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elleng

(130,156 posts)
Tue May 3, 2016, 02:45 PM May 2016

Bernie Sanders’s Gift to His Party

nyt editorial

'The Democratic Party and Mrs. Clinton are better off for Mr. Sanders’s presence in this race. His criticism, as Winston Churchill might say, was not agreeable. But it called necessary attention to unhealthy developments in the Democratic Party, including its at-times obliviousness to the lingering economic pain of the middle class and the young, and its drift toward political caution over aspiration.

“I like the idea of saying, ‘We can do much more,’ because we can,” Vice President Joseph Biden Jr., who deferred his own presidential hopes this year, said about Mr. Sanders recently. “I don’t think any Democrat’s ever won saying, ‘We can’t think that big.’”

To this day, Mr. Sanders’s rallies are lit up by people who say he is the candidate most focused on their struggle for jobs, better health care and debt relief, and most interested in taking action against those who profited while wages for the working class stagnated and their hopes diminished.

As President Obama said, Mr. Sanders had “the luxury of being a complete long shot and just letting loose.” Unrealistic, short on details, the populist Mr. Sanders is a wildly gesticulating reminder of how far the Democratic Party, once champion of the underdog, has strayed. He points out the degree to which the party has become captive to economic elites whose agendas don’t necessarily represent the rest of America’s. Mr. Sanders, who raised more than $200 million through small donations, even cast doubt on Democrats’ claims that they need big-money backers to succeed. . .

Mr. Sanders has exposed a broad vein of discontent that Democrats cannot ignore. Predictions that Mr. Sanders’s supporters could migrate to Donald Trump in the fall are overstated, despite Mr. Trump’s cynical efforts to woo them. It’s more likely that some simply won’t vote. Mrs. Clinton is betting that many Democrats will be motivated to get to the polls if Mr. Trump is the Republican nominee. But to truly unify the party, Mrs. Clinton and party leaders must work to incorporate Mr. Sanders and what he stands for in the party’s approach to the general election. It would also help to acknowledge that the party has strayed at times from its more aspirational path.

Unlike the voices on the Republican side, Mr. Sanders’s has elevated this campaign. The Democratic Party should listen.'

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/03/opinion/bernie-sanderss-gift-to-his-party.html?

37 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Bernie Sanders’s Gift to His Party (Original Post) elleng May 2016 OP
He's a throwback HassleCat May 2016 #1
Until last year, Bernie was registered as an Independent tonyt53 May 2016 #2
Who caucuses with the Democrats 90% of the time TexasBushwhacker May 2016 #37
HIs party? scscholar May 2016 #3
Democratic principles lmbradford May 2016 #4
Right. elleng May 2016 #5
I call bullshit. stopbush May 2016 #6
as First Lady, she explains what kind of principles she stands by tomm2thumbs May 2016 #34
No, he has not. Hillary has been a Dem her entire adult life. Sanders is new to the party. SunSeeker May 2016 #7
link Qutzupalotl May 2016 #8
WRONG. That does not say she was ever a registered Republican. SunSeeker May 2016 #10
President of the Young Republicans as a freshman. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #12
GOD FORBID a child should love her father. SunSeeker May 2016 #13
Hillary was once a Republican. Bernie never was. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #14
Hillary has been a Democrat her whole adult life. Bernie? 6 months. SunSeeker May 2016 #15
Republicans are worse. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #16
So write off Elizabeth Warren then? SunSeeker May 2016 #17
She's not running. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #18
Hillary has been a progressive Democrat her whole adult life. SunSeeker May 2016 #19
Progressive Democrats don't deny same-sex couples rights Qutzupalotl May 2016 #20
Wrong. They did 20 years ago. AS DID SANDERS. SunSeeker May 2016 #22
He opposed DOMA and DADT when the Clintons were for them. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #23
Um no, civil unions are not "equal rights under the law." SunSeeker May 2016 #24
That's exactly what they are. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #25
Oh GOOD GOD. I can't believe you are making this argument. SunSeeker May 2016 #26
It's not an argument, it's a definition. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #27
No, it is not. Civil unions are not "equal." nt SunSeeker May 2016 #28
They would not have ever been necessary had Clinton vetoed DOMA. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #29
Um no, DOMA is not why Sanders favored Civil Unions. SunSeeker May 2016 #30
That is not what I said. Qutzupalotl May 2016 #31
Civil unions existed before DOMA. nt SunSeeker May 2016 #32
Sanders opposed DOMA beacuse he thought each state should decide for themselves. Nitram May 2016 #36
Yes, and during Hillary's time as a Democrat, afertal May 2016 #9
That is false. If anything, the party has gotten more progressive since the 1990s. SunSeeker May 2016 #11
Good! CobaltBlue May 2016 #35
"Mr. Sanders is a wildly gesticulating reminder of how far the Democratic Party...has strayed." Earth_First May 2016 #21
enjoyed that! - thanks tomm2thumbs May 2016 #33
 

HassleCat

(6,409 posts)
1. He's a throwback
Tue May 3, 2016, 02:52 PM
May 2016

To a time when Democrats, and some in the other party, thought we could go to the moon, wage war on poverty, etc. These were big ideas, and some of them worked better than others, but we were not scared of big ideas. Those days are behind us, huh? Now we're scared of everything and everyone. If anyone gives us any flak, we appoint them to a government post.

 

tonyt53

(5,737 posts)
2. Until last year, Bernie was registered as an Independent
Tue May 3, 2016, 03:07 PM
May 2016

Plus, he has always called himself a Democratic Socialist.

lmbradford

(517 posts)
4. Democratic principles
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:06 PM
May 2016

Labels are useless. He has been upholding the principles of FDR and caucusing with the Dems for longer than Hillary has been a Dem. She used to be registered Republican, he used to be registered Independent. Not much to argue about there.

stopbush

(24,378 posts)
6. I call bullshit.
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:29 PM
May 2016

Hillary has been a Dem since 1968. She supported Eugene McCarthy.

Sanders didn't enter the House until 1991, so he couldn't have "caucused with the Dems" before then.

Sanders has been a D for one year. Hillary has been a D for 48 years.

You are so off base it's laughable.

Is that what passes for "the truth" among Sanders supporters? Sad.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
7. No, he has not. Hillary has been a Dem her entire adult life. Sanders is new to the party.
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:29 PM
May 2016

Sanders' hero is socialist presidential candidate Eugene Debbs. That is who he has a picture of hanging in his office, not FDR. The Socialist Party ran candidates AGAINST FDR.


AND please provided the link to your assertion that Hillary "used to be registered Republican." She never was as far as I am aware. As soon as she was old enough to vote, she worked for and voted for the Democratic candidate at the time, George McGovern.

Meanwhile, Sanders has been trashing the Democratic Party for decades.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
8. link
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:39 PM
May 2016
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton

She then volunteered to campaign for Republican candidate Barry Goldwater in the U.S. presidential election of 1964.

....
In 1965, Rodham enrolled at Wellesley College, where she majored in political science. During her freshman year, she served as president of the Wellesley Young Republicans; with this Rockefeller Republican-oriented group, she supported the elections to mayor of John Lindsay (New York City) and to U.S. senator of Edward Brooke (Massachusetts). She later stepped down from this position, as her views changed regarding the American Civil Rights Movement and the Vietnam War. In a letter to her youth minister at this time, she described herself as "a mind conservative and a heart liberal".

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
10. WRONG. That does not say she was ever a registered Republican.
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:44 PM
May 2016

In high school (1964) she was volunteered for Goldwater, influenced by her Republican father. So did Bernie's BFF Thom Hartmann. People develop their own beliefs once they become adults. Once Hillary was old enough to vote, she VOTED DEMOCRATIC.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
12. President of the Young Republicans as a freshman.
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:54 PM
May 2016

That's some fatherly influence.

I never said she was a registered Republican. That was the other poster. This was just to enlighten you as to her background and thinking.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
13. GOD FORBID a child should love her father.
Tue May 3, 2016, 05:42 PM
May 2016

I am well aware of Hillary’s background. Spare me your paternalism.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
15. Hillary has been a Democrat her whole adult life. Bernie? 6 months.
Tue May 3, 2016, 06:38 PM
May 2016

So I suggest you get off your high horse about this.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
19. Hillary has been a progressive Democrat her whole adult life.
Tue May 3, 2016, 06:53 PM
May 2016

Funny how when Elizabeth Warren changes her mind about her entire political affiliation as a middle-aged adult, it is a sign of "decency," but when Hillary changes her mind about one issue it is a sign of depravity.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
20. Progressive Democrats don't deny same-sex couples rights
Tue May 3, 2016, 06:57 PM
May 2016

and don't have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century. Warren is a leader, Clinton a follower.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
22. Wrong. They did 20 years ago. AS DID SANDERS.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:03 PM
May 2016

Sanders OPPOSED same-sex marriage --even as a Senate candidate in ultra-blue Vermont in 2006--arguing civil unions were enough.


http://www.c-span.org/video/?c4550754/sanders-opposed-federal-marriage-equality-2006

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
23. He opposed DOMA and DADT when the Clintons were for them.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:14 PM
May 2016

Sanders supported equal rights under the law, which is what civil unions means.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
25. That's exactly what they are.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:18 PM
May 2016

Fair treatment in taxation, adoption, inheritance...everything except marriage, which is controlled by the states.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
26. Oh GOOD GOD. I can't believe you are making this argument.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:30 PM
May 2016

All to prop up your candidate's purity, eh?

No, treating gay people as second class citizens by not giving their union the dignity of the name "marriage" is anything but "fair" or and "equal treatment." Indeed, the 2015 Supreme Court case, Obergefell v. Hodges, that did away with your bullshit argument and established marriage equality as a right, was based on the Constitution's EQUAL PROTECTION CLAUSE.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
27. It's not an argument, it's a definition.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:36 PM
May 2016

Civil unions were created to grant as much equality as was allowed while DOMA was still on the books.

You'll notice that marriage parity was eventually granted NOT BY FEDERAL LEGISLATION, which would be an overreach, but by the Supreme Court overturning the DISASTROUS and UNEQUAL "Defense of Marriage Act" supported by the CLINTONS.

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
30. Um no, DOMA is not why Sanders favored Civil Unions.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:48 PM
May 2016




Sanders said he favored Civil Unions because marriage equality would be too divisive--that Vermont had been through "too much" in just granting civil unions.

Qutzupalotl

(14,230 posts)
31. That is not what I said.
Tue May 3, 2016, 07:52 PM
May 2016

Civil unions would not have been necessary without same-sex marriage bans like DOMA.

Nitram

(22,671 posts)
36. Sanders opposed DOMA beacuse he thought each state should decide for themselves.
Wed May 4, 2016, 10:17 AM
May 2016

States' rights has long been a RW issue.

 

afertal

(148 posts)
9. Yes, and during Hillary's time as a Democrat,
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:44 PM
May 2016

..the party has grown further away from democratic principles while Bernie has remained consistently 'for the people.'

SunSeeker

(51,378 posts)
11. That is false. If anything, the party has gotten more progressive since the 1990s.
Tue May 3, 2016, 04:46 PM
May 2016

And is certainly more progressive than the days of the Dixiecrats.

Earth_First

(14,910 posts)
21. "Mr. Sanders is a wildly gesticulating reminder of how far the Democratic Party...has strayed."
Tue May 3, 2016, 06:58 PM
May 2016

So we're gonna put up another 'same shit; different day' candidate and call it a day...

Gotcha.

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