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crickets

(25,959 posts)
24. Politics, timing, and cost overruns.
Fri Sep 17, 2021, 09:01 PM
Sep 2021

Australia wanted to keep sub construction in Australia, which was costlier and contributed to delays. France's Naval Group won the contract for the sub build, but the project was again delayed by a request for an extension. Concerns about the situation, as well as rumblings about pulling out of the agreement with France, have been going on for years. This is not the quite the big surprise France is claiming, but it could have been handled better.

Design on future submarines hits nine month delay 01/14/20
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/design-on-future-submarines-hits-nine-month-delay-20200114-p53rd2.html

Naval Group takes next step with Australia but its position is still in danger 09/10/2021
https://www.navyrecognition.com/index.php/naval-news/naval-news-archive/2021/september/10688-naval-group-takes-next-step-with-australia-but-its-position-is-still-in-danger.html

‘Lost the plot’: How an obsession with local jobs blew out Australia’s $90 billion submarine program 09/14/2021
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/lost-the-plot-how-an-obsession-with-local-jobs-blew-out-australia-s-90-billion-submarine-program-20210913-p58r34.html

Australia to Pass France's Naval Group; Looks to the U.S., U.K. for Nuclear Submarines 09/16/2021
https://www.defenseworld.net/news/30440/Australia_to_Pass_France_s_Naval_Group__Looks_to_the_U_S___U_K__for_Nuclear_Submarines

Why Did the Deal with Naval Group Collapse?

Australia’s Ministry of Defence recommended three contenders for the competitive evaluation process, and it picked French shipbuilder Naval Group as the eventual winner. The company won the Collins-class replacement program, also known as SEA1000, in 2016 with its Shortfin Barracuda Block 1A design. This conventionally powered diesel-electric submarine is based on a scaled-down version of the nuclear-powered Barracuda (Suffren) design that is now entering French Navy service.

The Australian media have long been reporting citing sources in the Defence Ministry that the deal with Naval Group to build a dozen submarines for the Navy was not making progress.

It is said to be due to a combination of reasons, including cost blowouts, missed delays and political. Since negotiations with France began, Australia has had three prime ministers, three deputy PMs, three failed treasurers, five defence ministers and four ministers for defence industry. Of the 15 individuals to have held these portfolios, seven have left the Parliament.

While the project was initially estimated to cost between $20-25 billion, it is now reportedly pegged at around $65 billion (AUS$90 billion). France, meanwhile, is said to be paying $10.2 billion for six Barracudas for its own Navy.

Even the idea of building a submarine powered by a diesel-electric engine was considered a fail.

They're upset because they were already counting the 44 billion this deal was supposed to bring t Fullduplexxx Sep 2021 #1
Yeah, I thought it was about business PJMcK Sep 2021 #4
It's just a guess but that deal was worth a lot to France Fullduplexxx Sep 2021 #15
Your Guess Is Spot On ProfessorGAC Sep 2021 #22
France was going to sell them submarines for big money. dawg Sep 2021 #2
Figures PJMcK Sep 2021 #5
They lost a big sub contract edhopper Sep 2021 #3
So the U.S. beat France out of a big bucks contract?! PJMcK Sep 2021 #6
If this is what passes for comprehension on this board, we're in trouble BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #8
Thanks for your thoughtful response (n/t) PJMcK Sep 2021 #12
Good synopsis. Treefrog Sep 2021 #51
Thanks for real information; of course, we'll always need more Hortensis Sep 2021 #53
This message was self-deleted by its author wcmagumba Sep 2021 #7
If nothing else France shouldn't have heard about this from the news ripcord Sep 2021 #9
Ca$h. Period relayerbob Sep 2021 #10
Most of what everyone said, but there is more. Xolodno Sep 2021 #11
Interesting information PJMcK Sep 2021 #13
Seems like cutting France in on supplying a portion of the nuclear subs BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #16
That would have went a long way. Xolodno Sep 2021 #19
It does seem that would have been the better way to go. nt crickets Sep 2021 #25
One thing to understand about Australia. roamer65 Sep 2021 #47
Too bad. I welcome the jobs. Demsrule86 Sep 2021 #20
Then I hope you didn't level any criticisim at Trump for screwing allies. Coventina Sep 2021 #21
Trump didn't bring jobs here. Winning contracts is not screwing allies. We don't owe allies Demsrule86 Sep 2021 #49
"It's not personal it's just business". n/t PoliticAverse Sep 2021 #14
More info: JoanofArgh Sep 2021 #17
That tidy explanation omits that Australia was in France last month touting their sub deal BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #18
The French-Australian sub program was plagued with problems Kaleva Sep 2021 #27
So let's sneak behind their backs for six months and steal their shit? BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #28
Yes. Devil Child Sep 2021 #30
yes, that is often how it works when one entity is in breach of contract. uncle ray Sep 2021 #31
Did we steal their shit? I don't think so. Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #32
Did Biden just take a diplomatic hit that even Trump on his worst days never did? BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #35
France is throwing a tantrum. Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #39
Looking at this in business terms is terribly misguided BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #43
So the French can just fuck it up.... Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #45
What part of this is not "restoring our alliances" do you fail to grasp? BeyondGeography Sep 2021 #46
Glad someone said it. Treefrog Sep 2021 #52
What was stolen? The deal with France didn't really make much sense and had severe problems. Kaleva Sep 2021 #36
Thanks for that info PJMcK Sep 2021 #26
France is upset because of business. The contract was changed was for other reasons. Calista241 Sep 2021 #23
This move gives me hope that the Western world is finally taking a stand against China Devil Child Sep 2021 #54
Politics, timing, and cost overruns. crickets Sep 2021 #24
Give France the contract for the ICBM's that eventually will be on these submarines. roamer65 Sep 2021 #29
Ummmm.... Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #33
I forgot the sarcasm thingy. roamer65 Sep 2021 #34
They are inteneded as attack submarines Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #37
Don't worry. roamer65 Sep 2021 #38
Okay, I'm bad at this! Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #40
I'm joking. roamer65 Sep 2021 #41
Okay, got it... and yes... Happy Hoosier Sep 2021 #42
Also, a Raytheon cruise missile comes with many options for warheads. roamer65 Sep 2021 #44
Lock this idiot up LetMyPeopleVote Sep 2021 #48
What? (N/t) PJMcK Sep 2021 #50
The way I understand it... tavernier Sep 2021 #55
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