Manchin says he won't back $1.75 trillion economic agenda bill without 'greater clarity' about its e

because he isn't able to get anything through this 2 person road block. The media wants a horse race, so they get the dissenters as much media exposure as they can to help, them. Democrats just can't get over themselves long enough.

The naïveté of the Dems is just incredible. What in the hell did they THINK Manchin was going to do?

It’s not a done deal until it’s a done deal. Biden was trying to save face before his overseas trip and now that has backfired because he trusted Manchin.

You can’t trust Manchin!!!!

Joe Manchin plays back stabber, and bully

Seems so.

Can't wait for his suckups to come along and tell us why we "must love" Manchin.

What an asshole, whining about debt while obstructing the paid-for bill. And demanding passage of the deficit-increasing bill.

Fuck him.

Follow the money why he keeps doing this.

is and we have known it for months now.

The sooner he and sinema make it official, the more chance there is that the voters will understand why Biden has been unable to get legislation through.

will soon be solved. The bill gets less consequential with each passing day.

he's a Republican in favor of the infrastructure and leave Manchin at his swanky DCdigs. Give a speech talk to the people, The Biden effect isn't working, its time to be using the Johnson sledgehammer. Civility isn't working so its time to take it to the regular people

and do a "tour"

Where is the fucking media on this?

Duh ! Don't ask...

If that's what it takes - and it's obviously going to take that. Dems needs to get their messaging straight, concise, louder and bolder. And they need to do it NOW. Kind of difficult with Manchin sabotaging everything any chance he gets. That part (i.e., Manchin and Sinema if she starts anything) needs to be addressed in the messaging, too.

The media is out for ratings; they don't give a rat's ass about votes.

And... I would repeat you--

MESSAGING !!!!!!!!

Shit, they could hire any number of folks right here on DU who would do a hell of a lot better job than they do--- Which is basically, nothing...

I’ve spent time wondering if Dems are just clueless as to this, or whether they are doing it on purpose. It’s a common critique and the leadership has GOT to know that more needs to be done. Don’t you think?

Biden does a great town hall and I think he should do them more often. But I also think he needs to stop using some of the same old folksy statements (“my father always said”, etc.) and get more direct and concise. Yes, folksy IS part of Biden’s charm, but televised air time ANYWHERE has a time limit.

Klobuchar is great at messaging as is Booker. I like Jackie Spier and Katie Porter in the House. They both have their ducks in a row before they speak. There are many others who could be surrogates for Biden and the party. Storm the airwaves!!!

It's like they are trying to have nice meetings while the Nazis are over-running Europe!!
It is just mind boggling. I mean, we're not supposed to criticize democrats here, but JFC, these people don't seem to have a clue how to fight....

And also run ersatz ads.
Hit social media...
And when they DO get on MSM and reginal and local TV TELL THE REAL TRUTH about what is happening....



Sorry, but some days I just can't put up with it. I live in a town/city of abou6t20,000 in Upstate NY and even repubs running for local elections are getting into all this shit-- lies accusations, distorions, personal threats of violence... WTF, man !!

I see the Republican shit every single day. If Dems don’t wise up and start fighting, democracy is lost. It’s that simple.

In Texas, it’s not fiction. It’s fact. And Texas has been the Republican experiment to see how far they can get with the rest of the country.

And seriously.. the messaging is incompetent. Are they not realizing that people are blaming Biden for inflation, supply chain delays etc? I just hate myself for saying that Trump had some genius PR reflexes in tweeting his opinions and probably ineffectual-- at best actions to retaliate against economic forces detrimental to his base. Biden or his surrogates need to hammer this.

deliberately forgetting also to mention to the public of the benefits in the bill.

See how that works?

As much, if not more than any Republican because you expect Republicans to be total fucking scumbags. I never thought he was a good guy but being an utterly unredeemable piece of shit is bit more than I expected.

He’s intentionally giving the country over to the fascists. And that makes him filth.

Hide this if you want but I’m tired of trying to pretend this bastard has any worthy qualities. He’s a vile asshole.

I agree completely.

But I like how you think. I’ve been screaming that he needs to be brought in line and the push back has always been that we nice, refined Democrats couldn’t do that. It wouldn’t be fair!!!

Well truth be told it’s probably not even necessary. With all of his family stuff, there’s probably plenty of factual and real information that just needs to be “stressed” publicly. All legal, of course.

It is a numbers game. If he changes his party we are in the minority and there is no chance any of those bills comes up for a vote.
This is what we have.
It sucks. But it is reality.

However, in 2022, we have the opportunity to turn out and vote and make the Manchin/Sinema issue irrelevant.

But if Manchin and Sinema aren’t dealt with before the midterms, I don’t think we have a chance in hell of winning more seats.

Look at Virginia tonight! Voters are tired of Democrats not being able to get their shit together. I’m sorry is that’s offensive to you or to anyone, but it’s the honest truth as I see it.

The opportunity is the remaining year before the midterms to prove to voters that Dems are strong, united, and ready to fight for this country.

The problem is none of our elected offices are LBJ. He would have had Manchin and Simenon up against the wall...” pointing out the error of their ways”

Where is Schumer? What the hell is he doing about this? If Manchin wants to switch parties, then just do it, find a repub that is feed up with MoscowMitches shit and recruit.

This vote is the the mid term election, and if it fails, then go home and prepare for the most unprecedented onslaught of right wing congress and Senators you have ever seen. There will be no need for the republicans to get rid of the filibuster, because they will have at least 60 seats. Sorry, but I am a realist. Being in my late 60’s, I have seen it all before, but never what the right is doing now, and to think of another Trump, Hailey, McConnell, McCarthy leadership, plus old, retiring Supreme Court justices.....not a good look....As a South Carolina resident, I live with the right wing shit everyday.

n/t

Joe will be looking for some checks.

Why Joe, why ?

that what the Military budget is over the next 10-year period. In other words do some effective messaging Democrats! By pushing it back to $3.75T -- which the public supports --- it will expose all the no voters in congress.

The corporate Democrats are pathetic and have zero accountability. Manchin might as well be GQP because you can negotiate with him for weeks and he STILL wont support the bill.

It is time to write the BBB bill and vote on it. If it fails, then we will rap it around Manchin and Sinema's neck. We might as well consider infrastructure dead. There is NO WAY the house should vote on it in this environment. Manchin is lying. Sinema looks like she is posturing to get something passed. Is the divide Climate Change? Sinema is for addressing it in some manner, but it seems to conflict with Manchin's bank roll. Can we divide and conquer with these loons? Who wants to be the one Senator that stands in the way? Tweak the bill to get one of them and make the other vote against it. That is all we have. See if one of them folds.

NO vote on infrastructure until BBB vote is done. Agreeing to framework is not good enough. If BBB fails, we rework BOTH bills as one reconciliation bill and sell it in early 2022.. Make it mostly about infrastructure with a few BBB items. Then Dem's pass it 100% on their own. Make GOP vote against infrastructure and improved elderly care / child welfare. Will Dem clowns run from that too? They need to KNOW that their precious infrastructure bill is DOA. This entire negotiation period has been Kabuki theatre. Manchin and Sinema do not want any reconciliation bill passed and are only pretending to care until infrastructure passes. Then it is off to a triathlon or yacht exhibition. I honestly think they are trying to run out the clock. Maybe a health issue with a Democratic senator will save them? Kinda like hoping your teacher is sick so you dont have to take a test.

Under 300k people voted for Joe Manchin and he is holding up progress for 350 million. What an ego-maniacal creep he is. If we improve our Senate numbers in 2022, we should ask him to leave the party. He is an embarrassment.

What Do You Expect From Manchin, his daughter killed people just to make a buck!!! What a piece of shit family.

giving Manchin whatever he wants. We cannot keep playing this game on the whim of two people anymore

In the meantime do whatever it takes to make Manchin and Sinema irrelevant via the 2022 midterms

Most important, stop talking to the press about the status of this. The press is not a neutral party

read it for him?

Enough to vote over corporate shill attention seekers like Manchin and Sinema.


If its not Joe Lieberman its Manchin or Sinema.

but I didn't think it actually would. Fucking guy.

That reputation will be his legacy.

Manchin stands for nothing except his own self-importance. All of his "no"s give him air time. His name is in lights. That's it. Oh. And one other thing: he stands arm in arm with billionaires and the fossil fuel industry. He will never abandon them. He identifies entirely with the wealthy elites. The little people mean nothing to him.

As someone has pointed out previously, its like Charlie Brown trying to kick the football with Lucy holding it! When he said he'd vote for it, he was afraid of losing all the pandering attention he's gotten for months for being a contrarian.

This statement is just moronic:
"I will not support a bill that is this consequential without thoroughly understanding the impact that it will have on our national debt, our economy and most importantly all of our American people," He's had this explained to him ad nauseam. I agree--its time to go all LBJ on his ass! Go back to the $3T bill, and cram it down his and Sinema's throat.

I officially hate him.

I said to my husband yesterday that Manchin is like Lucy with the football. All day today he's be calling him Lucy.

Amiright?

...than no bill is a bad bill and manchin wants a bad bill...

...all manchin is going to end up doing is to elect pukes and trump...

...what a 'Democrat'...

...

I have nothing to say about Manchin.

The President is at a Climate Change conference and apologizes for pulling out of the Paris accords.

Then Joe Manchin (D - Coal) has problems with Biden's budget.

I get that we support climate change prevention. Manchin represents a constituency for which Climate Change legislation means lost livelihoods-- not just for the miners and drillers, but for truckers, machine shops, fabricators, equipment dealers, and railroads that support fossil fuel in WV.

Biden needs to start linking his policies more directly to a soft landing and clear alternative future for these folks.

Biden also needs to slam wind power critics at every turn, and point out how many jobs that industry now supports.

"Manchin says".

Old King Coal can go fuck himself.