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unblock

(52,185 posts)
56. wow, that was a pointlessly obnoxious post.
Sat Jan 26, 2019, 11:12 PM
Jan 2019

congratulations, you found a grand total of one article linking to an analysis of two lawyers who argue that a wealth tax is constitutional.

gee, it's always so hard to find lawyers on either side of an issue.

it's actually in interesting read, but johnsen & dellinger's argument rests on the argument that as apportioning a wealth tax to the states based on each state's population (as is the constitution's requirement on direct taxes) would be unfair, it can be ignore.

that is, in order to comply, states with equal population would have to, in the aggregate each pay the same amount to the federal government. so let's say the federal government wanted to make every billionaire pay a billionaire's tax to the federal government. if there are 10 billionaires in one state and 5 billionaires in another state, but both states have the same overall population, then the billionaires in the 5-billionaire state would have to pay twice the tax that the billionaires in the 10-billionaire state would pay, so that the state total was the same.

that would be manifestly unfair, so johnsen & dellinger argue that this means that the constitutional requirement to apportion such taxes based on population can simply be ignored.

that's not a very compelling argument. which is not to say the supreme court has never used such logic (or worse), but it's hardly compelling.

moreover, as you point out, today's court makeup doesn't think like that at all. this is rather far from "originalist" thinking. at a minimum, i would agree with your assessment that today's court would find it unconstitutional, whether out of bias, originalist thinking, or other reasoning.


as for jefferson, i can find no evidence that he ever thought a direct tax on wealth was constitutional. he may have felt it would be a good *policy*, but i can't find anything that suggests he thought it was permitted by the constitution, particularly before the 16th amendment.


as for wanting my bona fides, that's really weak sauce considering that you haven't volunteered yours. moreover, what compels you to even respond on an internet message board if you're going to dismiss arguments out of hand. not interested in my comments if i'm not a constitutional scholar? find, but then, why post anything in response at all? just ignore me if you think my opinion if worthless.

if you really care, i am not a lawyer, but i helped my mom go through law school when i was in high school. i found my own school work a bore so i spent far more time reading he law books and helping her study. in high school and college, i debated competitively, sometimes on constitutional issues. most of my career has been working closely with lawyers. usually not officially on constitutional issues, but constitutional topics do come up in conversation from time to time, particularly if something's in the news. so not licensed, but pretty knowledgeable for a lay person.

and you?


as for declaring victory for yourself, by all means, feel free to think that awarding yourself a victory means something.




more vlyons Jan 2019 #1
MORE. n/t Brainstormy Jan 2019 #2
Her Wealth Tax swings me over. safeinOhio Jan 2019 #3
More...If it makes her less electable then we are well and truly fucked anyway BeyondGeography Jan 2019 #4
It all depends on how it is packaged and sold. nycbos Jan 2019 #5
I always thought we should ask for safeinOhio Jan 2019 #11
And, she can't back down from it Cosmocat Jan 2019 #18
As long as she can defend it in clear and unequivocal terms, I say more... doompatrol39 Jan 2019 #6
Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos and Warren Buffett are wealthier than poorest half of US exboyfil Jan 2019 #14
Wealthy right wing billionaires will try to destroy her over it DBoon Jan 2019 #7
More, for me... Wounded Bear Jan 2019 #8
Who would it apply to ? rickford66 Jan 2019 #9
Really good question about the practicality exboyfil Jan 2019 #13
It only applies to households with a net worth above $50 million and the tax is on Autumn Jan 2019 #15
Read this article. It addresses many of these questions. rgbecker Jan 2019 #16
it won't apply to anyone, because it's unconstitutional. unblock Jan 2019 #19
Where was it ruled unconstitutional? kcr Jan 2019 #24
not sure it's ever been tried, so i don't know if there's any precedent. unblock Jan 2019 #32
I wonder if Elizabeth Warren knows any Constitutional scholars she could consult. Hassin Bin Sober Jan 2019 #35
i'm sure she could think of one or two unblock Jan 2019 #37
How does Article one figure in here? Hassin Bin Sober Jan 2019 #38
my understanding is that generally federal taxes have to be per capita unblock Jan 2019 #39
Didn't they just change tax exemptions and rates without a constitutional amendment? Autumn Jan 2019 #29
the *income* tax is constitutional, thanks to the 16th amendment. unblock Jan 2019 #31
Your contention is refuted PDittie Jan 2019 #42
it's not "refuted". unblock Jan 2019 #44
Well, absent the PDittie Jan 2019 #45
wow, that was a pointlessly obnoxious post. unblock Jan 2019 #56
I think it is an idea that should have been discussed exboyfil Jan 2019 #10
More. I was kind of indifferent to her before but I think it's a great idea. Luciferous Jan 2019 #12
More. I think people have wanted this for a long time but too many dems SweetieD Jan 2019 #17
Also, even as a negotiation tactic....more of this please..... doompatrol39 Jan 2019 #20
Most of you are too focused on what YOU like! How are the folks that elected Trump likely to vote? Towlie Jan 2019 #21
So we should test market our ideas with the very rich first? BeyondGeography Jan 2019 #22
Neither. Policies don't really sway voters (nt) Recursion Jan 2019 #23
Sadly this is true. EllieBC Jan 2019 #28
I think it helps her. The gullible public is finally moving on from the "Job Creators" fantasy jalan48 Jan 2019 #25
More! lark Jan 2019 #26
It all depends on how the message is crafted. EllieBC Jan 2019 #27
It's already crafted. Her bullet points are like "think what we could do with that money." Towlie Jan 2019 #40
IIRC, her proposal wouldn't kick in until $50 million. Bleacher Creature Jan 2019 #30
Her electability will not rest on only one thing. PoindexterOglethorpe Jan 2019 #33
Frame how the proceeds will be used Bayard Jan 2019 #34
I would say more peggysue2 Jan 2019 #36
I doubt it will make much of a difference DFW Jan 2019 #41
More, imho DeminPennswoods Jan 2019 #43
More. If explained right and she is a former teacher karynnj Jan 2019 #46
more Hermit-The-Prog Jan 2019 #47
I think it really depends on how she presents her ideas Crunchy Frog Jan 2019 #48
Depends on how she frames it. LiberalFighter Jan 2019 #49
99% of voters are not in the wealthiest 1%. lagomorph777 Jan 2019 #50
More. Much more. guillaumeb Jan 2019 #51
This message was self-deleted by its author Eliot Rosewater Jan 2019 #52
If the wealthiest want to acquire most of the wealth, then they should democratisphere Jan 2019 #53
More. shanny Jan 2019 #54
No impact oberliner Jan 2019 #55
More, I full support it and I think that current structural issues (aka Trump needing to be removed) Celerity Jan 2019 #57
more questionseverything Jan 2019 #58
She is doing it wrong. She should sell it as deficit reduction to save Social Security & Medicare KWR65 Jan 2019 #59
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