General Discussion

Armstead

(47,803 posts) Mon Jun 30, 2014, 12:25 PM Jun 2014

Two Words explain why the ACA is fatally flawed. Hobby Lobby. [View all]

By further embedding private insurance and the employer-base system into the healthcare system and making it mandatory -- WITH NO WAY OUT -- the ACA opened the door to this kind of crap, and worse.

We should have offered some form of universally affordable and available public social insurance -- at least the option for it -- when we had a chance.

Healthcare should not be tied to jobs, and it should not be subject to the whims of employers or Big Insurance with no alternatives available.

125 replies

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Two Words explain why the ACA is fatally flawed. Hobby Lobby. [View all] Armstead Jun 2014 OP

I think we know what the responses to this will be.... vi5 Jun 2014 #1

I know and my answer would be... Armstead Jun 2014 #2

Was just telling my wife this. Puzzledtraveller Jun 2014 #7

It was frustrating something this straightforward wasn't done Armstead Jun 2014 #9

There was a reason Obama was hving secret back room meetings with the insurance companies cui bono Jun 2014 #23

The problem is not with the ACA. JDPriestly Jun 2014 #43

I don't disagree with you other than the only reason the ACA passed is because it is a boon for cui bono Jun 2014 #44

Agreed. But this problem with reproductive rights would still be pressing. JDPriestly Jun 2014 #60

Brilliant! Let's see there morals in action and make them pay to the balls!-nt Anansi1171 Jun 2014 #78

So its better to just give up on single payer then? IronLionZion Jun 2014 #25

Medicaid could have been expanded in all states without conditions Puzzledtraveller Jun 2014 #28

So why hasn't it been expanded in all states without conditions? IronLionZion Jun 2014 #41

We did not need the ACA to expand medicaid and increase funding to the states Puzzledtraveller Jul 2014 #106

Go for it! Whip the votes in congress and send the bill to the president IronLionZion Jul 2014 #109

And your handy magic wand would have magically gotten that passed in Congress. KittyWampus Jun 2014 #12

Not a magic wand. Armstead Jun 2014 #15

When winning is all that matters anymore the ACA is what you get. Puzzledtraveller Jun 2014 #30

When people are dying BootinUp Jun 2014 #31

Is it healthcare? Puzzledtraveller Jun 2014 #32

It's health insurance. n/t Gore1FL Jun 2014 #35

And how much of a tax increase would be necessary geek tragedy Jun 2014 #48

Who says a ta increase wuld be necessary? Armstead Jun 2014 #71

how is a mandated payment to the government not a tax? geek tragedy Jun 2014 #75

Personally I dont think mandates should be implemented anytime soon.... Armstead Jul 2014 #82

So you are against "government run healthcare" too. Doctor_J Jul 2014 #94

More greedy than stupid, I think. BuelahWitch Jul 2014 #118

It's so discouraging that the PTB have convinced people that corporations are our friends Doctor_J Jul 2014 #121

I'd settle for... vi5 Jun 2014 #21

Already proposed. Already rejected by Lieberman. jeff47 Jun 2014 #19

Good, so you have heard the facts and the political reality. If only your magic wand KittyWampus Jun 2014 #11

Did the GOP use their "magic wand" to make Obama have secret back room deals cui bono Jun 2014 #26

So which people in the Senate would have gone for universal coverage? Liberman? Bayh? Nelson(Neb) lostincalifornia Jul 2014 #104

In a perverse way Turbineguy Jun 2014 #3

The benefit is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ for the profiteers Armstead Jun 2014 #6

I wish you would start an OP with your post. And your last question is a valuable philosophical KittyWampus Jun 2014 #13

Not a chance in hell Doctor_J Jun 2014 #46

SCOTUS is an enemy of the state and war s/b declared on them. nt valerief Jun 2014 #4

You mean the Health Insurance Industry bailout? Puzzledtraveller Jun 2014 #5

I wonder what jobs pay at Hobby Lobby? CountAllVotes Jun 2014 #8

If you live in a Red State your options for Planned Parenthood are greatly limited... Javaman Jun 2014 #39

As for the rest of it, it will be lobbied away over the years. Except for the mandate. Fact is, grahamhgreen Jun 2014 #10

Some of it already is Doctor_J Jun 2014 #52

Retiring Boomers is what scared them into compliance SoCalDem Jun 2014 #57

Buy an individual plan IronLionZion Jun 2014 #14

Criticizing is not whining. Armstead Jun 2014 #17

Sounds good IronLionZion Jun 2014 #18

If only I could have... Armstead Jun 2014 #20

we did our best - voted for the president who said he would INSIST on a public option Doctor_J Jun 2014 #56

At least a generation is an awfully long time to not have SP or a PO enacted. Louisiana1976 Jun 2014 #65

Because the mighty insurance lobby is now part of the system by law Doctor_J Jun 2014 #66

Quit your job IronLionZion Jun 2014 #80

omfg... your solution is to quit your job??? cui bono Jul 2014 #101

Boycott for-profit insurance IronLionZion Jul 2014 #103

Bingo Armstead Jun 2014 #73

It is when other perspectives and alternatives are purposefully left out in order to light hairs on uponit7771 Jun 2014 #38

With what money? jeff47 Jun 2014 #22

Unfortunately in Massacusetts it's still convoluted mess with no relief in sight Armstead Jun 2014 #24

Your point is absurd Doctor_J Jun 2014 #50

You've fallen in hate, my friend. IronLionZion Jun 2014 #54

Employer coverage is an EARNED benefit. alarimer Jun 2014 #58

Yeah! The company should have no say in your pay either IronLionZion Jun 2014 #59

You can't be serious. You are defending the Hobby Lobby decision??? cui bono Jun 2014 #62

I also steal candy from babies because I'm such a bad guy like that IronLionZion Jun 2014 #74

We could all just move to another country too but that doesn't addresss the issue. cui bono Jul 2014 #95

How's your approach working out for you? IronLionZion Jul 2014 #98

Working a lot better than telling women to just get another job or buy their own insurance. cui bono Jul 2014 #100

DURec leftstreet Jun 2014 #16

Hobby Lobby can still be an issue with single payer IronLionZion Jun 2014 #27

The ACA is a bad dream. NCTraveler Jun 2014 #29

...who can't afford it Armstead Jun 2014 #33

Agree with every word you wrote. NCTraveler Jun 2014 #36

I don't moderate my thoughts on it (I probably should sometimes) Armstead Jun 2014 #37

I work for the Commonwealth of Kentucky Puzzledtraveller Jul 2014 #108

Hell to the K and fucking R !!!!! Tuesday Afternoon Jun 2014 #34

Medicare for all. The Kennedy plan. tclambert Jun 2014 #40

No. What is flawed is the perverse attitude toward sexx held by the Catholic Five on JDPriestly Jun 2014 #42

Yep. the now mandatory for-profit insurers and your employers have even more control Doctor_J Jun 2014 #45

the ACA is not 'fatally flawed' geek tragedy Jun 2014 #47

It's already been defined and implemented Doctor_J Jun 2014 #49

Perhaps as flawed as we could get. Our global grades aren't going to rocket up the charts. TheKentuckian Jun 2014 #68

A great deal of fixing would come just from states like Texas expanding Medicaid. geek tragedy Jun 2014 #76

Well - said... kentuck Jun 2014 #51

Perhaps, but there's no use crying over spilled milk. Laelth Jun 2014 #53

You need to tell the folks saved by the ACA why they should have died. gulliver Jun 2014 #55

those people wouldn't have died if we had Medicare For All Doctor_J Jun 2014 #61

Would you bet their lives that getting Medicare for All was possible? gulliver Jun 2014 #64

Here you go Doctor_J Jun 2014 #67

That's an inappropriate citation. gulliver Jun 2014 #72

How much is one life worth? IronLionZion Jun 2014 #77

right after you notice that your argument is based on refusal to admit the DC Dems screwed this up, Doctor_J Jul 2014 #85

You didn't address anything I asked you at all. IronLionZion Jul 2014 #89

Except that I quoted your lie and refuted it quite simply Doctor_J Jul 2014 #91

What exactly do you expect to accomplish with this attitude? IronLionZion Jul 2014 #92

You know what? cui bono Jul 2014 #96

OK, I give up IronLionZion Jul 2014 #97

You go ahead and keep saying there's nothing wrong with forcing religious beliefs on women cui bono Jul 2014 #99

That's horse manure -- A public option would not have "made someone die" Armstead Jun 2014 #70

During ACA debate, I was saying pursue Medicare for All. muntrv Jun 2014 #63

I agree that universal is what we should be moving toward davidpdx Jun 2014 #69

"We should have. . . " "Should have" and "would have" are limited by "could have." pnwmom Jun 2014 #79

Gee, I thought it was the Supreme Court that was fucked up, not ACA. nt MADem Jul 2014 #81

Them too...,But the flaws of employer mandated insurance gave them.... Armstead Jul 2014 #83

We weren't gonna GET single payer. We barely got ACA. MADem Jul 2014 #84

"You can't just take a shitload of insurance companies and drive them into the sea" nationalize the fed Jul 2014 #87

So it was better the way it was?... lame54 Jul 2014 #88

It's the "too big to fail" fallacy, the go-to argument for corporatists Doctor_J Jul 2014 #90

There is no nice way to say this. MADem Jul 2014 #93

It is, the people talking about the ACA are wrong. Rex Jul 2014 #111

This message was self-deleted by its author Rex Jul 2014 #112

I think those so-called "Roman Catholics" aren't living a life in imitation of the MADem Jul 2014 #115

Yeah I dunno,worst court in history? Rex Jul 2014 #116

I think you're right on that--worst court in history, thanks to five assholes. MADem Jul 2014 #117

We can only hope some of them have to retire during our next Dem POTUSes two terms. Rex Jul 2014 #119

"Healthcare should not be tied to jobs" <<<< THIS!!! Roland99 Jul 2014 #86

No... CherokeeDem Jul 2014 #102

BINGO! Rex Jul 2014 #114

Actually you are not correct. An accommodation was already made for groups who oppose this on lostincalifornia Jul 2014 #105

Opposite diretion from socialized medicine.. Armstead Jul 2014 #110

I am not saying the ACA is socialized medicine, of course it isn't. What I am saying is with things lostincalifornia Jul 2014 #120

Unfortunatley, to some Democrats, it is not flawed at all. NCTraveler Jul 2014 #107

posters like vr are not on our side. They are on the president's side Doctor_J Jul 2014 #122

Actually this is the direct result of some SCOTUS members putting their religious Rex Jul 2014 #113

The design of employer based healthcare left the door open for the SC to do that Armstead Jul 2014 #124

SO why not get rid of your employer based healthcare, for Obamacare? Rex Jul 2014 #125

another impediment between you and your doctor Doctor_J Jul 2014 #123