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In reply to the discussion: Breaking [View all]

TommyT139

(1,408 posts)
53. Not just magats - "abatement ab initio"
Wed Jan 8, 2025, 06:04 AM
Jan 2025

There was a lot of discussion when Trump got the 34 guilty verdicts, about how to refer to him. More importantly, Trump needs to be sentenced, in order to be able to appeal, in order to complete the court process. He is after all old, in poor health, and likely to walk past open windows.

Abatement ab initio refers to the rule stating, if a defendant dies while appealing their conviction, that conviction is vacated. This rule comes from the principle that a party who dies during the appeal process has unwillingly been stripped of their appellate rights and therefore abatement of the conviction preserves those rights.


Abatement ab initio has far-reaching effects on victims of wrongdoing who, due to the vacated conviction, are no longer entitled to whatever damages or compensation they were initially awarded. For example, in United States v. Estates of Parson, plaintiffs could not collect on the $1.3 million they were awarded due to defendant’s fraud because the defendant passed away while appealing. As a result, the continued existence of abatement ab initio is controversial.


https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/abatement

If I recall correctly, this was the situation in Massachusetts until the Aaron Hernandez case. In jail for murder, he committed suicide, so the verdict was essentially erased.

Recommendations

1 members have recommended this reply (displayed in chronological order):

Breaking [View all] malaise Jan 2025 OP
Off to SCOTUS we go. Sneederbunk Jan 2025 #1
This is a state court proceeding. Ocelot II Jan 2025 #10
Court of Appeals Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #33
There's no federal jurisdiction unless the case involves a federal statute Ocelot II Jan 2025 #35
Check news. Sneederbunk Jan 2025 #57
They raised a constitutional issue, even though it's a bogus one. Ocelot II Jan 2025 #58
And he can't appeal until he is sentenced malaise Jan 2025 #2
Please explain like I'm a golden retriever Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #3
OK. Lucky, go get the ball! That's a good girl. Let go of that ball! Stop slobbering on that ball! GreenWave Jan 2025 #6
Was that really necessary? Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #7
My brief research confirms it MadameButterfly Jan 2025 #12
I just read an article that said Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #15
Man, there's always a way MadameButterfly Jan 2025 #19
I think you meant SCROTUM. nt Frank D. Lincoln Jan 2025 #22
This is the NYS case with Judge Merchan for which a jury found him quilty of 34 felonies karynnj Jan 2025 #61
Don't know what Jack Smith MadameButterfly Jan 2025 #63
I do not believe that Garland (Barr jr.) wants anything made public. LiberalArkie Jan 2025 #28
Maybe not CatWoman Jan 2025 #18
Well, it did ME a lot of good. Attilatheblond Jan 2025 #26
I needed a laugh stollen Jan 2025 #32
might have been misinterpreted stopdiggin Jan 2025 #59
... orangecrush Jan 2025 #20
That's correct. More specifically, he can't appeal to SCOTUS until Ocelot II Jan 2025 #36
Thank you Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #38
Today's decision *only* denied the requested delay for the sentencing hearing. Ocelot II Jan 2025 #39
It's a State conviction, for nreaking a State law. soldierant Jan 2025 #46
So what? Bluetus Jan 2025 #45
Actually I am expecting an Unconditional Discharge - no penalty, but he is still a convicted felon, forever. soldierant Jan 2025 #47
Why can't I find anything about this online? Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #4
That's because you didn't look at the DU home page. It's there. . . . . nt Bernardo de La Paz Jan 2025 #16
I heard it on NPR this morning. Nt leftieNanner Jan 2025 #23
Yea, always ForgedCrank Jan 2025 #25
Multiple attornies have been addressing the possibilities all week. soldierant Jan 2025 #48
Thank you for this Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #50
And that's exactly why I subscribe to Vance and Litman on dubstack soldierant Jan 2025 #64
Multiple attorneys have ben discussing this all week. Not as news, but as an explanation soldierant Jan 2025 #49
Personally, I'd just as soon sentencing didn't happen now. Merchan has already said it won't involve any sanctions. Silent Type Jan 2025 #5
There is a train of nonsense from magats Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #8
Kind of like waiting on the long form birth certificate gab13by13 Jan 2025 #9
Now their train of thought will change to, "he was convicted of a 'crime' that carried no sanctions, he's still Prez." Silent Type Jan 2025 #11
Not just magats - "abatement ab initio" TommyT139 Jan 2025 #53
Thank for context Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #54
For sure... TommyT139 Jan 2025 #55
Recommended. H2O Man Jan 2025 #13
i just wish Garland MadameButterfly Jan 2025 #14
This message was self-deleted by its author onecaliberal Jan 2025 #17
All I know is this angrychair Jan 2025 #21
Trump and his puppet lawyers giving me PTSD flash backs of the Manson trials Attilatheblond Jan 2025 #27
Trump will skip it and send the parking lot lawyer to do a remote appearance on his behalf. sop Jan 2025 #24
He HAS to attend Sundance1220 Jan 2025 #34
Yippee! Whoopie! Very exciting! liberalla Jan 2025 #29
He can't be there. He's a busy guy. tavernier Jan 2025 #30
He homegirl Jan 2025 #31
Ha malaise Jan 2025 #37
Oh yeah? tavernier Jan 2025 #40
Not likely malaise Jan 2025 #42
Not likely malaise Jan 2025 #43
Then Friday will be Fiddlelady11 Jan 2025 #41
If it goes to SCOTUS, this an easy one for them to refuse to hear Mblaze Jan 2025 #44
Adding this malaise Jan 2025 #56
Thank you Mblaze Jan 2025 #62
Will Trump Now appeal to Alito For A Stay? Nt DallasNE Jan 2025 #51
Out of all he was accused of Tickle Jan 2025 #52
I'm worried though. bluestarone Jan 2025 #60
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