2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumClinton should be very concerned right now
Barely 50 percent in Ky. Blown out in Oregon a state she will need in November.
I'd say panic mode is setting in.
Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)Sour grapes are irrelevant at this point.
Skwmom
(12,685 posts)Trust Buster
(7,299 posts)college kids and other slackers instead of earning it themselves. Not hard to figure out his appeal. I think people should earn their own way in life.
disillusioned73
(2,872 posts)(fill in the blank)..
pangaia
(24,324 posts)disillusioned73
(2,872 posts)just wanted to use the power of the theoretical mirror, if I posted this with no context - who does it sound like??
"All that has transpired is that Sanders has promised to make other taxpayers support his college kids and other slackers instead of earning it themselves. Not hard to figure out his appeal. I think people should earn their own way in life."
pangaia
(24,324 posts)RKP5637
(67,030 posts)Silver_Witch
(1,820 posts)Thank you!
Dawgs
(14,755 posts)That's amazing.
Probably hate Social Security and Medicare too.
tex-wyo-dem
(3,190 posts)Bravo!
Careful, your showing your hand
Cal33
(7,018 posts)DefenseLawyer
(11,101 posts)You seem more like an Ayn Rand style Libertarian.
Response to Trust Buster (Reply #17)
frylock This message was self-deleted by its author.
PatrickforO
(14,515 posts)By your logic the higher the level of debt slavery when one of our children graduates from college the less of a slacker they are???
Please.
Instead of that, I have an idea - how about OUR government, OF, BY and FOR us, the people use the tax dollars WE pay in for programs that actually improve the quality of OUR lives instead of paying for useless, criminal shit like the forever war, the war on drugs we lost the minute we declared, private prisons and all the other crap that doesn't help any of us one bit but increases corporate profits.
And, Buster, why have the corrupt worms we've elected to supposedly look out for our interests in DC allowed:
1. Corporations and billionaires to salt away over $20 trillion in UNTAXED profits offshore, and
2. 'Free trade' agreements to offshore hundreds of thousands of jobs - good ones, the kind with pensions and decent benefits that you could raise a family on and have hope to get ahead?
And, last, since the national debt is arguably money we owe ourselves, why are we paying interest on it to bankers??? Instead of that, we should revoke the Fed's charter and begin printing our own money. The argument that such a move would cause inflation is spurious at best; the real danger is the so-called 'respectable' bankers - the people in suits. They will do what the European bankers did to Lincoln - they will flood us with counterfeit money. (Did you know that in 1865 when the Secret Service was created to battle this, about 1/3 of US currency was counterfeit?).
Bottom line? It's time we rethink our social order, Buster, because for too long we've been letting people die for the sake of profits, and letting the earth die a little bit more each day so some old, white, male capitalist can make some money on the backs of his workers and his customers. THAT is what is bullshit, Buster.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
puffy socks
(1,473 posts)yet Bernie is losing by millions of votes.
The argument does not hold water.
caquillo
(521 posts)I'll bet that in June, it will turn to anger, when all is said and done and Sanders is NOT the nominee. As long as the primaries continue, they still have some semblance of hope, which feeds the denial. But after June 7, it will all be over, and with no more contests to look forward to, they'll have to face reality, sooner or later. Unfortunately, this period coincides with the DNC (in late July), and after what happened in NV last weekend, I hope they don't take their anger out violently. Hopefully, they'll have moved on to bargaining by then.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Without a clean bill of legal health, politically, she might as well have Stage 4 cancer.
lagomorph777
(30,613 posts)like they think we can't read. Like the FBI investigation is just a "review"; like the voters in the remaining states can be told to sit out this election.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)I only hope that those who actually run the Democratic Party have already implemented contingency and succession planning that was initiated last Spring when her apparent violation of her Classified Information agreement was first made public. Even a fricking start-up IT company does succession planning before it goes public. It's just mandatory. How can a major political party that claims to represent tens of millions of people be any different?
It's over. The question now, will the party rank and file have any say at all in who replaces Hillary Clinton? From all appearances, the answer to that is no.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)Let's wager... Loser leaves DU.
I think your analysis is risible as are the predictions that emanate from it.
If I performed an analysis and made a prediction based on it and a fellow poster said it was a joke and offered me the wager I offered you I would take it in a New York minute.
LOLINGLY,
DemocratSinceBirth
leveymg
(36,418 posts)You seemed convinced at that time that 793 doesn't apply, and that only 1924, a misdemeanor, might. The gov't subsequently released a copy of her signed Classified Information Nondisclosure Agreement, and low and behold, Sec. 793 is the most cited statute shown on the form as a penalty for her violation of the agreement.
I don't bet, but you seem to enjoy doubling down.
Always a pleasure.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)There is no money involved. There will be no pecuniary gain. One of us brays about things he knows nothing about and the other doesn't. When the person who does the braying is challenged he deflects.
What did Lincoln say? A man who isn't a lawyer yet holds himself out as one makes fools of those who believe him.
"Always a pleasure."
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Have a nice day.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)WhiteTara
(29,676 posts)is the ignore function.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)Maybe you folks will wake up when Comey's report is finally out. She's not a viable candidate. She has done all Democrats enormous harm.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)So informative. Oh wait. They're not.
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)lawyer wannabees.
Dr Hobbitstein
(6,568 posts)But he stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night.
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)Double-down when you're behind, and double-down again when you're broke.
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)try to play one here on DU and you've been called out for it. Nothing ad hominem about that.
puffy socks
(1,473 posts)Uh huh. and you know this how? You pulled that right out of your keester.
It is not the Clinton campaign that has self-destructed.
with all its money, establishment support, name recognition, she's now tied with the most unpopular nominee in polling history. I agree she hasn't imploded, she was always horribly weak, and that reality is now starting to seep in. She isn't trusted (good luck improving that with the massive amount of lying you all have done in the last few days), isn't liked and polls much worse than Sanders versus Trump and much worse with independents. At least her arrow points to the right, at least that is accurate. Her largest donors aren't buying her off, sorry, donating to her campaign so that she governs like Sanders or Warren would.
Dem2
(8,166 posts)Hillary Clinton 46.8% 45.5% 51 1,767
Bernie Sanders 46.3% 54.5% 55 1,488
Reporting 99% 75% 2,383 to win
I appear to be missing the "blowout" aspect to last night - would you care you explain that to me?
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)Dem2
(8,166 posts)Is this what you are hanging your hat on?
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)auntpurl
(4,311 posts)Fawke Em
(11,366 posts)JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)winter is coming
(11,785 posts)JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)I guess CA doesn't matter either.
winter is coming
(11,785 posts)(or stays home altogether), none of the non-swing states "matter". Getting all het up because some people in reliably red or blue states say they're going to go green is silly.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)She should have. It would have helped on the path going forward if she's the nominee. And of course her boosters on DU have been rather insistent that the West Coast does not count, they have been saying 'the people have spoken' since Iowa, then all through her Southern Sweep 'it's over, the people have spoken'. Oregon has spoken. Hopefully our candidates are listening better than their boosters are.
JoePhilly
(27,787 posts)Throughout this primary, Bernie supporters have been trying to decide which states "count" and which don't.
They all count. And Hillary is winning.
And the fact remains ... the people of Oregon are not going to vote for Trump.
Skink
(10,122 posts)He argues Trump could gain some support there
auntpurl
(4,311 posts)That is delusional.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)Your logic is flawed
kaleckim
(651 posts)with the most unpopular nominee in polling history, has historically bad net favorables (would be the most unliked nominee in polling history, already is the most unliked nominee in her party's history), does much worse with independents and polls much, much worse versus Trump than Sanders. You also have done something pretty amazing this election cycle, especially the last few months. You've decided to focus your attacks largely on Sanders' supporters, and not him, which is just brilliant given her already bad polling numbers. You seem to think the left will, like usual, just fall in line anyway, and it won't. I could care less what you say about someone else's logic when this is your own.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)She will beat Trump. As I have said, much to the chagrin of my nemeses on this board and they are legion, I would literally wager my life on that proposition.
kaleckim
(651 posts)wager something you aren't wagering. She, right now, is tied with the most unpopular nominee in polling history. That alone should tell you how horribly weak of a candidate she is. She has historically bad net favorables, is not trusted (and she and her supporters have spent the last few days blatantly lying, so good luck improving that), polls horribly among independents and polls much worse than Sanders versus Trump. Think whatever you want, Trump has a much better chance at beating Clinton than Sanders as we sit today. Her getting more votes from Democrats doesn't change that, and her getting more votes is telling and says a lot about the modern Democratic Party. Your comment is predicated on the fact that you can accurately predict the future (which you can't), or that her numbers will get much better (which is not likely). Wonderful "logic" you got there.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)Nixon and Reagan in their 72 and 84 blowouts didn't even or barely reached those lofty numbers.
NO.TRUMP. FOR. YOU.
Go ahead
wager something you aren't wagering
If you think that wager is unrealistic I am open to others you deem more realistic.
kaleckim
(651 posts)She can get people to not want to vote for her or repel enough people on the left to either not vote or vote for the Greens. You all seem to think that isn't going to happen, and you're all deluded. You've spent the last few days lying, outright lying, and attacking the very people her election hinges on. You also can rationalize things all you want, the polling now shows that she is tied nationally and in key swing states with Trump, the most unpopular nominee in polling history. Her net favorables in places like Florida are over negative 20, and people in those states do no trust her. She is a horrible candidate. She certainly can win, but you're just not being honest with yourself about where she stands today. If that FBI investigation goes wrong or any major scandal breaks between now and November, she's in deep, deep trouble. Think what you want, it isn't logically convincing at all.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)Trump is in a demographic straitjacket.
kaleckim
(651 posts)good luck!
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)kaleckim
(651 posts)is that the actual polls now, the fact that she is the most unpopular Democratic nominee in polling history, the fact that she is not at all trusted, mean nothing. She is tied nationally and in key swing states with the most unpopular nominee in polling history, and you want to ignore all that. There is no logic there, because your argument isn't logical. Head back in the sand with ya, like I said.
Keep up your and the rest of the Clinton crew's shtick too with Sanders supporters, your blatant lies and smear campaigns, and you'll make your situation much worse, if you haven't already.
No point in us doing this back and forth. If you want to respond again and say the same thing, feel free.
DemocratSinceBirth
(99,704 posts)I look at the evidence, objectively and dispassionately, and based on my examination of the evidence it is my considered opinion it is more likely than not Hillary Clinton will defeat Donald Trump.
That is also the consensus of political scientists.
puffy socks
(1,473 posts)wishful thinking
Blow out? Lol!
Whatever.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)Florida was a blowout.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)a big win all the same. Interesting fact about Oregon, Hillary got even less votes here than she did when she lost Oregon to Obama.
NCTraveler
(30,481 posts)It's hard to judge things like that when the nominee is known. I do agree with you that it was a solid win for Sanders. Blowout? Nah.
Neither Sanders or Clinton come even close to the appearance of Obama. He ran what could go down as the best campaign in history.
https://m.
And to cut you off at the pass considering your recent attacks on me, I spoke out loudly against Warren.
HooptieWagon
(17,064 posts)And probably for good reason...Clintons momentum is dead in the water, her numbers continue to drop, and the continued cheating by the DNC and lying by Clinton surrogates is burning the bridges to voters she desparately needs in Nov, but are now gone.
liberal N proud
(60,300 posts)Dem2
(8,166 posts)How many times can you cry wolf?
frylock
(34,825 posts)You think this is fun? You ain't seen shit.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,110 posts)Bernie is not finished yet... the revolution rolls on, all the way to the convention! The super delegates need to wise up to the fact that Hillary is a deeply flawed candidate.
Bernie & Elizabeth 2016!!!
pdsimdars
(6,007 posts)beaglelover
(3,439 posts)We're happy that Hillary has locked down the D nomination for POTUS last night. Bernie didn't do what he needed to do to catch up to Hillary's enormous lead in votes and pledged delegates.
brooklynite
(93,847 posts)liberal N proud
(60,300 posts)Bernie needs 78%, did he achieve that?
Codeine
(25,586 posts)What to wear to her moment of convention triumph? New carpet in the Oval Office? What to call the First Husband?
All pressing questions as she cruises to victory. . .
YouDig
(2,280 posts)her horrific polling numbers and you Clinton supporters' insane, monumentally bad decision to full on lie and attack Sanders' supporters. I'd understand the scorched Earth tactic (strategically, not morally), if she was polling much better than she is versus Trump, was trusted and liked. She is now tied nationally, and in key swing states, with the most unpopular nominee in polling history. What did she and her supporters do when they were caught looking horrible in Vegas? Slime Sanders supporters, lie left and right about them (again, remember the "English only" lie you people put out there months ago, also in Vegas?), then argue that she's fine because they'll all fall in line come November. Beyond tone deaf, this isn't 1994 and you've all massively *ucked up.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)the campaign that thoroughly pounded them, don't you think?
kaleckim
(651 posts)With all your massive establishment and DNC support (and shenanigans), your massive Wall Street and corporate money (the real game changer), her huge advantage in name recognition, her massive institutional power, she's going to barely get by the independent democratic socialist. She's also now tied nationally and in key swing states with the most unpopular nominee in polling history, has historically bad net favorables, isn't trusted (and good luck improving that with your massive lies the last few days), does horribly with independents and is under FBI investigation.
I will give you and those like you credit for one thing: You've invented new ways of sticking your head in the sand.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)Cal33
(7,018 posts)going on. Wait until the results are out, at least, before celebrating.
YouDig
(2,280 posts)Cal33
(7,018 posts)Oh hai!
YouDig
(2,280 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)Did you skip class that day?
YouDig
(2,280 posts)frylock
(34,825 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)He's bailing out the Titanic with a Dixie cup and you're cheering each splash, oblivious to the water up to his armpits.
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)Codeine
(25,586 posts)Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)And we are shaking in our boots. Again.
Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)Stuckinthebush
(10,816 posts)I think we are all laughing over in the Clinton group.
Bernie is history and he is making himself look more and more like an ass every day. He will be a footnote soon.
Tarc
(10,472 posts)I'd say the Clinton campaign is doing fine in cruise control.
Progressive dog
(6,861 posts)followers to harass the Nevada democrats over 2 delegates he wanted stolen from the voters' choice and moved to his column.
Oh wait, you claim it's Hillary that is concerned. Sorry, it's easy to misunderstand fantasies.
Response to Skink (Original post)
Autumn Colors This message was self-deleted by its author.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Two more states over, and Bernie gains no real ground and so he's farther behind because fewer delegates are in the remaining stew.
No way Oregon will vote Trump in November, and Hillary knows that.
I thought she'd lose both, and she campaigned fiercely over 4 days in KY and took the race.
I'd wager she's feeling pretty good this AM.
kaleckim
(651 posts)are feeling good in general, given her horrible polling numbers nationally, they're out of their minds. When people make comments about this primary, realize that they are also looking at her historically bad net favorables (would be the most unpopular major party nominee in history if she runs against someone other than Trump, and she is freaking tied with him as is), not trusted, polls badly with independents, much worse versus Trump. She's also under FBI investigation and is corrupt to her core. Look at the new Republican ad where they focus 100% on her Wall Street corruption. THAT is the person you're all gloating over. Now, what did she and her campaign decide to do when they were caught looking horrible in Vegas, acting in blatantly undemocratic ways? They attacked and lied about Sanders' supporters. Brilliant strategy when her polling numbers are already as bad as they are nationally. I guess you all assume the left will, like they did during her husband's presidency, just fall in line? Don't assume that.
kstewart33
(6,551 posts)Your vote is your own. But let's agree to disagree because we are both firmly committed to our own candidate.
At this point, perhaps it's best to just wait and see what happens. Hillary will win the nomination, but I'm not gloating about it.
What's more interesting is what follows in the general.
jcgoldie
(11,582 posts)[img][/img]
Response to Skink (Original post)
rjsquirrel This message was self-deleted by its author.
pnwmom
(108,925 posts)He got so few extra delegates this time, he's going to need an even higher percentage going forward.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)the East Coast.
I'm totally thrilled myself, as my first goal in a Primary cycle is to see it run through the entire country and raise lots of important issues. So far, so good.
Skink
(10,122 posts)grossproffit
(5,591 posts)KingFlorez
(12,689 posts)He needed to get 70% or more in Oregon to stay track, but he missed that goal greatly.
pangaia
(24,324 posts)I would not want to be around any meeting right about now.
PatrickforO
(14,515 posts)it can to bury Bernie's candidacy, but he keeps WINNING. Why? Because what he's saying makes sense. Because the issues he is bringing up are issues we need to discuss. Because I (and millions of others) are sick of oligarchs stealing our tax money for their profits while we have less and less of the pie. We've been nickel and dimed for decades, and I'm so tired of it I want to puke every time I get a bill or go to the grocery store. Bernie's policies WILL ACTUALLY MAKE MY LIFE BETTER.
That is why I support him, and will continue to support him through a contested convention.
COLGATE4
(14,732 posts)your support will end before then.
Carolina
(6,960 posts)I wish it were only nickels and dimes. We, the people, have been ROBBED big time: housing costs, education costs, healthcare costs, food costs, utility costs, QUALITY of LIFE costs.
Trump and $hillary are agents of that robbery -- they are both of the ROBBER CLASS! The thought of either one in the White House is beyond appalling. Even worse are all the Dems/DINOs who have fallen in line for the Third Way Anointed One whose record is anything but d/Democratic.
onenote
(42,374 posts)Blown out in Virginia, Pennsylvania, Delaware, New York, Ohio and Florida. All states he would need in November.
amborin
(16,631 posts)Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)It is indeed dark days for Hillary supporters like me.
Response to Nye Bevan (Reply #73)
MineralMan This message was self-deleted by its author.
hamsterjill
(15,214 posts)I've been a nervous wreck myself. Compounded, of course, by the NUMEROUS posts I see daily from Sanders supporters swearing that they'll never vote for Hillary. I lose sleep at night worrying about that!!! LOL
QC
(26,371 posts)Going nuts worse than usual, I mean.
RufusTFirefly
(8,812 posts)... she should be wiping the floor with him. (You know, like, with a cloth.)
But instead she's eking out victories or losing outright.
No wonder her supporters are so anxious to end the race prematurely.
The trend is ominous.
Guess it's time for even dirtier tricks from Brock and his confederates.
Hillary Clinton is the kindest, bravest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.
BootinUp
(46,924 posts)Nothing good can come from the crazy being spread within the Democratic Party. Crazy is ignoring the real state of the race. Crazy is when you start sounding like Trump.
RufusTFirefly
(8,812 posts)Not someone who perpetually shifts her positions, has dubious support from independents, is potentially in legal hot water, and is either distrusted or disliked (or both) by an alarming percentage of the electorate.
BootinUp
(46,924 posts)MyNameGoesHere
(7,638 posts)to the second stage. Now it's back to denial. Please get well soon.
beaglelover
(3,439 posts)It's time for Bernie to get out of the race. He now has a less than zero path to the nomination. But he won't because his ego is too big.
leveymg
(36,418 posts)and celebrations. She's not going to exonerated. Now, what do we do? Sure hope someone has been doing some succession planning.
beaglelover
(3,439 posts)leveymg
(36,418 posts)That was at a rally in New Haven just before the election. I was on my father's shoulders. I also remember handing out LBJ bumperstickers. Been doing that sort of thing ever since. Knocked 4000 doors for Obama. Worked for the D-trip, DSCC and numerous candidates along the way.
Hillary is the wrong candidate. She's an unindicted felon who has violated her security clearance. Time to find someone else.
frylock
(34,825 posts)The recommendation is coming down. Bank it.
Ferd Berfel
(3,687 posts)I'd bet many of Bernies people write him in if that have to
okieinpain
(9,397 posts)you, you have problems. i just wonder why that 50 percent waited till now to start talking shiY. lol.
anotherproletariat
(1,446 posts)and who will clearly win over middle America with his atheism.
Think about it. People voted for Trump. That shows how easily the masses are swayed by demonstrations and rhetoric, and Sanders has been capitalizing on this fact for almost a year. Too bad he has no substance behind is promises, or he might have won.
Garrett78
(10,721 posts)Candidates winning states in November that they lost during the primary season is not at all uncommon.
jamese777
(546 posts)Primaries' popular vote totals as of May 18th
Hillary Clinton: 13,177,734
Donald Trump: 11,236,652
Bernie Sanders: 10,131,732
Clinton over Sanders: 3,046,002
Clinton over Trump: 1,941,082
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)So, Senator Sanders, either get control of what is becoming your increasingly unhinged cult or get out of the race. Whatever respect sane liberals had for you is rapidly dwindling, and the damage being inflicted on your reputation may be unfixable. If you cant even manage the vicious thugs who act in your name, you cant be trusted to run a convenience store, much less the country.
Such a tenuous grip on reality. I can only laugh at them at this point.