General Discussion
In reply to the discussion: Post removed [View all]ehrnst
(32,640 posts)or have access to the empirical data that is available to Speaker Pelosi and the House Judiciary Committee.
Neither of us has the experience that the members of that committee and Speaker Pelosi have in matters of procedure, and access to expert counsel on matters of law, especially as it concerns the House.
Frankly, I think that the OP is exactly what the GOP and Putin hope for. Puting Pelosi in a lose/lose position - because she will stay the course on what she believes will give the best outcome for everyone, and people like those in the OP will try to make trash her if she doesn't put their needs for reassurance front and center. If does make that her priority, instead of doing what her long years in the House and advisors tell her is the best path forward, and give the GOP what they want. Thankfully, she's not running for higher office, which is ideal for a speaker - no need to pander to get nationwide votes for the next election...
We also need to be aware that there may not be a solution that gets him out of office other than elections. We are in damage control mode. There may only be a choice between something that sucks, and something that is utterly catastrophic. Much like doing what it took to get that emergency funding bill into existence was.
I think that people who have seen much privilege in their lives - I'm talking white privilege, male privilege, - will not accept something that isn't geared towards their approval. If they like it, then that means it's the right choice. If they are not pleased with it, then obviously they are BEING JERKED AROUND by somebody who is FAILING to do the RIGHT THING!!
I hear it when I point out the problems in Medicare for All.. "Well there HAS to be SOME way to get everyone free health care for free, in the next few years! Things are terrible!!!! It's just not fair! We HAVE to fix it! That just can't be TRUE! If we WANT it enough, it will come to be!" As though pointing out the problems "jinxes" something that was otherwise totally going to happen...
There is this thing called a "wicked problem"
A wicked problem is a social or cultural problem that is huge and difficult or impossible to solve for as many as four reasons: incomplete or contradictory knowledge, the number of people and opinions involved, the large economic burden, and the interconnected nature of these problems with other problems. Sometimes solving one aspect of it creates other problems.
Just like there was no satisfactory answer to the wicked problem of what happens to slaves after emancipation. Whites would prey on them if they lived in or near white communities - with complicity of law enforcement, putting them on a ship to Africa with no ability to read or even speak a language that would enable them to flourish would also doom them.
So, it was decided that being preyed upon by white people was better than slavery, and better than dumping them in a foreign land with no familiarity with that culture. And slavery was replaced with Jim Crow.
There may also be no way to prevent more children from dying at the border, and there may be no way to repair the damage done to those children by the trauma they continue to be subjected to. And there may not ever be access to affordable health care for everyone in the U.S, and there may be homeless people for centuries to come, and there may be no solution to the issue of the Gaza strip that doesn't enrage one of those involved... however I will fight and raise my voice, and do everything I can, but I will understand in a wicked problem that no, there will likely be no solution that doesn't give someone the short end of the stick. Like the ones that are most vulnerable - because they don't run things.
Just like this goddamned thread - where some people (who won't be the vulnerable ones getting hurt) say "just shut it all down! People will get hurt but it will teach the GOP a LESSON!!"
Because someone told them that there's a simple answer, and by God, they're entitled to their simple answer RIGHT NOW!!
That's why NONE of the Senators running for office would TOUCH that Senate emergency funding bill, let alone vote for it, because it's best to just stay away from that reality in an election year. Voting AT ALL for the option you think will do the least harm in a selection of awful options (a wicked problem) will be weaponized by your political opponents as "choosing an awful option" even though there no better ones. The "purest" thing to do was to do "nothing," in this case because you would be either accused of "collaborating with the GOP" or "voting against" helping those kids at the border even in a small way.
Anyone who tells you that there was a "right way" to vote on that is ignorant of the Wicked problem. I admire Pelosi for carrying on, despite the rage of those who had no better option, but thought that she should have chosen it.