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iris27

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Member since: Mon Jul 14, 2008, 12:01 AM
Number of posts: 1,951

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Where is this from? I'm curious to read the whole article.

From what I can see here, I'd agree that it's crap. If she wanted to write an article critiquing the sexism of "New Atheism", all she'd have to do is look at the personal views of Dawkins and Hitchens. No need for the wild speculation that begins the excerpt.

Both of the women-authored books she mentions are more of a "history of non-belief" than a systematic takedown of arguments for theism. As you say, "The God Delusion" is really what vaulted Dawkins to the front of the "movement", so to speak. And "God Is Not Great" is really the work that popularized Hitchens. Histories are less controversial, harder to find offensive.

I agree with you that feminism is generally down on organized religion, for the simple fact that organized religion is largely down on women. Most self-identified feminists who haven't decided to turn a blind eye to the faith they grew up in (which many do), are either without religion or into some sort of vague paganistic Mother Earth/Gaia/Goddess sort of spirituality.

Also, while author is arguing that women are - what? - more conciliatory? - less anti-establishment?...she is overlooking probably the single most confrontational public atheist out there - Ayaan Hirsi Ali. Maybe it's because Ali's main target is Islam instead of Christianity, I don't know. But I do know that you'll never see Dawkins publicly calling Christianity "a destructive, nihilistic cult of death (that) legitimates murder." She does NOT hold back!

It can be a place for both. Much of the OP content in R/T was posted by maybe 5 members, 2-3 of

whom posted multiple OPs a day. If you'd like it to be a place for believers of any stripe to discuss religion, start threads along those lines, and keep starting them. The rare threads of that nature that were posted in RT were treated respectfully. I'm specifically remembering one member's post about being unsure whether the baptism they received as an infant in one Christian denomination was sufficient now that they were joining another denomination as an adult.

Now, it won't ONLY be a place for that type of discussion, because there is a genuine need for a place to discuss religious hegemony in politics and public life, and the admins decided long ago to relegate all such threads to R-T/R instead of GD/Soapbox.

But I think it's a place where both can co-exist.

Only Christians allowed to celebrate Christmas?

After all the War on Christmas brouhaha, I have to admit, this was one I'd never come across before.

On another message board I frequent, a woman complained bitterly about "these non-Christians who claim to celebrate Christmas". I explained to her the basic history of solstice/Yule/Saturnalia celebrations, that the timing of Christmas was originally chosen to capitalize on existing mid-winter festivals, and that most non-Christians who celebrate just think of it as a time to focus on friends, family and charity.

She came back and said that would be like if she chose to celebrate Passover or Diwali as a time with friends and family, that she still didn't see the point.

I said that Christmas is nearly ubiquitous in American culture, and most of us grew up celebrating it, and may still have family who are religious and celebrate the holiday with that in mind -- family who would be disappointed if we stayed home. I said if she had grown up Jewish but no longer believed, she might indeed still attend her family's seder to spend time with them, or even host her own to teach her children about their heritage, if not any religious beliefs.

I said that ultimately, for me, I celebrate the solstice and don't have a problem with calling it Christmas, because after all, the common English name for the holiday where Christians celebrate the resurrection is Easter, after a pagan fertility goddess.

She pretty much ignored that, and continued to insist that we had no right to the name "Christmas", because after all, "CHRISTmas", yada yada... I gave up at that point.

I'm thoroughly confused. Folks like this want all cashiers and bank tellers and waitstaff they encounter in December to ONLY say "Merry Christmas"...but apparently no one is allowed to celebrate Christmas unless they believe in the literal truth of the nativity?
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