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Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:45 AM

Bernie Madoff of Ponzi Scheme Infamy Has Died in Federal Prison

Source: Bloomberg

New York (AP) -- Bernie Madoff, the financier who pleaded guilty to orchestrating the largest Ponzi scheme in history, died in a federal prison early Wednesday, a person familiar with the matter told The Associated Press.

Madoff died at the Federal Medical Center in Butner, North Carolina, apparently from natural causes, the person said. The person was not authorized to speak publicly and spoke to the AP on the condition of anonymity.

Read more: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-14/ap-source-ponzi-schemer-bernie-madoff-dies-in-prison

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Reply Bernie Madoff of Ponzi Scheme Infamy Has Died in Federal Prison (Original post)
SoCalDavidS Apr 14 OP
Lovie777 Apr 14 #1
brooklynite Apr 14 #4
Warpy Apr 14 #26
mountain grammy Apr 14 #2
KS Toronado Apr 14 #5
mountain grammy Apr 14 #15
Hassin Bin Sober Apr 14 #16
bucolic_frolic Apr 14 #3
BumRushDaShow Apr 14 #6
Sibelius Fan Apr 14 #7
greenjar_01 Apr 14 #13
jmowreader Apr 14 #25
Sibelius Fan Apr 14 #31
jmowreader Apr 14 #33
Xolodno Apr 14 #32
jmowreader Apr 14 #34
MrModerate Apr 14 #8
BradAllison Apr 14 #19
murielm99 Apr 14 #27
niyad Apr 14 #9
global1 Apr 14 #11
greenjar_01 Apr 14 #14
ZonkerHarris Apr 14 #10
Ford_Prefect Apr 14 #12
mysteryowl Apr 14 #17
DinahMoeHum Apr 14 #18
eppur_se_muova Apr 14 #20
Major Nikon Apr 14 #21
NurseJackie Apr 14 #22
tenderfoot Apr 14 #23
politruk Apr 14 #24
Raine Apr 14 #28
BigmanPigman Apr 14 #29
brush Apr 14 #30

Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:49 AM

1. I thought he was pardon by f-face . . .

before left office.

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Response to Lovie777 (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:57 AM

4. Why?

What did he ever do for Trump?

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Response to Lovie777 (Reply #1)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 03:08 PM

26. Not a chance

Madoff robbed the rich, not the poor, which is why he was sitting in prison instead of a Caribbean villa. A pardon from a rich guy was never going to happen.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:50 AM

2. Bummer. Hope to read this about trump soon.

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Response to mountain grammy (Reply #2)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:07 AM

5. Not me, I want to see him have his 100th birthday in jail!

So he'll remind people what happens when you lie & cheat your way through life.

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Response to KS Toronado (Reply #5)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:30 AM

15. Yeah I'd be good with that too.

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Response to KS Toronado (Reply #5)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:38 AM

16. What happens when you lie and cheat your way through life is you get wealthy.

Stealing from rich people gets you tossed in jail.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:55 AM

3. Saddest part of Madoff story

If he had done what he said he was doing, he might have stood a chance at making it work. There are ETFs today that hedge assets and indexes and pay almost 1% a month. From what I remember reading Bernie just didn't look at the computer records, let his employees deep-six them, and went on promising great returns. And it was sold pyramid network marketing style. Word of mouth and lucky to have heard about it, they said before the fall.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:12 AM

6. Seeing all the breaking news banners...

The irony of him was one of his early companies helped to create the tech eventually used by the NASDAQ. I remember following the case where they said his investors were regularly receiving what were essentially old tech dot-matrix-printouts of their supposed investment returns and few seemed to even bother reading them, let alone questioning them.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:38 AM

7. Calling Madoff a financier is like calling Keanu Reeves a pro quarterback.

Both played one on TV or in the movies.

There were no investments nor return on the same with Madoff. It was a Ponzi scheme, pure and simple.

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Response to Sibelius Fan (Reply #7)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:26 AM

13. Was gonna say that Johnny Utah blew out his knee in college

But then I remembered Shane Falco.

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Response to Sibelius Fan (Reply #7)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 03:05 PM

25. Uhh...not quite

Before Madoff decided to become a crook, he was an excellent and well-respected financier. The Ponzi wouldn't have pulled in a cent if anyone else would have tried it, because of the nature of the thing.

This is Harry Markopoulos' analysis of Madoff's Ponzi:

https://math.nyu.edu/faculty/avellane/madoffmarkopoulos.pdf

This is what Madoff claims to have done:

He first bought a "basket" of 30 to 35 large-cap stocks. Next, he sold out-of-the-money S&P 500 index call options against the value of the stock basket. Then he bought out-of-the-money S&P 500 index put options to protect the investment. Madoff claimed this would return 12 percent to the investors, which means it was returning 16 percent to him because no one runs hedge funds out of the goodness of their hearts. He also claimed it only lost a little money in four months of its existence, which is strange because there were several crashes in the market while Madoff was running this.

Markopoulos believes Madoff would have needed to earn 20 percent just on his stock selections to make this work, which is the first and biggest problem here: large-cap or "blue chip" stocks do not throw off 20 percent profit per year. They are extremely stable. You can get...oh, two to three percent out of them. If you build your portfolio around the Pink Sheets (penny stocks and foreign companies...both BASF and Bayer trade on the Pinks, and those are exceptionally stable companies - but since they're headquartered in Germany, they have to be traded OTC) you can make 20 percent...but you can ALSO lose 100 percent, and no one is going to throw ten million dollars at you to invest in penny stocks.

Markopoulos points out another huge problem, which is that there aren't enough call and put options in existence to do what Madoff said he was doing. He also points out that Madoff's counterparties are a little weird - Madoff claimed to trade derivatives exclusively through the Union Bank of Switzerland and Merrill Lynch, but the two biggest firms in the derivatives he claimed to use, which he would need to move the amount of derivatives he was supposedly moving, were Goldman, Sachs and Citigroup.

But seriously, the only way this shit would have sold is if a financial titan like Madoff said it worked.

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Response to jmowreader (Reply #25)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 08:16 PM

31. His Ponzi scheme started in 1981, maybe earlier.

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Response to Sibelius Fan (Reply #31)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:42 PM

33. Madoff Investment Securities LLC opened in 1960

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Response to jmowreader (Reply #25)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:25 PM

32. Yeap.

But that is the inherit problem, people trust their financial advisors...and they let their greed cloud the mind at times. It's only a matter of time a scam artist figures out to find them. Madoff was a criminal, but just like bank robbers who frequently return to the same bank to rob, they get caught. Since they didn't get found out the first time, get sloppy over time and screw up.

Shit, when the market tanked due to COVID, everyone was saying sell Disney, Sea World, Carnival, etc. I laughed and with the very little play money I had, bought into it all. Nearly doubled it with my target sell, and I'm lucky to have a bit of play money.

I travel a lot and meet a lot of people. Once they hear about my background, often strike up conversations on the market. Usually tell them if you are willing to lose your ass, yes, go ahead and invest in the options market. But don't be surprised when you lose your ass. Stocks...take a look at a CD at the bank, if you think you can do better and have the acumen to do so, go for it. But this should not be your life savings, keep that in the 401k, Pension, etc.

The majority do not have that kind of acumen. Which is why the idea of privatizing social security is a really fucking bad idea. Funny, some have actually asked me to be their advisor. Told them, hell no. If I lost their kids college money, their retirement fund, etc. It would weigh on me.

In the case of Madoff, obviously not at all.

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Response to Xolodno (Reply #32)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 09:44 PM

34. I'm planning to bury $30k in CDs

Stocks will potentially give you better return, but they’re too damn much work for me to deal with.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:53 AM

8. Another slot has opened up on the list of people who should die in jail...

Who shall we put on the list to fill that spot?

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Response to MrModerate (Reply #8)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 01:06 PM

19. I got a suggestion......(n/m)

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Response to MrModerate (Reply #8)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 03:33 PM

27. Guess!

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:55 AM

9. He destroyed many lives. Good riddance.

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Response to niyad (Reply #9)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:06 AM

11. If I Recall - His Family Was Decimated As Well.....nt

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Response to global1 (Reply #11)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:27 AM

14. One son died of cancer; the other killed himself

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 10:58 AM

10. a happy ending

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 11:08 AM

12. Donald Trump take note...We have a new opening with your name on it.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 12:29 PM

17. He was 82 years old

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 12:34 PM

18. Oh. OK.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 01:24 PM

20. He's in a warmer place now. nt

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 01:39 PM

21. Well bless his piece of shit heart

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 01:58 PM

22. Even his NAME gives me the creeps! How could anyone trust a guy with THAT name?

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 02:01 PM

23. The only reason he was ever brought to justice is because his victims were super wealthy.

Trump steals from regular people - hence never being held accountable.

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 02:12 PM

24. I suppose took with him

 

the number of the Swiss or Cayman Islands account where he stashed his loot?

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 05:17 PM

28. Too bad ... he needed to spend years longer in prison, he got out by dying. nt

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Response to SoCalDavidS (Original post)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 06:03 PM

29. I just watched a TV show about him two weeks ago

on How It Really Happened. No matter how much I think I understand about this complex case I am still amazed over how he got away with it for so long.

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Response to BigmanPigman (Reply #29)

Wed Apr 14, 2021, 06:15 PM

30. Too many are vulnerable too-good-to-be-true "insider"...

investment opportunities.

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