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Gender: Female
Hometown: Georgia
Member since: 2002
Number of posts: 20,855

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Yes. Systemic failure is a perfect description.

For the most part, almost anybody can listen to police comms with scanners or online apps, and people did at the time.

If the police themselves aren't listening, wth? It's a bit odd that there's a police jurisdiction for the school alone, separate from the community. I'm still not quite clear about the distinction, but if police - any police, anywhere - are somehow not receiving pertinent 911 information in real time and that doesn't become a public issue until a school shooting occurs, it's an issue that's been ignored until it's not possible to ignore it any longer.

Every excuse just points out the incompetence in starker relief.

So, the situation could have gone on even longer

if Border Patrol hadn't taken things into their own hands.

If you don't remember who Pete Arredondo is, that might be because he's been quiet as a mouse since a couple of terse briefings on May 24. Can't imagine why he hasn't spoken since. Also can't imagine why he still has a job.


The Uvalde School District police chief is Pedro “Pete” Arredondo.

“A decision was made that this was a barricaded subject situation,” McCraw said of the incident commander’s “thought process” at the time.

At the same time, children inside Robb Elementary School classrooms 111 and 112 in Uvalde repeatedly called 911 and pleaded for help, he said. They were in the middle of the deadliest school shooting since the 2012 Sandy Hook massacre.

“From the benefit of hindsight where I’m sitting now, of course it was not the right decision,” McCraw said of the supervisor’s call not to confront the shooter. “It was the wrong decision. Period. There’s no excuse for that.”

Pressed by reporters whether Arredondo was on the scene during the shooting, McCraw declined to comment.

The 3 day transformation of Gov Greg Abbott:

1. Listen to my sweet, sweet lies and we can all move on soon.

2. No, wait! Those weren't my lies! Somebody else lied to me! Yeah, that's the ticket!

3. Uh... want some cash?



The true nature of police in the US

Start of thread from Chaos Bride Kyelaag @Monstrous_Fest:

Easy read version on Threadreader:

Some snippets:

Police are never, and will never be, required to endanger themselves in any way for any reason. This has been litigated thoroughly. [snip]

No cops 'confronted' the shooter, because they could have gotten hurt. No cops entered the school, because they could have gotten hurt. [snip]

"To protect and serve" is not a statement of duty. No cop is required to protect or to serve. Most of us have some perception of a "good cop" who has responsibilities.

That is fiction. [snip]

In Uvalde, this is what happened. Cops were seen by civilians, and they did what cops do. They protected themselves, and then controlled the most convenient source of risk to their jobs - the civilians that saw them.

And then they lied about it. Poorly.

Gee, if only there were some way to deal with domestic terrorism.

Senate GOP Blocks Domestic Terrorism Bill

Why Don’t We Know Much About Right-Wing Terrorists? Conservatives Fired The Guy Studying Them.

Edited: You were right, Roland. He used his job to save up the money.

Minimum wage in TX is $7.35 an hour. At most, Salvador Ramos might have been making close to $10 an hour at Wendy's. Maybe.


Even working full time and putting every penny toward saving up almost $2000 dollars to buy that one gun (he had two) as well as the ammo, it would take a while and show some serious desire for harm and mayhem. If he paid for the guns and ammo with his own money from a low paying job, it just shows how determined he was to kill somebody, lots of little defenseless somebodies.

Edit to add:

You were right, Roland. Ramos got a job at Wendy's specifically to save up for the guns and ammo. The Sun is not the greatest source, but I think it's accurate on this point.


Cruz exclusively told The US Sun that Ramos openly talked about how he was using the money from the job to buy guns and ammo and suddenly quit weeks before the school shooting after making enough.

It has been estimated that the teen would have spent around $4,000 on his weapons, ammunition and tactical-style vest. [snip]

"He told us he was saving up money for guns and ammo. We would ask him, ‘Why would you spend your money on that, spend it on a car or something useful,’" Cruz said, adding that Ramos quit after he had saved enough.

Wow. *sigh*

Excellent article. It's unreal that DHS allows this to continue to fester.

DHS’s caution or avoidance, as its critics claim, may partly stem from worries that aggressive intelligence operations could be seen as civil liberties violations. A DHS official explained that “unlike international terrorism, there are no designated domestic terrorist groups. Subsequently, all the legal actions of an identified extremist group leading up to an act of violence are constitutionally protected and not reported on by DHS.”

There is a certain point past which the Constitution does not protect hate speech. Regarding the purported hesitance to monitor and report on these groups - oh, please. It's insulting to pretend there aren't umpteen government agencies monitoring and reporting the hell out of all of us.


The First Amendment doesn’t give people the right to make direct, personal threats of immediate violence. This can include intimidating symbolic actions like burning a cross that are meant to make specific victims fear for their lives, even if the cross-burners don’t actually plan to carry through with the threat (Virginia v. Black, 538 U.S. 343 (2003)). [snip]

As the law stands now, government (including public colleges and universities) generally can’t bar hate speech unless it’s direct, personal, and either truly threatening or violently provocative. At the same time, laws against hate crimes don’t violate the First Amendment, because they’re based on actions rather than expressions of an opinion (Wisconsin v. Mitchell, 508 U.S. 476 (1993)).

As for the lack of designated domestic terrorist groups, it's well past time to start designating them. The SPLC could help out with that.


The SPLC is the premier U.S. organization monitoring the activities of domestic hate groups and other extremists – including the Ku Klux Klan, white nationalists, the neo-Nazi movement, antigovernment militias and others.

We track more than 1,600 extremist groups operating across the country. We publish investigative reports, train law enforcement officers and share key intelligence, and offer expert analysis to the media and public.

- Hate Map: There are 733 hate groups currently operating in the US. [snip]
- Extremist Files: A database on prominent extremist groups and individuals
- 100 Days in Trump's America: A report on white nationalists and their agenda to infiltrate the mainstream
- Terror From The Right: A synopsis of radical-right terrorist plots, conspiracies and racist rampages since the Oklahoma City bombing in 1995. It includes a roster of murdered law enforcement officials.

Right you are. And none of the people proposing this have even thought

of a certain unavoidable requirement that makes the entire conversation moot. (Aside from the fact that the idea is absolutely crazy.) Take dozens of armed civilians looking after hundreds of school children and go find an insurance company willing to provide any sort of affordable liability coverage - no, any coverage at all.

Not going to happen, not in a billion years. Nor should it.

The whole idea is beyond ridiculous.

But some of the Uvalde police did run in to get their own children out.


Specific remarks at 1:17 in the video below. The officer speaking flies through the comment affirming this, but the acknowledgement is there.


The investigation had better be just as brutal as the calculated choice these officers made.

Why am I not surprised that Abbott is the type to climb a few rungs

and then pull up the ladder behind him? It's a shame what happened to him, but what a piece of work that he has so little regard for others in similar situations.
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