2016 Postmortem
Related: About this forumInteresting phone call last night.
It was from my 23 year old (not particularly politically active) diesel mechanic son. In fact, I don't think he's ever voted.
"Hi Dad! Did you watch that?"
"Watch what?"
"The debate! I watched the whole thing! It was awesome!"
"How so?"
"Bernie wiped the floor with them - Hillary and... the other three."
"Chaffee, O'Malley and Webb"
"Yeah... Webb... fuck that guy. Anyway, Bernie was awesome! When he was asked a question, he'd think about it for about a second and then answer it, he didn't do that politician redirect thing, you know, tell a story that wasn't related to the question at all. You remember that speech by that Mario guy... 'throw your bodies on the gears...'"
"Mario Savio?"
"Yeah, that guy - he sounded like him - passion and excitement and sincerity. He actually reminds me a little bit of you too."
"Thanks!"
I haven't watched the debate, but find the postgame show to be pretty predictable; The TV machine saying that Hillary totally won, the grass roots donating in mass numbers to Bernie and sentiment at DU entirely polarized because everyone with half a brain knows that Mighty Mouse would totally beat Superman, because speaking in absolutes about the inherently subjective is one of our specialties.
elleng
(130,156 posts)Snotcicles
(9,089 posts)Warren DeMontague
(80,708 posts)zeemike
(18,998 posts)Tbe fix is in...and they are laying the ground work for it.
SusanCalvin
(6,592 posts)The mechanism for it is still in place.
iamthe99
(70 posts)sarge43
(28,939 posts)about the inherently subjective is one of our specialties."
You speak great truth.
WillyT
(72,631 posts)YabaDabaNoDinoNo
(460 posts)Many would agree with your kid
yardwork
(61,418 posts)I hope that your son - and everybody on DU - will vote for the Democratic nominee in the general election.
I don't care if it is Hillary or Bernie. We need to win the White Hiuse. The stakes are incredibly high.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)One of the highlights he mentioned was when Sanders was questioned about Hillary's emails...
"... and Sanders said; 'STFU about the damn emails!'"
Obviously that was paraphrased, but all in all the debate left a big impression on him.
yardwork
(61,418 posts)As a lifelong Socialist who has always lived in red/purple states, I've always had no choice but to vote Democratic. Sanders brings a welcome leftward pressure to the Party.
My fear is that if Hillary is the nominee, angry Bernie supporters will stay home on Election Day, handing the White House to a Republican.
There is a huge difference between the parties. I am old enough to remember 2000, hell, I'm old enough to remember 1968.
SusanCalvin
(6,592 posts)Could never get angry enough to not vote. There's always at least a bad choice and a worse choice. And I was raised to always vote.
That said, the corporate dems and their corporations need to knock off the crap, and not even *think* of trying to steal it directly (for which the mechanism is still in place).
sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)person, which is Bernie, elected.
People are not going to hold their noses anymore, that should be obvious from the last two mid terms. What they did do was to focus on local elections, putting forward the candidates THEY chose and getting progressive issues on local ballots and WINNING.
The entire system IS rigged, and people will no longer contribute to that.
If the Dem party wants to stay relevant, they will make sure to listen to the people. They did not for the last two midterms, continued to push candidates whose only claim to being Dems is the letter after their names. The people rejected them.
Once wasn't for the Dem leadership, they did it again, and lost US both the House and the Senate.
People really are busy now working to end the corrupt system that gave us the terrible policies that created the mess we are now in.
There is no way people are going to participate in perpetuating that anymore.
And if the people get the idea that the leadership of the Dem Party works against Sanders, as they are doing that will only confirm what they already know.
Telling them in advance 'well if we don't get who we wanted, well, okay, we'll take whoever YOU want' is just about the worst strategy ever. The people need to have as much strategy as the Professional political class has now. And that is what is happening.
yardwork
(61,418 posts)sabrina 1
(62,325 posts)voters had to say. As I said, Political LOSE, not because of the voters. They lose when they ignore the people. Even if every DUer, out of rear of violating rules here on an internet blog, were to vote for the Corporate candidate, it wouldn't make a bit of difference, would it?
Maybe instead of using fear tactics, the party started listening, we would still be in control of the House and Senate.
Gmak
(88 posts)I hosted a debate watch party in the heart of Rush Limbaugh land and tho there were only 5 of us, everyone was racking their brains about how we can get his message out in our area. I have 2 grandsons in early 20s who are ready to vote for Bernie, one may even try to get a job with the campaign later this fall, and the dabate and response following it convinced my progressive youngest son, age 51, who has been skeptical that there was a path to the nomination for Bernie, with the Dem establishment against him, that he is the real thing and there is plenty of support for him out there that just hasn't been tapped into yet, due to the mainstream media black-out. I plan to go to IA and canvass for Bernie at least a week in Nov. and again in Dec. One of my guests is talking about setting up his vacant rental house here as a voter registration location in a depressed part of town. We'll see what happens, things could cool down, but don't bet on it! I have never seen folks as fired up about a politician.
Helen Borg
(3,963 posts)mountain grammy
(26,571 posts)And you too, Dad.
Fast Walker 52
(7,723 posts)lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)I showed him that speech when he was about 15.
He obviously listened better than I thought he did at the time.
mountain grammy
(26,571 posts)But all three of mine are voting for Sanders. I did that right!
Aerows
(39,961 posts)It sounds like you raised a son who can think for himself and doesn't need pundits to tell him what to think.
Kudos to you both, and thank you for sharing that!
panader0
(25,816 posts)It sounds like your son is becoming politically active.
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)"Who is that one guy... the old gray haired guy?"
"Besides Sanders?"
"Yeah - the skinny one."
"Lincoln Chaffee?"
"Yeah, him - I really didn't like him, especially all that political redirect crap"
I thought it interesting that the 62 year old Chaffee was "the old guy".
Gamecock Lefty
(698 posts)"Bernie wiped the floor with them?"
Not even close and certainly not true for anybody that actually watched.
By the way, my Grandma (not even interested in politics) called me last night and asked me if I watched the debate. She said Hillary wiped the floor with those imposters. She even went to a restaurant afterwards wearing a newly-purchased Hillary button and EVERYBODY in the restaurant started clapping and asking how they, too, could get one.
See how easy that was for me to write?
lumberjack_jeff
(33,224 posts)reformist2
(9,841 posts)Grandma, not interested in politics, watched the debate, then bought a Hillary button (where?), then went to a restaurant, and was applauded by EVERYBODY?
LOL!
pinstikfartherin
(500 posts)He and I, no matter whether we disagree or not, have always been able to talk about politics and religion in a sane, calm manner, completely different from the rest of my right wing family. A while back he told me that when I was a teen and went through my "goth" phase, he initially was put off because of stereotypical thinking, but it also opened his eyes and made him see things differently. Recently, we began talking about politics. We believe many of the same things (disagree on many others), but we don't always agree on how to get there. Last night we spoke after the debate about how everyone did, their responses, etc. He got quiet at one point and said: "I'm going to be honest with you" ...long pause... "why not Bernie?"
Jaw hit floor. It gives me hope that Bernie can reach the sane people who, let's face it, lean left or right depending on the issue.
It's a nice contrast to my mother who loves to throw at me "be glad I'm was pro-life" when she had me at 15. Yep, that's why we don't have a close relationship, mom.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)KoKo
(84,711 posts)ChisolmTrailDem
(9,463 posts)That's not a scientific anecdote!
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)That is unequivocally 100% incorrect. Period.