Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:33 PM May 2016

Math is math. Hillary Clinton is the preseumptive nominee.

Anyone running against her CANNOT win as there are not enough delegates left. At all.

Pretending this is still a race when there is absolutely no measure by which he can win is doing nothing more than helping the Orange One Who Wants To Procreate With His Daughter.

There. Is. No. Metric. By. Which. Bernie. Can. Win. So. All. He. Can. Do. Is. Further. Our. Divide.

It seems that some would rather get it handed to them at the convention. We don't have to win it there, because we have won it *already*. I would have preferred to see a coalition, but like all things in reality, you have to play the hand you're dealt, not the one you wish you had.

Math is math. Hillary won.

71 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Math is math. Hillary Clinton is the preseumptive nominee. (Original Post) LaydeeBug May 2016 OP
feel the math smiley May 2016 #1
No...just *DO* the math. Save your feelings. They've taken a beating LaydeeBug May 2016 #2
that made no sense. smiley May 2016 #3
Let me help you: there are not enough delegates left for Bernie to catch up, LaydeeBug May 2016 #6
Then it comes down to supers right... smiley May 2016 #10
No, it's not "fucked up", it's called delegate math... LaydeeBug May 2016 #13
Sander could win every remaining primary by 20 points and still lose. Adrahil May 2016 #48
There's enough elected delegates. I don't give a €©ĄŁ about the supers at this point. nt SusanCalvin May 2016 #58
Ummm... JimDandy May 2016 #8
Then let him drop out of the Dem race and make his best Indy run LaydeeBug May 2016 #14
Leaving out supers (as should be), no she hasn't. nt SusanCalvin May 2016 #59
Sanders doesn't understand math. LiberalFighter May 2016 #37
IF.She.has.it.in.the.bag.relax.and.let.it.happen.take.a.breath.and.relax.n.t. Vincardog May 2016 #4
Presumptive from a 41% pre-stack? Many who were not even elected? Even where Bernie won? ViseGrip May 2016 #5
Yep. Math is math, and Hillary has the delegate county *AND* the poular vote. LaydeeBug May 2016 #7
That's what they said about Yi Sun-Shin. pangaia May 2016 #9
She doesn't have enough delegates AgingAmerican May 2016 #11
She has the delegates with only 17% of the remaining...Bernie can't win with 100%. Math is math. LaydeeBug May 2016 #15
She does not have enough delegates AgingAmerican May 2016 #17
You are right, of course, about the math. sadoldgirl May 2016 #12
So when *she* wins, it's rigged, and when *he* wins, it's a revolution. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #16
Yep. You've condensed the final lament of the Bernie folks into one pithy sentence. COLGATE4 May 2016 #64
What rule changes? LiberalFighter May 2016 #36
Voter suppression targets people of color BainsBane May 2016 #67
Very easily answered by looking at the sadoldgirl May 2016 #18
No *poll* can negate or even answer the delegate math. LaydeeBug May 2016 #20
Post removed Post removed May 2016 #53
How about high crimes, LadeeB? Treason maybe. Not so 7wo7rees May 2016 #19
Witch hunts be damned, the math is *still* the math, and she is STILL LaydeeBug May 2016 #21
Sure. It's okay. We all get it. Why must you all keep screaming? 7wo7rees May 2016 #23
absolutely a witch hunt, and no one is screaming. Just stating the facts. LaydeeBug May 2016 #26
Whose facts, dear one? Your facts? 7wo7rees May 2016 #29
The Math Facts, sweets. None of your tangents negate it. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #39
Okay. Stick with the "math". 7wo7rees May 2016 #41
I don't intend to either. That's what the right wing does. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #44
Are you saying Hillary is a Witch? AzDar May 2016 #38
Well LadeeB keeps insisting it is a "witch" hunt. Don't know? 7wo7rees May 2016 #43
It is a witch hunt. PS. She didn't kill Vince Foster either... LaydeeBug May 2016 #45
Never brought that one up, you did. Real sad. 7wo7rees May 2016 #50
Right?! WTH? AzDar May 2016 #54
Yeah, that one came right out of who the hell knows where!! 7wo7rees May 2016 #56
zzZ... whatchamacallit May 2016 #22
Yes...you can rest assured that Hillary is the presumptive nominee LaydeeBug May 2016 #24
Too bad you don't believe it enough to stop the endless stream of 'math posts' whatchamacallit May 2016 #28
No need to convince anyone of anything. Just stating FACTS. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #40
Yep. Hope and Change, and "Yes we can". 7wo7rees May 2016 #30
I prefer non violence, so no shooting unless you're threatening me or mine LaydeeBug May 2016 #46
I laugh every time a Hillary supporter writes an OP ... hellofromreddit May 2016 #25
People claiming the moral high ground ought not do it while they're standing in quicksand. LaydeeBug May 2016 #27
Check out the link I hid in there. You'll like it. hellofromreddit May 2016 #31
No thank you. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #32
math may be math, but losing is losing quaker bill May 2016 #33
That was the Math on May 10, 2008 as well Proud Public Servant May 2016 #34
I missed it when she contested the primary. But math is still math. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #42
Well then... deathrind May 2016 #35
Well this is total bullshit. You don't get math at all. morningfog May 2016 #47
I get the Math. Bernie needs more delegates than there are available. She has a target of 17% LaydeeBug May 2016 #62
You are still wrong. morningfog May 2016 #63
FACTS AND MATH!!! 7wo7rees May 2016 #49
This message was self-deleted by its author jmousso75 May 2016 #51
Until she either has enough pledged delegates to secure the nomination dflprincess May 2016 #52
... AzDar May 2016 #55
. SusanCalvin May 2016 #60
Not Yet. srobert May 2016 #57
I'mWithMath. oasis May 2016 #61
Presume on your merry way then. Presume. Prezoom. Prezillydillydingdangadong all day long TheKentuckian May 2016 #65
When did the super delegates vote? Vote2016 May 2016 #66
You dont understand the difference between pledged and super delegetes do you? jack_krass May 2016 #68
Well then you can stop your whining! whistler162 May 2016 #69
whining? No sweets, just stating the *facts*. nt LaydeeBug May 2016 #71
I seem to recall a fellow named Karl Rove Blue Owl May 2016 #70
 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
2. No...just *DO* the math. Save your feelings. They've taken a beating
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:37 PM
May 2016

because all those Bern feelers did not turn out to be Bern voters, I'm afraid.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
6. Let me help you: there are not enough delegates left for Bernie to catch up,
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:45 PM
May 2016

let alone win the nomination. He could win each remaining state by 100% and he *still* can't get the nomination.

This means he is helping them, and you know it.

smiley

(1,432 posts)
10. Then it comes down to supers right...
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:55 PM
May 2016

because Clinton won't have a majority either.

And if Sander wins 100% of the remaining primaries (which is the scenario you present), and the supers still stay with Clinton. Then that's fucked up, and you know it.

I know you're probably paid to argue your point, but do yourself a favor and read the link.
http://www.feelthemath.org/

I'm gonna do myself a favor and remove this thread, and you, from my life. I should've never kicked this bullshit.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
13. No, it's not "fucked up", it's called delegate math...
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:11 PM
May 2016

and it's what got HRC in 2008, despite the fact that she had the popular vote. Bernie doesn't even have that. So expecting the supers to usurp the will of the people is crazy, and they're not going to change.

And you know it.

And so does *he*, which is why we are getting a bit less nice.

 

Adrahil

(13,340 posts)
48. Sander could win every remaining primary by 20 points and still lose.
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:48 PM
May 2016

He's WAY behind. Some of you Sandernistas really just need to look at Demrace.com and run the scenarios. Do it. Run them.

And keep in mind that Sanders looks like he's going to come up about 15 points short of his target in WV. And that's in a state very favorable to him.

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
8. Ummm...
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:50 PM
May 2016

Just *GO* to the link. The math was *done* for you.

You would shit your pants, if Bernie gave the Indies a real chance to "feel the Bern" and vote for him after the Dem convention.

That's OK. We're going to retake the Dem party, so that the progressive Indies feel welcome and the conservatives rush back to their own party.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
14. Then let him drop out of the Dem race and make his best Indy run
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:12 PM
May 2016

Math is math. Hillary has won the Democratic nomination. And this is DEMOCRATICUNDERGROUND, not "indybernieunderground"

LiberalFighter

(50,504 posts)
37. Sanders doesn't understand math.
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:32 PM
May 2016

Clinton has nearly 3 million more voters than Sanders.

There has been 6.9 million fewer total voters than in 2008 for states that voted. Where are those millions of new voters?

Clinton has a 284 delegate advantage compared to Obama's 48 advantage in 2008 right after Kentucky.

 

ViseGrip

(3,133 posts)
5. Presumptive from a 41% pre-stack? Many who were not even elected? Even where Bernie won?
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:45 PM
May 2016

Really? Well then this is not the United States anymore. Get back to me when the election fraud is sorted out from several states here as well.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
11. She doesn't have enough delegates
Tue May 10, 2016, 08:56 PM
May 2016

You can say 'math' ad nauseum, but she still doesn't have enough delegates.

 

AgingAmerican

(12,958 posts)
17. She does not have enough delegates
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:17 PM
May 2016

It's that simple. Once she has enough delegates, the fat lady sings.

The fat lady has not sang yet.

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
12. You are right, of course, about the math.
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:07 PM
May 2016

The problem has been and still is HOW she got
to that point.

The issue of the manipulation of the debates,
the irregularities of the voting process, the
changes of rules.
All that reminded me of repugs, not Dems.

Then again, since your candidate now claims
that she has the same values as the repugs,
it makes sense.

LiberalFighter

(50,504 posts)
36. What rule changes?
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:10 PM
May 2016

The rules have been the same for decades and for this convention they were approved late last year.

BainsBane

(53,003 posts)
67. Voter suppression targets people of color
Wed May 11, 2016, 03:40 AM
May 2016

who overwhelmingly support Clinton, just as they overwhelmingly support Democrats in general elections. In AZ those Hispanic districts were targeted because SCOTUS struck down Article V of the Voting Rights Act. The primary was simply a run through for the general election. In fact, voter disenfranchisement throughout the nation always targets people of color,
There is no grand conspiracy against the white bourgeoisie, against exurban and rural voters--areas that support Sanders in the primaries and Republicans in the general elections. Now I understand that the fact voters failed to cast their ballots as you insist they must are enough for you to determine the elections to be invalid because of course the concern has exactly nothing to do with voting rights or full participation but entirely in imposing your wishes over the majority.

The self entitled are certain that the votes of the majority pale in comparison to their own, which is why they have no problem supporting a candidate whose entire argument hinges on winning by overturning the results of elections and seizing the nomination simply because he and his supporters are superior to the 12 million Democratic voters who have cast their votes for Clinton. I don't think it would be fair to call such a value Republican because even the GOP has managed to come around to the idea that the outcome of elections should actually hold. Not Bernie. He wants the superdelegates to nullify those voters, to overturn the electoral will of the majority and impose him as the nominee even though he trails by millions of votes.

In terms of voter disenfranchisement, the system that most limits voter participation is caucuses, where averages only 3.7%. Sanders supporters of course support that system--the most restrictive to full participation that exists because the singular goal is to install Bernie in power so they can wield control over the majority of Americans. That contempt for the will of the majority is made evident through their continued support of Sanders as he argues that the votes of the majority should be overturned to favor his candidacy based on his assessment that corporate polls over actual votes of lowly citizens. I would seem that electoral democracy and the rights of the majority are an obstacle to overcome, not a value to be protected. Given the profoundly anti-democratic and anti-egalitarian values that have become evident through his strategy to seize the nomination, and that you voice no opposition to any of that but rather insist on arguing the votes of the majority are illegitimate, I find your remark about "repug" values ironic, to say the least (especially given all the Trump humping by people claiming to be Sanders supporters on this site). I understand that your candidate and his supporters are certain that they are entitled to rule over the majority of Americans, but we will not submit to those efforts. You're just going to have to face the fact that other people besides you actually count and that Bernie will not be able to carry out regime change at home.

I oppose anyone who undermines voting rights and equal rights, who seeks to overturn elections, regardless of what they call themselves politically. That is a key value I maintain, and that some who oppose those rights call themselves progressives is simply a matter of nomenclature.

sadoldgirl

(3,431 posts)
18. Very easily answered by looking at the
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:19 PM
May 2016

polls of what % of voters trust her in comparison
to SBS.

There are good reasons for that.

I remember many HRC supporters having been
very upset with the tricks DWS has played,

but that all is forgotten by now.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
20. No *poll* can negate or even answer the delegate math.
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:25 PM
May 2016

Nice try though. Hillary has already won the nomination.

Response to LaydeeBug (Reply #20)

7wo7rees

(5,128 posts)
19. How about high crimes, LadeeB? Treason maybe. Not so
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:25 PM
May 2016

much emails or Benghazi or Libya or Honduras. How about pay to play through the SOS and the Clinton Foundation?

Spiro Agnew keeps coming up.....

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
21. Witch hunts be damned, the math is *still* the math, and she is STILL
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:27 PM
May 2016

the presumptive nominee, because there is NO WAY Bernie can win. So all of those things, and Bernie *still* couldn't beat her? Damn. Telling.

7wo7rees

(5,128 posts)
23. Sure. It's okay. We all get it. Why must you all keep screaming?
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:31 PM
May 2016

"She is the presumptive nominee!!" Bernie must concede! Unite!

Oh and by the way, not a witch hunt.

7wo7rees

(5,128 posts)
29. Whose facts, dear one? Your facts?
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:37 PM
May 2016

What about the other facts? Are you truly comfortable with what appears to have been happening with deals being delivered by SOS and donations streaming in to Clinton Foundation?

7wo7rees

(5,128 posts)
41. Okay. Stick with the "math".
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:42 PM
May 2016

You win LaydeeBug. Done.

But you still have not answered my question from above. Pay to play, SOS, Clinton Foundation.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
24. Yes...you can rest assured that Hillary is the presumptive nominee
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:32 PM
May 2016

and sleep comfy knowing that we ran with Obama, and now we're coming home to Mama.

Sleep well!!

whatchamacallit

(15,558 posts)
28. Too bad you don't believe it enough to stop the endless stream of 'math posts'
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:36 PM
May 2016

It's almost like you need to convince yourselves.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
46. I prefer non violence, so no shooting unless you're threatening me or mine
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:47 PM
May 2016

But we're comin' home to Mama!!!

 

hellofromreddit

(1,182 posts)
25. I laugh every time a Hillary supporter writes an OP ...
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:33 PM
May 2016

.. describing what Bernie supporters "think", or "feel", or "are like."

OPs packed with petty insults, weak straw men, mock indignation and self-righteous pontification.

As if such things somehow help their cause in any way.

The reality is that it's this kind of nonsense that caused Bernie supporters to stop taking anything many Hillary supporters seriously.

It's not worth the effort.

Any real argument you might have had is obscured and lost inside the rest of that nonsense.

So stick with that tactic, it's working very well for Hillary.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
27. People claiming the moral high ground ought not do it while they're standing in quicksand.
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:35 PM
May 2016

Good luck.

PS. He lost this, even if he wins each and every one left by 100%

quaker bill

(8,223 posts)
33. math may be math, but losing is losing
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:44 PM
May 2016

Yes it is true that Sec. Clinton could lose her way, all the way from here to a claim on the nomination. What a precious moment that will be.

Proud Public Servant

(2,097 posts)
34. That was the Math on May 10, 2008 as well
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:49 PM
May 2016

And yet Hillary stayed in until two days after the last primary. Guess we should blame her for setting the precedent.

deathrind

(1,786 posts)
35. Well then...
Tue May 10, 2016, 09:56 PM
May 2016

Call the president and tell him we are surrendering our position in Cuba...oh wait...wrong movie.


 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
47. Well this is total bullshit. You don't get math at all.
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:48 PM
May 2016

Dead. Fucking. Wrong.

You need a tutorial and should delete to save embarrassment.

 

LaydeeBug

(10,291 posts)
62. I get the Math. Bernie needs more delegates than there are available. She has a target of 17%
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:38 PM
May 2016

for each state. He needs more than there are.

Writing. Wall.

 

morningfog

(18,115 posts)
63. You are still wrong.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:51 PM
May 2016

He needs 583 more pledged delegates to reach 2,026, which is a majority of all pledged delegates. There are 903 pledged delegates remaining to be allocated.

He has not been mathematically eliminated. Take the time to understand this. He needs 64.5% of the remaining pledged delegates.

While improbable it is not mathematically impossible.

7wo7rees

(5,128 posts)
49. FACTS AND MATH!!!
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:48 PM
May 2016

Now everyone sit down and shut the F up.

Got it, sweetie, loud and clear.

Now can you calm down.

We understand, all of us do, your position. Hillary is the "presumptive" nominee.

Sleep well.

Dream of "we came, we saw, he died" and then laughter.
Dream of Madeline Albright saying a half million kids dead is okay.
Dream of Kissinger is her mentor.

Gives us nightmares.
You, apparently not so much.

Response to LaydeeBug (Original post)

dflprincess

(28,057 posts)
52. Until she either has enough pledged delegates to secure the nomination
Tue May 10, 2016, 10:56 PM
May 2016

or Bernie drops out she is not the presumptive nominee.

 

srobert

(81 posts)
57. Not Yet.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:11 PM
May 2016

Hillary may win enough votes in upcoming primaries, but she has not done so yet, as of tonight's West Virginia primary. Improbable and impossible are not the same thing. Bernie getting the nomination is currently improbable, but still possible. When it becomes mathematically impossible I will tell you so. Forget what people are saying about the math. A lot of misinformation about that is being communicated. Some of it out of ignorance and some of it deliberately. Just vote.

oasis

(49,152 posts)
61. I'mWithMath.
Tue May 10, 2016, 11:32 PM
May 2016

Hillary is in command of the numbers. The sooner folks wake up to reality, the better off THEY will be.

TheKentuckian

(24,949 posts)
65. Presume on your merry way then. Presume. Prezoom. Prezillydillydingdangadong all day long
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:30 AM
May 2016

Knock yourself out.

Put all the periods after words you like too no one gives a solitary fuck even in Paris in the spring time with a lifetime supply of Spanish fly.

 

jack_krass

(1,009 posts)
68. You dont understand the difference between pledged and super delegetes do you?
Wed May 11, 2016, 05:08 AM
May 2016

Bernie could still win majority of pledged delegetes. If he does this, a lot of pressure will be put on supers (many of whom are lobbyists and cronys) to flip.

The fact that HRC has more popular votes is trivia. Its means nothinb.

Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Math is math. Hillary Cli...