General Discussion

Drunken Irishman

(34,857 posts)

71. That, ultimately, is the point.

Fri Feb 13, 2015, 06:39 PM

Feb 2015

Most Americans aren't voting on policy. The shift we see in elections proves this. We're a fickle country. How else do you explain going from Bush to Clinton to Bush to Obama to ... ?

Those are pretty hefty extremes.

The problem is that you not giving a shit what Lisa thinks is the reason you'll never get your guy in the White House. You should care what Lisa thinks because she's more important in an election than you are solely because there is the possibility she votes against your guy. If your guy fails to captivate her, even if voting for that person helps her in the long run, she ain't voting for him/her and they're gonna lose.

So, don't chase 'em - but never win again.

A lot of people went against their self interests in the 80s to vote Reagan because he was likable and the other guys weren't. Mondale was boring. Dukakis even worse. Had Clinton run in the 80s, though, he probably would've been a better candidate - and a guy like Hart, who lost to Mondale in the '84 primary, seemed to fare better against Reagan in hypotheticals.

Would he have won? Eh...maybe not - but it wouldn't have been a 49-state landslide with Hart heading the ticket. Why? Because he had that personality voters vote for. Is it right? No. But it's a huge part of politics. Dismiss it at your own risk. This is why guys like Dennis Kucinich and Bernie Sanders, who bring up great points, probably won't ever win a national election.

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Highlight:

Is there a disconnect between DU and the rest of America? [View all] Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 OP

Meh. blkmusclmachine Feb 2015 #1

+1 madokie Feb 2015 #27

Ask those polled how well they understand the connection between repeal of Glass Steagall and near merrily Feb 2015 #2

I'm not concerned about his popularity... Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #5

Well, the title asks about a disconnect between DU and the rest of the nation, then merrily Feb 2015 #7

I ask to prove a point. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #8

Yes, that was obvious. merrily Feb 2015 #9

I think, whoever wins the nomination, is going to have a fight... Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #14

No one is pretending anything. Why would I? I have stated my sincere views. merrily Feb 2015 #77

I disagree with your disagreement... Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #78

You already said both those things and I've already responded to both, merrily Feb 2015 #79

Yes... Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #80

Okay. Do you want the tactic to shift? If so, do you have any thoughts on how to shift it? merrily Feb 2015 #81

I think getting behind someone who articulates the narrative well and has charisma is a start. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #84

Do you mind answering the questions I asked? merrily Feb 2015 #101

I did. If you don't understand that's your own fault. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #115

No. (Dn't be rude.) I asked if you wanted to shift things. Twice, you did not answer that part. merrily Feb 2015 #116

You asked me... Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #118

I would say that the left needs to find/build its donors and power structure or it cannot find merrily Feb 2015 #119

Please see Reply 101 merrily Feb 2015 #112

PS 3 am here. I will have to return another time. merrily Feb 2015 #82

"if you're going to beat the Clintons" Dawgs Feb 2015 #36

I agree with that - but I think she's still going to be tough to beat. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #58

IF she is the nominee, she certainly can be beaten. merrily Feb 2015 #75

The problem is that elected Democratic politicians seldom, very seldom, try to "sell their ideology" stillwaiting Feb 2015 #17

ding ding ding, we have a winner RedstDem Feb 2015 #15

None of the differences matter if the non-DUers vote -- which they do. pnwmom Feb 2015 #64

I missed where I claimed DUers are the only Americans who vote or that their votes count more. merrily Feb 2015 #73

+100 btrflykng9 Feb 2015 #74

I was out of town and did not check in with DU for a few days. I just checked the "News." JDPriestly Feb 2015 #85

+1. Not long ago, my kid had to memorize who's in the Cabinet now. winter is coming Feb 2015 #110

Short answer? Yes. Warren DeMontague Feb 2015 #3

Jimmy Carter wanted to take the US to an alternative energy future Fumesucker Feb 2015 #4

He also kept us out a fucking Middle East War and got the hostages back alive. merrily Feb 2015 #12

Possibly it could be... uriel1972 Feb 2015 #6

When was the last poll taken of DU to rank Presidents? Capt. Obvious Feb 2015 #10

Mainstream corporate media causes disconnect RiverLover Feb 2015 #11

I don't think much is gained.... uriel1972 Feb 2015 #16

True RiverLover Feb 2015 #18

heh uriel1972 Feb 2015 #19

I don't blame you, actually, but its hard to argue... RiverLover Feb 2015 #22

If religion was the opiate of the masses... uriel1972 Feb 2015 #23

I'm stealing your line olddots Feb 2015 #70

Yep. Some people like to be informed of current events and new discoveries. raouldukelives Feb 2015 #42

There's a very simple answer... brooklynite Feb 2015 #13

True we self-selecting... uriel1972 Feb 2015 #20

Not getting your policy doesn't equate to being throw under the bus... brooklynite Feb 2015 #26

so are leftist extremists the ideological fringe of the Democratic Party? reddread Feb 2015 #28

Broadly, yes... brooklynite Feb 2015 #29

cart before the horse, kind of handy except the way you keep whipping the cart reddread Feb 2015 #32

Again--not the point of the OP brooklynite Feb 2015 #33

it is when you assert extreme leftist activist commandoes arent attuned reddread Feb 2015 #34

Whatever the correct simple answer might be, it does not appear in your post. merrily Feb 2015 #21

The OP compares DU to the "rest of America" brooklynite Feb 2015 #24

everyone shares the same self interest of survival and prosperity reddread Feb 2015 #37

Barring a terrorist attack here, God help us, America will look pretty much the way it does now... DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #44

20/20 foresight reddread Feb 2015 #55

Nope that is not true, either. As I have posted before, when polled about ideas, instead of merrily Feb 2015 #39

Polling is not voting... brooklynite Feb 2015 #49

Yup. Perception trumps reality nearly all the time. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #60

Trying to chase Lisa's vote with policy is a fool's errand. She isn't voting on policy TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #67

That, ultimately, is the point. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #71

I don't disdain "Lisa's vote" be glad to have it but the silly "centrist" pitch isn't going to land TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #104

I don't think you're getting what I am saying. Drunken Irishman Feb 2015 #108

+1 ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2015 #25

You appear to be saying you are a contrarian.. Fumesucker Feb 2015 #59

On most topics ... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2015 #72

Your average person doesn't see the world through an ideological lens. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #90

Exactly. .... 1StrongBlackMan Feb 2015 #93

Well said One of the 99 Feb 2015 #97

Yes, of course Godhumor Feb 2015 #30

I can't speak for DU. LWolf Feb 2015 #31

Because most DUers are better informed... 99Forever Feb 2015 #35

As far as I'm concerned... Stellar Feb 2015 #38

Simple. DU'ers tend to be a lot more educated and aware of the issues n2doc Feb 2015 #40

Well, opinions in self-selecting subsets, especially if small, tend to depart from the whole HereSince1628 Feb 2015 #41

People should be much, much, much, much...much more worried about losing the White House in 2016 DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #43

And it's a very tough thing for a party to maintain the presidency over 3 terms HereSince1628 Feb 2015 #48

I'm well aware of that and it strikes me as more of a historical artifact. DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #50

Do you know what states are 'the blue wall?" The article suggests upper midwest HereSince1628 Feb 2015 #61

WI is pretty atypical demographically than the rest of the nation DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #62

That's not my question, my question was about WI being part of the blue wall HereSince1628 Feb 2015 #63

18 states + the District Of Columbia have voted Democratic in the past six presidential elections DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #65

Dems are at an advantage in Presidential elections... Cali_Democrat Feb 2015 #76

See Posts Fifty And Sixty Five DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #88

Very good points One of the 99 Feb 2015 #98

In the present circumstance the White House and the judiciary are the only entities... DemocratSinceBirth Feb 2015 #99

Totally agree. One of the 99 Feb 2015 #100

Yes very much so. William769 Feb 2015 #45

Two disconnects: DU/mainstream, mainstream/reality Yorktown Feb 2015 #46

If 61% rate Reagan as "outstanding" then being out of step rurallib Feb 2015 #47

Carter has done more for humanity since leaving office than any other President liberal N proud Feb 2015 #51

Yes, but no Proud Public Servant Feb 2015 #52

The rest of America is tainted.. Matrosov Feb 2015 #53

The mid-'70s had its problems deutsey Feb 2015 #54

Image and nostalgia are indeed the big drivers of Clinton popularity. Orsino Feb 2015 #56

democratic UNDERGROUND. We're countercultural first, Democrats second. lumberjack_jeff Feb 2015 #57

America likes St. Ronald of Rayguns even more so. Seems meaningless to me. TheKentuckian Feb 2015 #66

Yes. Almost everyone here is a policy wonk of some sort. The rest of the population-- eridani Feb 2015 #68

Why are like 75% of callers to CSPAN right wingers? joshcryer Feb 2015 #83

Every single "far left" policy wonk that I know is a strategic voter eridani Feb 2015 #86

Yet a thread advocating not voting for Clinton... joshcryer Feb 2015 #87

Liberals and moderates are mostly not crabby old white people eridani Feb 2015 #120

The disconnect gets even spookier when the question of what motivates KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #91

I think there is a disconnect with some usernames and reality. Rex Feb 2015 #69

Does the Pope wear a hat? :) - nt KingCharlemagne Feb 2015 #89

DU is more upset about the SI swimsuit cover than most of the US. Orrex Feb 2015 #92

Even then, it's a pretty small HappyMe Feb 2015 #94

I had one DUer who is actively involved in political campaigns tell me directly davidpdx Feb 2015 #95

What compelling reason do you have for us to mirror the rest of the country? DisgustipatedinCA Feb 2015 #96

The real question is there a disconnect between DU and most Dems? One of the 99 Feb 2015 #102

I think your analysis was excellent and spot on... guillaumeb Feb 2015 #103

+1 I don't know if "like" is the correct word. Corporate media favors the right over the left merrily Feb 2015 #114

"America" has a life. DU has an agenda. Clinton haters have a huge agenda. McCamy Taylor Feb 2015 #105

Thoughtful answer to a thoughtful OP Hekate Feb 2015 #106

Thoughtful post, DI Hekate Feb 2015 #107

As a general rule, political websites attract those further from the political center. Algernon Moncrieff Feb 2015 #109

Do you have a link to support that, or is it a matter of your opinion/impression? merrily Feb 2015 #111

Christie? Oh man, we have this one in the bag. McCamy Taylor Feb 2015 #113

That's about the only thing that can save us at this point AZ Progressive Feb 2015 #117