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LetMyPeopleVote

(145,046 posts)
12. You are WRONG
Fri Dec 2, 2022, 02:43 AM
Dec 2022

I remember the 2008 convention fight very well. I was on the Obama voter protection team and we were successful in using the caucus part of the Texas two-step to help President Obama win the most Texas delegates despite losing the primary to then Senator Clinton.

Here are the facts as to Michigan.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_Michigan_Democratic_presidential_primary

However, the Democratic National Committee determined that the date of the Michigan Democratic Primary violated the party rules and ultimately decided to sanction the state, stripping all 156 delegates and refusing to seat them at the convention. Despite this, the Michigan Supreme Court ruled that the primary could go ahead as scheduled.[2] The DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee later met on May 31, 2008, and agreed to seat all of Michigan's delegates with each delegate receiving half of a vote.[3] As a result of this compromise, Michigan had 78 votes at the convention. On August 24, the delegates had full voting rights restored.[4].....

The decision of the DNC diminished the significance of the Michigan Democratic Primary.[1] On October 9, 2007, following Michigan's breach of DNC rules, Barack Obama, Bill Richardson, Joe Biden, and John Edwards withdrew from the Michigan Democratic Primary ballot.[8] Dennis Kucinich unsuccessfully sought to remove his name from the ballot.[9] Hillary Clinton and Christopher Dodd decided to remain on the ballot.[10] Although Clinton said she would honor a pledge that she and the other Democratic candidates had earlier made to refrain from campaigning or participating in Michigan,[10] Clinton and Dodd drew sharp criticism from Biden, who stated that the two candidates had "chosen to hedge their bets" and had "abandoned Democrats in Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire, and South Carolina" by staying on the ballot.[10][11].....

In late May, attention focused on the upcoming May 31, 2008, meeting of the Rules and Bylaws Committee (RBC) of the Democratic National Committee (DNC). The RBC would choose whether to assign seats to Florida and Michigan delegates for the Democratic National Convention. (The convention itself could change the seating.) During the period before the RBC meeting, 22 uncommitted delegates pledged their support to Obama should they be seated at the convention.[32]

On May 31, 2008, the RBC voted 19-8 to seat all of Michigan's delegates with each receiving half a vote. The resolution allocated 69 pledged delegates for Hillary Clinton and 59 pledged delegates for Barack Obama, resulting in these pledged delegate votes:[33]

Clinton: 34.5
Obama: 29.5


The same thing happened to Florida
https://dbpedia.org/page/2008_Florida_Democratic_presidential_primary

The 2008 Florida Democratic presidential primary took place on January 29, 2008. Originally, the state had 185 delegates up for grabs that were to be awarded in the following way: 121 delegates were to be awarded based on the winner in each of Florida's 25 congressional districts while an additional 64 delegates were to be awarded to the statewide winner. Twenty-five unpledged delegates, known as superdelegates, were initially able to cast their votes at the Democratic National Convention. However, the Democratic National Committee determined that the date of the Florida Democratic Primary violated the party rules and ultimately decided to sanction the state, stripping all 210 delegates and refusing to seat them at the convention. The DNC Rules and Bylaws Committee later met on May 31, 2008, and agreed to seat all of Florida's delegates with each delegate having only receive half a vote. As a result of this compromise, Florida's delegation had 105 votes at the convention. (en)

The DNC had the power and in effect strip all of the delegates from Michigan and Florida. As a compromise the DNC restored one-half of the votes for the delegates in these states. The DNC has the right under the rules to punish states who do not follow the rules.

Texas was forced to give up the Texas Two Step in 2016 by the DNC
https://www.texastribune.org/2015/07/07/texplainer-whats-texas-two-step-and-why-it-gone/
The two-step had garnered complaints, especially after the 2008 election. Barack Obama’s campaign informed voters of the caucus’ importance, so they turned out to support him. Hillary Clinton won the popular vote, but because of the primary/caucus hybrid, Obama won more presidential delegates and claimed victory in Texas, leading some to call the system undemocratic. Additionally, the popularity of the 2008 election brought thousands of new voters to the caucuses and overwhelmed the voting process, strengthening the case against the Texas system. Some have also criticized the two-step for discriminating against the elderly, soldiers and others who cannot physically come to a caucus.

But Democratic Party leaders in Texas wanted to keep the two-step because they say it encourages voter engagement. When manpower determines who wins the caucus delegates, supporters have an incentive to turn out in large numbers. “Our argument is that we see a lot more participation and a lot more party building when people would actually come to the caucuses in person,” said former state Rep. Glen Maxey, who now works for the Texas Democratic Party.

The change wasn’t a complete surprise. Texas Democratic Party leaders say the system has been on thin ice for a while. The Texas system was grandfathered in and DNC officials had been telling the state for years it would have to choose either a primary or a caucus. Texas applied for a waiver for the 2008 and 2012 elections to keep the two-step. Maxey traveled to Washington, D.C., last month to advocate for the hybrid system in front of a DNC rules committee, but the request was denied.

The Obama team brought down people from the Iowa caucuses to train Obama delegates as to how to play the caucus system which helped Obama end up with the most Texas delegates even though Hillary Clinton won the primary.
New Hampshire does not reflect the demographics of the Democratic Party LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #1
That's true, but that won't make NH change the date of its primary. Ocelot II Dec 2022 #2
The DNC can strip New Hampshire of their delegates LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #4
The last tweet is inaccurate. former9thward Dec 2022 #6
You are WRONG LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #12
Why did you delete the facts which prove you are WRONG? former9thward Dec 2022 #13
Thank you for the laughs LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #14
Everyone who was part of the process knew at the time the delegates would count in the end. former9thward Dec 2022 #16
I am well aware of the DNC rules and the rules of many state parties LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #17
Everyone who reads these posts can see where you deleted information from your citations. former9thward Dec 2022 #18
Do you ever tire of being WRONG? LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #19
The NHDP can choose to ignore the results of the Primary and hold a Caucus at their own expense. brooklynite Dec 2022 #3
Hopefully all caucuses will be abolished LetMyPeopleVote Dec 2022 #5
Caucuses were recently abolished in my state, MN, Ocelot II Dec 2022 #15
It doesn't, but in combination with the other early states... W_HAMILTON Dec 2022 #7
Not many states do. What does being first, especially with the method used in Iowa ... marble falls Dec 2022 #10
But the DNC could refuse to accept the NH delegates Fiendish Thingy Dec 2022 #8
Would you risk NH's electoral votes? brooklynite Dec 2022 #9
I guess it will depend on how badly Biden wants to shake things up. Fiendish Thingy Dec 2022 #11
Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Prediction: New Hampshire...»Reply #12