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Bosonic

(3,746 posts)
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:02 PM Sep 2014

Red Cross team attacked while burying Ebola dead

Source: AP

CONAKRY, Guinea (AP) — A Red Cross team was attacked while collecting bodies believed to be infected with Ebola in southeastern Guinea, the latest in a string of assaults that are hindering efforts to control West Africa's current outbreak.

One Red Cross worker is recovering after being wounded in in the neck in Tuesday's attack in Forecariah, according to Benoit Carpentier, a spokesman for the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies.

Family members of the dead initially set upon the six volunteers and vandalized their cars, said Mariam Barry, a resident. Eventually a crowd went to the regional health office, where they threw rocks at the building.

The attack is the most recent in a series that have plagued teams working to bury bodies safely, provide information about Ebola and disinfect public places. The most shocking was the abduction and killing last week in Guinea of eight people, health workers educating people about Ebola and the journalists accompanying them.

Read more: http://bigstory.ap.org/article/f7414d994e014e96b926ca6f4f9a9610/who-ebola-vaccine-could-be-ready-year-end

43 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Red Cross team attacked while burying Ebola dead (Original Post) Bosonic Sep 2014 OP
Houston, we have a cultural problem... TwilightGardener Sep 2014 #1
What is wrong with people? oberliner Sep 2014 #2
They do not believe the "official government story" on ebola jberryhill Sep 2014 #3
They aren't the only ones. littlemissmartypants Sep 2014 #5
How did you avoid shouting at her? That is possible the most ridiculous rumor I've heard! Judi Lynn Sep 2014 #18
There seems to be a tendency in humans to believe in hidden agendas and unproven conspiracies. drm604 Sep 2014 #9
That is Just Sparhawk60 Sep 2014 #29
us. arrogance is the problem. hopemountain Sep 2014 #6
Thanks for this. I wrote up - and then deleted - something similar. closeupready Sep 2014 #7
this was televised? hopemountain Sep 2014 #8
Yes, she was the stereotypical ugly American, fake beautiful closeupready Sep 2014 #10
Is it the same reason one of my three half sisters littlemissmartypants Sep 2014 #22
I saw it, too, as well as other similar moments during Amazing Race's history. Judi Lynn Sep 2014 #19
Completely agree, 100%. closeupready Sep 2014 #20
Victim blaming seveneyes Sep 2014 #12
The problem, as I understand it, SheilaT Sep 2014 #13
"us. arrogance is the problem" EX500rider Sep 2014 #16
Thanks for a sane reply to those posts flamingdem Sep 2014 #27
I think by "us" the poster meant the people (outsiders) trying to help not specifically "U.S." n/t hughee99 Sep 2014 #30
yes, thank you for clarifying my perspective. hopemountain Sep 2014 #34
We should just encourge them to leave then and quarnatine off the whole country "Outbreak" style snooper2 Sep 2014 #42
What makes you think they were all American? enlightenment Sep 2014 #21
the training is arrogant hopemountain Sep 2014 #35
The bodies are highly infectious.. sendero Sep 2014 #25
you make so many assumptions in your post in an attempt to blame "US". You say the Red Cross KittyWampus Sep 2014 #26
No. The people are ignorant and believe in conspiracy theories flamingdem Sep 2014 #28
exactly. nt hopemountain Sep 2014 #36
I love how you assume only "white Europeans" are involved in fighting the disease... Blue_Tires Sep 2014 #33
they run the organization(s) nt hopemountain Sep 2014 #37
They are ignorant, un-educated, religous snooper2 Sep 2014 #11
We need to pull all of our volunteers out of there yeoman6987 Sep 2014 #17
Did he not deploy 3000 troops there a couple of weeks ago? OnlinePoker Sep 2014 #31
Lack of education, distrust, and a tidal wave of misinformation being spread... Blue_Tires Sep 2014 #32
Just read another DU post regarding Death and Burial Practices of Africans. I do not know the link jwirr Sep 2014 #4
I may be playing the part of the christx30 Sep 2014 #14
The article had many different burial practices. Some had to do with how the body was removed from jwirr Sep 2014 #15
One thing, I think I heard, is the post mortem washing. littlemissmartypants Sep 2014 #23
That's all well and good, but christx30 Sep 2014 #24
this is the exact "attitude" and arrogance to hopemountain Sep 2014 #38
You see attitude and arrogance. christx30 Sep 2014 #40
thank you. i hope everyone reads your post. nt hopemountain Sep 2014 #39
Yeah, lets pull our people out and see how they figure things out for themselves. GOLGO 13 Sep 2014 #41
There are probably some good woo folks located here and there that can help snooper2 Sep 2014 #43
 

jberryhill

(62,444 posts)
3. They do not believe the "official government story" on ebola
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:11 PM
Sep 2014

It's the extreme to where that sort of thing leads.

They have been told that ebola is a western government plot against Africans.

littlemissmartypants

(22,418 posts)
5. They aren't the only ones.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:18 PM
Sep 2014

had a neighbor tell me that "Obama has a bomb made with ebola" and there are plans to drop it somewhere...

?????

I told her the more you spread hate the more it breeds and that I am sure the MSM hates our president especially because he is black.

Her response... "Well that's true."

Weak minds...no comment.

Love, Peace and Shelter.
~ littlemissmartypants

Judi Lynn

(160,217 posts)
18. How did you avoid shouting at her? That is possible the most ridiculous rumor I've heard!
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 06:55 PM
Sep 2014

She must be a Fox listener.

Your answer was calm, and you maintained civil contact with her. You definitely managed it well.

Maybe it will move her to really think seriously about the quality of the stuff she hears, and start questioning it.

What has happened to our "news" sources since Al Gore ran for the Presidency, and throughout President Obama's administration has been grotesque. Their real disease has blossomed, and it's not good. They are clearly not well-intentioned, civic minded human beings. No honor whatsoever.

drm604

(16,230 posts)
9. There seems to be a tendency in humans to believe in hidden agendas and unproven conspiracies.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:42 PM
Sep 2014

People need to be educated away from this kind of thinking. It's an element in many of the problems we face, both in the US and elsewhere.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
6. us. arrogance is the problem.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:33 PM
Sep 2014

insensitivity and disrespect by not acknowleging other cultures is what is wrong. were the burials discussed with the locals or families of the dead?

even if the only way to top the spread of continued infection of ebola is the way the red cross is proceeding - the red cross volunteers failed to connect with the village leaders or perhaps even have any contact with the familes regarding customs for burial. many cultures do not want burial. they may be accustomed to cremation or some other form of releasing their loved one's spirit or soul - or whatever. as usual, white europeans continue to disregard other humans and their cultural identities by bullying their ways on others.

in addition, there is very likely many other clumsy overstepping or misunderstanding that is occurring with the red cross's efforts to "do good" and stop the virus. we have no idea and if ebola is to be successfully stopped, the WHO must proceed with respect of the people and their cultures. and, if they are not aware of the cultural taboos or customs, shame on them. they have had plenty of time to develop their "feelers".

people do not appreciate patronizing or paternalistic "we know better" attitudes - no matter how well intentioned. especially, the red cross should know this by now.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
7. Thanks for this. I wrote up - and then deleted - something similar.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:37 PM
Sep 2014

For The Amazing Race fans, it's almost like we have here a contingent of people who were cut from the same cloth as that beauty queen runner up who - while in Kenya one season, speeding through the capital city trying to complete a road block - stopped to gripe on camera about the poor personal hygiene of locals, and 'why don't they stop breeding?!'

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
8. this was televised?
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:40 PM
Sep 2014

shameful and just plain ignorant. we have no business in other countries if we are just there to see the scenery and exploit the country - with complete disregard & disrespect of the people and their culture.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
10. Yes, she was the stereotypical ugly American, fake beautiful
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:56 PM
Sep 2014

Glossy veneer, pretty face ... ugly, commercial personality.

littlemissmartypants

(22,418 posts)
22. Is it the same reason one of my three half sisters
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 01:18 AM
Sep 2014

Insists on peroxide blonde hair?
I am not joking with this question.
???
I also worry she may have body dysmorphic disorder.

Three half sisters. That doesn't sound good.

Anyway, what do you think?

~ Lmsp 🙌

Judi Lynn

(160,217 posts)
19. I saw it, too, as well as other similar moments during Amazing Race's history.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 07:04 PM
Sep 2014

Often they have spewed this racism while sitting in the back seats of cab drivers who must be wondering what they could have ever done to deserve driving hostile, rancorous racists who clearly are hostile to their whole countries, and everyone in them.

It was hateful, and heartbreaking seeing it the first time. Felt so damned sorry it had to happen in front of an innocent citizen.

I heard the filthy comments you mentioned. Unforgiveable. It's a lot harder to cleanse a filthy heart of its hatred than it is to take another bath in a very hot country.

You can only hope somehow the production company finds a way to apologize for these barbarians when they degrade others in perfect ear shot.

 

closeupready

(29,503 posts)
20. Completely agree, 100%.
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 07:19 PM
Sep 2014

Wouldn't it be interesting to see a 'whatever happened to ...' follow-up episode, with the most controversial contestants?

Anyway, peace to you.

 

seveneyes

(4,631 posts)
12. Victim blaming
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 05:16 PM
Sep 2014

The government there has had plenty of time to inform their people of the crisis and what needs to be done. Blaming the victims of the ignorant people that are trying to kill those sent there to help is beyond the pale.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
13. The problem, as I understand it,
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 05:24 PM
Sep 2014

is that the traditional burial practices in these countries are perfect for spreading Ebola. There is, of course, a huge cultural difference at work here, between the residents of the countries dealing with Ebola, and the outsiders who have a crystal clear understanding of this disease and how it is spread.

In the western world family members do not normally wash bodies and prepare them for burial. For more information I refer you to the wonderful book The Coming Plague by Laurie Garrett. It came out 20 years ago, but is still well worth reading. She devotes more than 50 pages to Ebola.

EX500rider

(10,528 posts)
16. "us. arrogance is the problem"
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 05:58 PM
Sep 2014

Right.....'cause the International Federation of Red Cross and Red Crescent Societies is composed only of Americans said nobody ever...

flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
27. Thanks for a sane reply to those posts
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:04 AM
Sep 2014

nuttery to blame the US for the actions of an international group, and one risking so much to help others.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
34. yes, thank you for clarifying my perspective.
Sun Sep 28, 2014, 05:44 PM
Sep 2014

of course the redcross AND w.h.o are international and arrogant and disrespectful.

enlightenment

(8,830 posts)
21. What makes you think they were all American?
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 08:10 PM
Sep 2014

Or even any of them?

The International Red Cross is just that - international. It is entirely possible that the workers were Guinean themselves. Yes, aid workers are having an incredibly difficult time convincing people that they need to fore-go their customs - but let's not automatically assume that they are "arrogant" Americans.

The workers who were killed this past week were not American, either. They were local to the area.

sendero

(28,552 posts)
25. The bodies are highly infectious..
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:55 AM
Sep 2014

Last edited Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:25 AM - Edit history (1)

... and have to be buried or burned.

You know, if these folks' "cultural" notions are more important to them than their survival, I wouldn't blame any aid worker, who is risking their life by just being there, for saying "fuck it, I'm outta here".

There simply isn't TIME to get this under control and assuage everyone's ignorance at the same time.

 

KittyWampus

(55,894 posts)
26. you make so many assumptions in your post in an attempt to blame "US". You say the Red Cross
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 10:05 AM
Sep 2014

failed to connect with villagers.

If the villagers don't WANT to be connected with then what?

Think about the Teabaggers.

FURTHERMORE, the WHO works with many, many local organizations.

So many assumptions in your post.


flamingdem

(39,304 posts)
28. No. The people are ignorant and believe in conspiracy theories
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 11:06 AM
Sep 2014

Plus, the Red Cross is international, not US.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
33. I love how you assume only "white Europeans" are involved in fighting the disease...
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 05:07 PM
Sep 2014

Fun Fact: Black Africans work for many of these international outreach organizations, and some of them have been attacked by ignorant locals, too...

 

yeoman6987

(14,449 posts)
17. We need to pull all of our volunteers out of there
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 06:45 PM
Sep 2014

The work is not appreciated and getting killed for doing good is unacceptable. Let the citizens deal with it. They seem to think they know better. Get on a plane now. In fact, I hope that President Obama sends a plane due to humanitarian reasons.

OnlinePoker

(5,702 posts)
31. Did he not deploy 3000 troops there a couple of weeks ago?
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 01:34 PM
Sep 2014

Highly unlikely they will be pulled out until the crisis is over.

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
4. Just read another DU post regarding Death and Burial Practices of Africans. I do not know the link
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 04:15 PM
Sep 2014

but this article would explain the problem. Unfortunately their cultural practices will not help to contain ebola.

christx30

(6,241 posts)
14. I may be playing the part of the
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 05:40 PM
Sep 2014

Ugly American here, but if it's anything like the carrying the bodies in the movie Amistad, I can see how that would spread disease. Or is there another death ritual and burial practice that is in play here?

jwirr

(39,215 posts)
15. The article had many different burial practices. Some had to do with how the body was removed from
Wed Sep 24, 2014, 05:44 PM
Sep 2014

the house to where it was buried. Amistad was well documented so that one may have been included in the article but it did not mention that movie.

littlemissmartypants

(22,418 posts)
23. One thing, I think I heard, is the post mortem washing.
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 02:06 AM
Sep 2014

Death is a tricky business. Rituals matter.
Sacred acts matter. Science matters, too.
Education requires infrastructure and networks. Communication, of a message does not always mean, that the message, has been received and the intent is understood while valued.

This is a tragic and huge teachable moment I'm afraid we may have missed.

We need better proactive plans for this type of event. Homeland security issue and enormous tragedy, I fear.

christx30

(6,241 posts)
24. That's all well and good, but
Thu Sep 25, 2014, 09:17 AM
Sep 2014

At some point, cultural sensitivities need to take a backseat to the health and safety of everyone involved. There are 25,000 people infected but this horrible disease. And they may not like it but certain precautions need to be taken even if that's going to be a disruption in their culture. If I had a rabid squirrels living in my Christmas tree, I get rid of the thing. And they may not trust Westerners, but at some point they have to look around their towns and villages, and see their friends and family melting from Ebola.

hopemountain

(3,919 posts)
38. this is the exact "attitude" and arrogance to
Sun Sep 28, 2014, 06:10 PM
Sep 2014

which i refer in my post above.

it would have made a big f'in difference if the people were respected and first of all acknowledged rather than proceeding like bulls in a china shop.

yes, it may be true the red cross methods are the most sanitary. but who is to know if the red cross did not do it's diligent outreach? time? precautions are everything - and one "precaution" is respect and being aware of the culture AND respecting it and the people. this means taking time to acknowledge and respect the people and their ways of doing things & engaging local community health workers to explain the plan and come to the common ground of understanding. sincerity is everything in this type of work and it bridges in lightening speed.

in addition, your first sentence is so very arrogant. cultural sensitivities can be "partnered" and should not be in the back seat.

christx30

(6,241 posts)
40. You see attitude and arrogance.
Sun Sep 28, 2014, 08:08 PM
Sep 2014

I see the western world fighting a highly contagious and deadly disease while trying not to get killed by superstitious people that still convict and burn witches to death. Just make it clear that we will help as many of them not die, but if the members of the International Red Cross are attacked again, we will pack up our shit and leave. Quarantine the area, and let it burn itself out.
I love to help people. But if the person I'm trying to help treats me like crap, I drop what I'm doing and walk away.

GOLGO 13

(1,681 posts)
41. Yeah, lets pull our people out and see how they figure things out for themselves.
Mon Sep 29, 2014, 07:35 AM
Sep 2014

Apparently they got this & we are just getting in the way with our super-science, technology and some of our bravest and best educated minds.

Silly Red Cross people. Africa will show us how they handle a crisis.

 

snooper2

(30,151 posts)
43. There are probably some good woo folks located here and there that can help
Mon Sep 29, 2014, 11:22 AM
Sep 2014

A few dill leaves, some snail slime and the first blooming cactus in the desert can do wonders!

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