WaPo Fact Checks President's Claim That States With Most Gun Laws Tend To Have Fewest Gun Deaths

Washington Post fact checkers give two Pinocchio's to President Obama's claim that states with the most gun laws tend to have the fewest gun deaths, which means the statement included "significant omissions and/or exaggerations," although the author notes he waivered between two and three Pinocchio's, with three being in the "mostly false" category. http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/10/05/obamas-claim-that-states-with-the-most-gun-laws-tend-to-have-the-fewest-gun-deaths/?tid=pm_politics_pop_b

In the article the WaPo explains that when you exclude suicides, which account for 60% of gun deaths, then there is a significant change in where a state might rank in the number of gun deaths per 100,000 people.

First, the WaPo notes that the data is "mixed" on whether stricter gun laws lead to fewer suicides:

Some might argue that it is wrong to exclude suicides from the data, as less access to guns might result in fewer suicides. The data on that is mixed. Gun-related suicides might decline, but studies have shown little connection between suicides and access to guns. A 2004 report published by the National Academy of Sciences concluded that “some gun control policies may reduce the number of gun suicides, but they have not yet been shown to reduce the overall risk of suicide in any population.”

Japan, for instance, has among the world’s most-restrictive gun-control regimes — and yet also has among the world’s highest suicide rates, almost double the U.S. suicide rate.

Second, once you exclude suicides:

Alaska, ranked 50th on the National Journal list, moved up to 25th place. Utah, 31st on the list, jumped to 8th place. Hawaii remains in 1st place, but the top six now include Vermont, New Hampshire, South Dakota, Iowa and Maine. Indeed, half of the 10 states with the lowest gun-death rates turn out to be states with less-restrictive gun laws.

Meanwhile, Maryland — a more urban state — fell from 15th place to 45th, even though it has very tough gun laws. Illinois dropped from 11th place to 38th, and New York fell from 3rd to 15th.

The WaPo concluded that:

While gun suicides are certainly a serious issue — and account for more than 60 percent of gun deaths — the evidence is mixed on whether restricting gun purchases would affect the overall suicide rate. In any case, the president’s policy proposals are aimed at mass shootings, not suicides.

In short, I, along with almost all of the people on DU, support toughening our gun laws to include UBCs and additional training. But stricter gun laws isn't the panacea it is made out to be, and in some states -- notably Maryland -- such laws have had little impact on gun violence.

22 replies, 3194 views

Thread info Bookmark this thread Trash this thread

Reply to this thread

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum

Replies to this discussion thread

22 replies	Author	Time	Post
WaPo Fact Checks President's Claim That States With Most Gun Laws Tend To Have Fewest Gun Deaths (Original post)	TeddyR	Oct 2015	OP
There will be no changes until those who wish for change	pipoman	Oct 2015	#1
Of course- because you need to just address violence- not only violence that use certain objects	Lee-Lee	Oct 2015	#2
Basically the "do nothing" because "stuff happens" approach...	Human101948	Oct 2015	#6
That's not at all what I advocated	Lee-Lee	Oct 2015	#12
Would Maryland's statistics be skewed by Baltimore?	Human101948	Oct 2015	#3
You can't cherry pick and throw out the areas that skew results in a way you don't like	Lee-Lee	Oct 2015	#5
I wasn't trying disprove, I was wondering about distribution, but your Chicago analogy is apt...	Human101948	Oct 2015	#7
It also coincides with an economic boom.	hughee99	Oct 2015	#10
Nail hit.	Whiskeytide	Oct 2015	#11
I'll second that!	Human101948	Oct 2015	#16
Exactly- when you address the causes of violence it drops	Lee-Lee	Oct 2015	#20
How can you exclude 60% of gun deaths?	mainer	Oct 2015	#4
The presence of a gun doesn't cause suicide and the absence	pipoman	Oct 2015	#8
It's context.	Whiskeytide	Oct 2015	#13
If the topic of conversation is mass shootings	hack89	Oct 2015	#18
The topic in the OP title is "Gun deaths." Not mass shootings.	mainer	Oct 2015	#19
The OP is about Obama's comments which were directed at mass shootings	hack89	Oct 2015	#21
There are multiple layers and solutions must come from all angles. No good data because NRA	Justice	Oct 2015	#9
It's also interesting that murders via firearm have fallen 50% in the past 25 years	NickB79	Oct 2015	#14
The WaPo's info flies directly in the face if everything I've researched	underpants	Oct 2015	#15
The WaPo cites some pretty reputable and neutral sources	TeddyR	Oct 2015	#22
If you exclude anyone killed by bullets on American soil, the President is clearly wrong.	patsimp	Oct 2015	#17

Response to TeddyR (Original post)

Mon Oct 5, 2015, 09:29 AM

pipoman (16,038 posts)

1. There will be no changes until those who wish for change

Quit concentrating on the constitutionally impossible.....like a federal UBC...it cannot happen without an amendment, and that will not be happening in any of our lifetimes.

As for your OP, maybe the president has learned not to parrot the lies of big gun control....virtually every time they come out with some claim it is a lie....they lie when the truth would be better for them....

WaPo Fact Checks President's Claim That States With Most Gun Laws Tend To Have Fewest Gun Deaths

1. There will be no changes until those who wish for change

2. Of course- because you need to just address violence- not only violence that use certain objects

6. Basically the "do nothing" because "stuff happens" approach...

12. That's not at all what I advocated

3. Would Maryland's statistics be skewed by Baltimore?

5. You can't cherry pick and throw out the areas that skew results in a way you don't like

7. I wasn't trying disprove, I was wondering about distribution, but your Chicago analogy is apt...

10. It also coincides with an economic boom.

11. Nail hit.

16. I'll second that!

20. Exactly- when you address the causes of violence it drops

4. How can you exclude 60% of gun deaths?

8. The presence of a gun doesn't cause suicide and the absence

13. It's context.

18. If the topic of conversation is mass shootings

19. The topic in the OP title is "Gun deaths." Not mass shootings.

21. The OP is about Obama's comments which were directed at mass shootings

9. There are multiple layers and solutions must come from all angles. No good data because NRA

14. It's also interesting that murders via firearm have fallen 50% in the past 25 years

15. The WaPo's info flies directly in the face if everything I've researched

22. The WaPo cites some pretty reputable and neutral sources

17. If you exclude anyone killed by bullets on American soil, the President is clearly wrong.