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grahamhgreen

(15,741 posts)
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 01:01 PM Sep 2013

Had we expanded Medicare, we wouldn't be in this predicament, right?

Since Medicare is covered under the FICA taxes, the funds would still be available and the R's would not be able to pull this stunt.



The increasingly likely shutdown of the US government could have far-reaching effects throughout the US. If Congress fails to reach an agreement to avert a shutdown by midnight ET Monday, some services – mail delivery, Social Security and Medicare benefits – would not be affected.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/29/us-government-shutdown-services-affected


Yet another reason for Medicare for All, now, seems to me.
29 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Had we expanded Medicare, we wouldn't be in this predicament, right? (Original Post) grahamhgreen Sep 2013 OP
Not really sharp_stick Sep 2013 #1
two thumbs up for the..... madrchsod Sep 2013 #2
that's so true. they have to perform to their constituancy of knuckle draggers and " pshcho demosincebirth Sep 2013 #7
Oompa Loompa and his merry band of psycho skidmarks - perfect sarge43 Sep 2013 #13
I appreciate the effort - as we do need Medicare for all TBF Sep 2013 #3
No, they can't actually stop "Obamacare" by shutting down the government. jeff47 Sep 2013 #4
And Social Security... awoke_in_2003 Sep 2013 #5
Expanding Medicare was an easy sell in this part of the Red State South. bvar22 Sep 2013 #6
Maybe you left out the part ... frazzled Sep 2013 #9
That's the "buy-in" part.... daleanime Sep 2013 #11
If they're on the 43rd round of trying to kill this ... frazzled Sep 2013 #8
Even the red states constituents would find a way to Iliyah Sep 2013 #10
Had the Dems attempted to expand on Medicare, the whole damn thing would have failed Sheepshank Sep 2013 #12
Flame throwing event? RC Sep 2013 #19
What ev..... Sheepshank Sep 2013 #21
Well, yeah, because... RC Sep 2013 #23
sure..the op is innocent Sheepshank Sep 2013 #24
Maybe for you. RC Sep 2013 #25
Had we landed on Mars and started new colonies, we wouldn't be in this predicament, would we? Pretzel_Warrior Sep 2013 #14
Just lift the age restriction. Spitfire of ATJ Sep 2013 #15
We could be in an even worse predicament. They could use Medicare itself pnwmom Sep 2013 #16
How about attacking the Republicans for a change? SunSeeker Sep 2013 #17
Yes we would. They would block the CR to postpone the extension of Medicare. Mass Sep 2013 #18
We got what we got because of republicans. They're the ones who screwed it up B Calm Sep 2013 #20
You mean if we had had a Congress that would have passed Medicare expansion? Orsino Sep 2013 #22
Umm...we passed a Republican Program with only 1 Republican vote Hydra Sep 2013 #26
No he means that we should have sent Walter White to the grantcart Sep 2013 #27
Damn. That would have worked! Orsino Oct 2013 #29
you give the gop too much credit joshcryer Sep 2013 #28

sharp_stick

(14,400 posts)
1. Not really
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 01:03 PM
Sep 2013

the funds for the ACA are not being touched by shutting down the Government either. The pukes are linking Obamacare to the continuing resolution purely for political gain.

Obamacare starts as scheduled tomorrow no matter what the human Oompa Loompa and his merry band of psycho skidmarks decide to do.

sarge43

(28,939 posts)
13. Oompa Loompa and his merry band of psycho skidmarks - perfect
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:17 PM
Sep 2013

You're right. If not this, then something else.

OP is right, too. Single payer health care for everyone.

TBF

(31,922 posts)
3. I appreciate the effort - as we do need Medicare for all
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 01:24 PM
Sep 2013

But make no mistake .. these ridiculous lunatics that we call representatives will fight if Obama says "ketchup". In return they'd yell "mustard". They truly will fight anything he says just to be disagreeable.

jeff47

(26,549 posts)
4. No, they can't actually stop "Obamacare" by shutting down the government.
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 01:41 PM
Sep 2013

The ACA is mandatory spending. This budget battle is over discretionary spending. Even if the government is shut down, the ACA continues.

The only way they can stop the ACA is by passing new legislation to repeal it. Which isn't going to happen as long as Obama holds the "veto" stamp.

So the Republicans are trying to delay implementation until after the 2016 election, in the hopes that a Republican wins the Presidency and they can repeal it. (Karl Rove spilled the beans on O'Riley)

If you replaced the ACA with "Medicare for all" starting in the same timeframe, the same strategy could be applied. And likely would be applied for the same reasons.

bvar22

(39,909 posts)
6. Expanding Medicare was an easy sell in this part of the Red State South.
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 02:21 PM
Sep 2013

Within 5 minutes, I was able to convince even the most stubborn Conservative that it would be a good thing if everyone had the "option" to BUY Medicare.
That is because almost ALL of them had family members ON Medicare.
They weren't afraid of it.
More choices = Good for America!

...but a 2000 page Comprehensive Health Care Reform was easy to demonize (the unlearned lesson from HillaryCare) and brand as BIG Government Take Over.

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
9. Maybe you left out the part ...
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:04 PM
Sep 2013

that said their taxes would be raised? (Cause that would have to happen in order to fund a Medicare for all system; FICA would have to rise substantially).

They don't like them thar taxes, you know.

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
8. If they're on the 43rd round of trying to kill this ...
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:00 PM
Sep 2013

How do you think they would have allowed an expansion of Medicare to all Americans in the first place?

I guess what I'm saying is, the question is totally moot. It was hell to get even this compromised (but ten-thousand times better than the status quo) bill passed. There was never any way that a massive ramp up of Medicare was ever going to happen.

Plus, as others have said, the shutdown will not affect the implementation of Obamacare. So on that level, the shutdown is the same no matter which program was enacted.

Iliyah

(25,111 posts)
10. Even the red states constituents would find a way to
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:11 PM
Sep 2013

hate Medicare for all because ya'know the Kenyan in the WH suggested it.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
12. Had the Dems attempted to expand on Medicare, the whole damn thing would have failed
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:14 PM
Sep 2013

and the debt ceiling debate/REP extortion would still be happening, but under the guise of another project they don't like that is unrelated to discretionary spending.

ETA your OP is nothing more than another flame throwing event at Obama. It gets old.

 

RC

(25,592 posts)
19. Flame throwing event?
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:48 PM
Sep 2013

Why?
Responses objecting to not praising Obama, when he wasn't even mentioned get old too.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
21. What ev.....
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 04:05 PM
Sep 2013

this op has a history, and the topic of Socialized, or Universal Medicine or Medicare for all has 100% of the time degenerated into Obama's fault.

Frankly your response is quite predictable.

 

RC

(25,592 posts)
23. Well, yeah, because...
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 04:10 PM
Sep 2013

He did NOT mention or even allude to Obama. YOU brought Obama up.
Frankly, it looks like you are seeing things that do not exist in reality.

 

Sheepshank

(12,504 posts)
24. sure..the op is innocent
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 04:59 PM
Sep 2013

and the MO suddenly doesn't apply?

Maybe in your world.

eta...perhaps you could clarify for me who else should have implemented medicare for all in the OP's world? The extrapolation here isn't really all that difficult

 

RC

(25,592 posts)
25. Maybe for you.
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 05:22 PM
Sep 2013

Once guilty, always guilty every time after that? I didn't see it here. The only evidence I have is the OP you are reading things into.

 

Pretzel_Warrior

(8,361 posts)
14. Had we landed on Mars and started new colonies, we wouldn't be in this predicament, would we?
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:18 PM
Sep 2013

just as believable of a scenario as yours.

pnwmom

(108,925 posts)
16. We could be in an even worse predicament. They could use Medicare itself
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:26 PM
Sep 2013

as a hostage someday. They could refuse to lift the debt ceiling unless we either eliminated Medicare or put it on means-testing (which would greatly reduce support among the general public, and would be the beginning of the end.)

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
17. How about attacking the Republicans for a change?
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:39 PM
Sep 2013

I want Medicare for All, but we just didn't have the Dem votes for it in Congress. I support the ACA because it was the best we could get under the circumstances, and it is an important step toward single payer. The government shutdown will not shut down or defund the ACA, as others have pointed out up the thread.

Your post amounts to useless ankle biting that only serves to divide Dems at a time when we must hold strong against the Republican attacks on the ACA.

Trying doing something constructive.

Today I emailed and called (at both his DC and local office) my idiot Republican House Representative, Dana Rohrabacher. I told him that the ACA will save 45,000 American lives each year and he needs to stop trying to defund it. I told him to pass the budget and the debt ceiling increase without any conditions.

I know he won't listen to me, but my calls and emails get tallied, and if we all did this, it would be very clear the Republicans don't speak for their constituents. They won't be able to argue they speak for the American people.

I will never forget when Senator Heidi Heitkamp defended voting against the Senate gun background check bill, that 90% of Americans support, by pointing out that the calls to her office were "at least 7 to 1 against the bill."

 

B Calm

(28,762 posts)
20. We got what we got because of republicans. They're the ones who screwed it up
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 03:49 PM
Sep 2013

and then wouldn't vote for it.

Orsino

(37,428 posts)
22. You mean if we had had a Congress that would have passed Medicare expansion?
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 04:05 PM
Sep 2013

I think we'd have flying cars, too.

Hydra

(14,459 posts)
26. Umm...we passed a Republican Program with only 1 Republican vote
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 08:01 PM
Sep 2013

If you count Joe Lieberman, which I do.

http://www.healthreformvotes.org/congress/roll-call-votes/s2010-105

http://www.healthreformvotes.org/congress/roll-call-votes/h2010-165

So why couldn't we have passed a Dem Program instead? They'd be screaming about it anyway and threatening the shutdown, as evidenced by them fighting their own idea.

Oh, and look who voted against it...our WH Friend Blanche Lincoln! You know, the one Rahm Emmanuel said we were "Fucking Retards" to have primaried and whose bacon they saved?

grantcart

(53,061 posts)
27. No he means that we should have sent Walter White to the
Mon Sep 30, 2013, 08:07 PM
Sep 2013

House Republican picnic and showed them his new car.

Then immediately after the slaughter run up and have a quick vote on expanding Medicare for all.
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