in this thread.

stopdiggin

(11,089 posts)
31. I am sorry that you are angry.
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 08:48 PM
Sep 2022

And particularly sorry that some of that anger is directed this way. At the same - yes, it's quite clear in our discussion that you do have a more restricted (constrained) view of free speech than I do. It seems we must leave it at that.

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
32. I don't believe you're sorry
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 09:01 PM
Sep 2022

I also have a very deep objection to you believing free speech is more important than the lives of trans people who are facing very real threats of violence and death.

Maybe you ought to try checking two things: Reality, and your privilege.

obamanut2012

(25,905 posts)
39. Nah, we all know you aren't sorry about how Ingrid is feeling
Wed Sep 7, 2022, 11:40 AM
Sep 2022

And no, she doesn't have a "constrained view of free speech." That's YOUR belief, not hers.

And, her view of this is correct, and yours is sadly, sadly and distressingly wrong.

And, I am not engaging with you after this post.

Go with God, my child.

vercetti2021

(10,150 posts)
29. Doxing gets people killed
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 08:32 PM
Sep 2022

We already have enough shit to deal with in our community and this is terrorism plain as day. Fuck their free speech when it actively stalk a trans woman. They are trying to get her killed.

stopdiggin

(11,089 posts)
30. then make it illegal. move the standard.
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 08:39 PM
Sep 2022

we have done so with things such as stalking. But currently it is not, and by the same light it is not restricted speech.

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
33. It is illegal
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 09:09 PM
Sep 2022

But it's becoming more and more apparent where you stand on this. How much longer until you tell us Kiwi Farms and Cloudflare are the victims and Keffals is the aggressor?

vercetti2021

(10,150 posts)
35. Ok I get it
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 10:50 PM
Sep 2022

You're fine with us being stalked and killed because of free "hate" speech thanks for playing

 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
34. I think they've made it clear they don't care
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 09:10 PM
Sep 2022

Either their beloved "free speech" is more important than our lives, or our lives just plain don't matter.

Wonder if they'd be digging their heels in on this hill KF was threatening them or someone in their lives? Because I get the feeling they wouldn't be so cool about it then.

crickets

(25,896 posts)
13. Cowardly that it took this long.
Sat Sep 3, 2022, 09:27 PM
Sep 2022

WaPo, no paywall: https://archive.ph/moIax

In the interview, Prince said he was uncomfortable dropping Kiwi Farms despite its content and would have preferred to have done so only in response to a court order. [snip]

In a post Wednesday, Prince and another executive had written that they saw providing basic security and caching services as infrastructure, like internet connectivity, and should not be held responsible for content without judicial proceedings. They contrasted that with website hosting, which they said should have increased responsibility and discretion.

Prince said Saturday he stands by that reasoning, and he wrote in a new post that dropping Kiwi Farms was a “dangerous” decision. He added in the interview that it might provoke forum users to escalate even more, and that the forum would likely reappear online with help from Cloudflare competitors.


Splitting hairs about responsibility because the company doesn't want to be bothered with content issues, then admitting it was really about the money that might go to the competition.

🙄

Disgusting.
 

IngridsLittleAngel

(1,962 posts)
19. And they already have new servers... In Russia
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 05:03 AM
Sep 2022
https://kotaku.com/kiwifarms-cloudflare-dropkiwifarms-threats-security-1849496191

Ahhh, remember the good ol' days, when that very stable genius Sarah Palin was warning us about Russia, along with saying she could see them from her own back yard? Good times...

Now, of course, MAGA loves Mother Russia, just like their "Daddy" Drumpf does.

Also, according to at least one comment from this article: The breaking point for Gutless Cloudflare was when Kiwi Farms were trying to figure out which restaurant Keffals was planning to eat it and plant bombs there. Yeah. Bombs.

So I guess bombing is too far, but doxxing and stalking and planning to kill one trans woman is okay, Cloudflare? Well, glad we now know where your line is.

Meanwhile, this is how our "American patriots" act. Stalking, doxxing, death threats and plots involving bombs. Gee, remember when everyone was so angry about Muslims and bomb threats and blowing up places? More good times... Because now, according to UltraMAGA, doing so is just fine...

President Biden's speech was long overdue. I hope everyone's listening. And by that, I mean LibsOfTikTok need to be next. And I don't mean just throw them off social media. I mean it's time for these people to wind up behind bars like the terrorists they are.

leftyladyfrommo

(18,815 posts)
25. Probably half the followers are FBI agents watching their
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 10:40 AM
Sep 2022

every move.

How dumb can you be to put dangerous rightwing shit out on social media where everyone can track it? And trace it back to you?

leftyladyfrommo

(18,815 posts)
24. Is it possible that social media people are beginning to
Mon Sep 5, 2022, 10:37 AM
Sep 2022

realize they have created a very dangerous monster and are starting to step back.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Far-right website Kiwi Fa...