HomeLatest ThreadsGreatest ThreadsForums & GroupsMy SubscriptionsMy Posts
DU Home » Latest Threads » Forums & Groups » Main » General Discussion (Forum) » James Carville is speakin... » Reply #11

Response to Ferryboat (Original post)

Thu Apr 29, 2021, 10:55 AM

11. In all the time I've been following politics

Democrats have never not had a messaging problem (I'll say with the exception of Barack Obama in 2008).

It seems to me that that's because Republican voters simply do not care when their elected officials lie to them -- in fact, they find it comforting. So a Republican voter can be sold on any bullshit message that their politicians want to sell. Al Gore invented the Internet! ​John Kerry abandoned his swift boat colleagues! Hillary Clinton something something email server and kidnapping children!

Democratic voters don't like to be lied to by their leaders, and won't buy into a campaign built on lies. So right there, the GOP has an advantage, because as the old saying goes, "A lie can travel around the world and back again while the truth is lacing up its boots."

Any discussion of messaging and how Democrats are bad at it needs to start with the understanding that we're already fighting with one hand tied behind our backs.

That said, I like Carville, but the fact is that by complaining about "wokeness" he himself is buying into GOP framing. Older Democrats will hear what he's saying and think, "Carville is right, I don't know what this wokeness stuff is all about but it sure seems like something the Republicans are making fun of a lot." Younger Democrats -- who understand in their guts that "wokeness" is just another word for "empathy" -- will read it and wonder why some old has-been is telling them what language to use. All this discussion does is drive further inter-party division.

So what bothers me a bit about pieces like this is that Carville should be using his time to knock down these BS Republican talking points, not reinforce them. It should be easy enough for a poltical maven like him to flip this argument around and talk about how Republicans have no empathy. But he didn't do that.

In fact, I did find it rather ironic that in an interview in which he complains about Democrats' failure to frame things properly, he says his colleagues won't speak up, "because they’ll get clobbered or canceled." Note how he just casually uses another piece of Republican framing ( "canceled" ) without even thinking about it.

Edit: I'm going to add to this post because I also want to propose a solution. The solution is simple: Counterattack, Counterattack, Counterattack.

You don't fight this:

REPUBLICANS: "Wokeness is a problem! Cancel culture is a problem! Political correctness is a problem!"

With this:

CARVILLE: "Wokeness is a problem. Cancel culture is a problem. Political correctness is a problem."

And again, a maven like Carville should know this. He could have easily sidestepped these questions, and come back to trash the GOP up and down for their racism, hatred, and general lack of empathy. Instead, he decided that he wanted to use this platform to publicly ponder the merits of the GOP approach and how we Democrats are failing to tailor our response to better meet their needs. Which to be honest doesn't seem a million miles away from the "Faculty lounge politics" he's also complaining about.

Reply to this post

Back to OP Alert abuse Link to post in-thread

Always highlight: 10 newest replies | Replies posted after I mark a forum
Replies to this discussion thread
Arrow 126 replies Author Time Post
Ferryboat Apr 29 OP
dixiechiken1 Apr 29 #1
Ms. Toad Apr 29 #2
USAFRetired_Liberal Apr 29 #3
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #5
BComplex Apr 29 #34
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #39
Caliman73 Apr 29 #63
brooklynite Apr 29 #42
Make7 Apr 29 #4
Ninga Apr 29 #6
Baitball Blogger Apr 29 #7
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #103
Baitball Blogger Apr 30 #109
StarfishSaver Apr 30 #116
Baitball Blogger Apr 30 #117
StarfishSaver Apr 30 #121
Baitball Blogger Apr 30 #123
CrispyQ Apr 29 #8
Eyeball_Kid Apr 29 #26
cinematicdiversions Apr 29 #84
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #89
cinematicdiversions Apr 29 #92
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #104
brush Apr 29 #9
Sugarcoated Apr 29 #41
CrackityJones75 Apr 29 #62
uponit7771 Apr 29 #82
brush Apr 29 #97
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #106
CrackityJones75 Apr 30 #118
uponit7771 Apr 29 #81
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #88
uponit7771 Apr 29 #80
gulliver Apr 29 #10
pandr32 Apr 29 #38
CrackityJones75 Apr 29 #64
uponit7771 Apr 29 #74
LineReply In all the time I've been following politics
EarlG Apr 29 #11
ibegurpard Apr 29 #14
abqtommy Apr 29 #15
gratuitous Apr 29 #18
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #20
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #19
LizBeth Apr 29 #23
cynical_idealist Apr 29 #28
Eyeball_Kid Apr 29 #29
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #32
uponit7771 Apr 29 #59
Whiskeytide Apr 29 #77
uponit7771 Apr 29 #78
Whiskeytide Apr 29 #98
utopian Apr 29 #30
wryter2000 Apr 29 #31
uponit7771 Apr 29 #83
uponit7771 Apr 29 #57
OneGrassRoot Apr 29 #65
DallasNE Apr 29 #75
demmiblue Apr 29 #86
Cha Apr 30 #102
Politicub Apr 29 #12
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #107
Politicub Apr 30 #124
ibegurpard Apr 29 #13
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #108
joetheman Apr 29 #16
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #110
johnp3907 Apr 29 #17
Me. Apr 29 #21
uponit7771 Apr 29 #22
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #111
uponit7771 Apr 30 #114
LetMyPeopleVote Apr 29 #24
LeftInTX Apr 29 #43
LetMyPeopleVote Apr 29 #68
LeftInTX Apr 29 #73
Cha Apr 30 #101
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 29 #25
KG Apr 29 #33
demmiblue Apr 29 #85
Wounded Bear Apr 29 #27
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #112
KG Apr 29 #35
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #113
Celerity Apr 29 #36
BobTheSubgenius Apr 29 #37
Hortensis Apr 29 #40
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #44
Hortensis Apr 29 #51
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #52
czarjak Apr 29 #45
Pinback Apr 29 #46
johnp3907 Apr 29 #54
jalan48 Apr 29 #47
Lonestarblue Apr 29 #48
LeftInTX Apr 29 #49
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #56
Ford_Prefect Apr 29 #50
Duppers Apr 29 #53
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #58
Martin Eden Apr 29 #55
Dawson Leery Apr 29 #60
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 29 #87
CrackityJones75 Apr 29 #61
DallasNE Apr 29 #66
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #70
Buckeye_Democrat Apr 29 #72
andym Apr 29 #67
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #71
Wingus Dingus Apr 29 #76
uponit7771 Apr 29 #79
andym May 1 #126
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #91
Cuthbert Allgood Apr 29 #93
joshcryer Apr 29 #69
bigtree Apr 29 #90
StarfishSaver Apr 29 #94
bigtree Apr 29 #95
Iggo Apr 29 #96
dixiechiken1 Apr 29 #99
Voltaire2 Apr 30 #100
StarfishSaver Apr 30 #105
Demsrule86 Apr 30 #115
FlyingPiggy Apr 30 #119
RegularJam Apr 30 #120
dixiechiken1 Apr 30 #122
StarfishSaver Apr 30 #125
Please login to view edit histories.