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tortoise1956

(671 posts)
124. You still didn't provide an example...
Fri Jun 30, 2017, 12:31 AM
Jun 2017

I asked for examples of gun controllers defining power of a firearm. The NRA does not consist of gun controllers - at least, not from what I've seen. Once again, you fail to produce.

I, on the other hand, will provide an example of why the AR-15 is NOT a high-powered weapon, based on a definition provided to the New Jersey Law Journal by Robert Trifiletti, Chief of the Army’s Light Armament Division:
http://www.tulprpc.org/attachments/File/Army_Gives_Definition_Of_Assault_Rifle.pdf

If you read it, you will find that modern assault rifles (including the M-16) are considered to be intermediate in power between sub-machine guns and rifles (described in other sources as battle rifles):
http://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a25974/now-its-the-army-that-wants-a-new-rifle/

This describes the Marines looking into a new battle rifle - a weapon with more power than the M-16 that can be used to reach out and touch the enemy at ranges between 500-1000 yards, well beyond M-16 realistic range.

You can argue that AR-15's may not be low-powered - but they are definitely not high-powered. Unless, of course, you are arguing that the Army is not an authoritative source - which I fully expect to hear next. And I'll probably hear that well before you give any pesky examples of gun-controllers defining power...

U.S. Army looking for a new rifle... [View all] tortoise1956 Jun 2017 OP
Maybe They Will Me. Jun 2017 #1
Correcting........ pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #5
Nope, No Way Me. Jun 2017 #6
"Nope, No way" pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #128
Agree, what is hated is all the senseless deaths. Canoe52 Jun 2017 #101
Apparently Senseless Deaths Are In High Demand Me. Aug 2017 #131
The RFI was published May 30, submission deadline is Jun 6. JustABozoOnThisBus Jun 2017 #2
Why not use AR 10 pattern or SCAR 17 Alea Jun 2017 #8
Idwhat manufacturer donated the most to trump? Nt lostnfound Jun 2017 #28
According to many "self described" experts here virginia mountainman Jun 2017 #3
SNORK! pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #4
I believe that I will stick to my battle rifles. oneshooter Jun 2017 #7
Hey Alea Jun 2017 #9
20 rds just makes you lazy in your shooting. oneshooter Jun 2017 #10
I was just playing around Alea Jun 2017 #11
I prefer the balance of the M1, and loading it is no problem. oneshooter Jun 2017 #12
Yes. M1 thumb Alea Jun 2017 #13
Let me tell you about "M1 Thumb" oneshooter Jun 2017 #15
I've neither had nor witnessed the infliction but... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #53
M1 thumb oneshooter Jun 2017 #54
thanks discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #55
I had M14 thumb in Army basic training JustABozoOnThisBus Jun 2017 #18
I like yours better . nocalflea Jun 2017 #27
DAMN, oneshooter......... pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #14
If I was rubbing it in...... oneshooter Jun 2017 #16
Ha ha. pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #17
What does "makes cover into concealment" mean? lostnfound Jun 2017 #29
The M1 uses the cal30M2 Ball ammo (30-06) oneshooter Jun 2017 #35
Okay I get it now, thanks. Nt lostnfound Jun 2017 #43
So it's out with the ole poodle shooter eh? ileus Jun 2017 #19
They want a 7.62x51 krispos42 Jun 2017 #24
Have they ever carried those big bulky bastards. ileus Jun 2017 #25
Time was, when the .223 was considered underpowered for anything larger than woodchucks. Paladin Jun 2017 #20
I can relate, gejohnston Jun 2017 #21
"(M)y guns are gathering dust in a closet." Have the courage of your convictions... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #74
A most amusing OP about the danger of 5.56 caliber rifles by a self-proclaimed 'expert': friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #22
"Colt Combat Masterpiece"? tortoise1956 Jun 2017 #23
There was indeed a large amount of pious fraud in those two threads... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #36
This is such a dumb statement! ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #26
no, gejohnston Jun 2017 #30
So you speak for all who "know what they are talking about"? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #32
depends on how you define caliber, gejohnston Jun 2017 #33
It depends, I agree! That's why blanket statements are a no-go. ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #34
You might maybe want to lay off on the 'argument from authority' you've been using... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #37
I am interested to have my mistake pointed out to me, since I cannot find it. ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #40
sort of gejohnston Jun 2017 #38
I disagree ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #39
my link is an example of gejohnston Jun 2017 #41
Knives have other uses, guns do not. ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #44
not really relevant gejohnston Jun 2017 #45
Really? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #46
Their concern may very well be genuine, but is often expressed in a less-than-honest way... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #48
I'm still waiting for you to point out my error you mentioned before... ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #58
Your former status does not privilege your argument friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #61
So my error was making the argument in the first place? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #62
Your main error was and is believing that your former status is somehow relevant... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #65
Yes, really gejohnston Jun 2017 #50
Bloomberg? You mean this Bloomberg? discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #51
re: " My point is that gun-controllers are right to label it "high-powered", for more reasons..." discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #52
Why can't they all be "high-powered"? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #94
The use of the term "high-powered"... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #103
Relatively High-Powered? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #107
Correction... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #110
The source... ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #114
Which demonstrates what? discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #116
Uh oh, insults! ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #117
U.S. Army Ordance Dept classifies it as a intermediate power cartridge Alea Jun 2017 #118
I would guess that my M1 Garands are "ginormus" powered, oneshooter Jun 2017 #119
No insult intended discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #120
If you wouldn't mind my 2 cents, I may be able to help discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #42
CMP rifle competition is stated to be either "high power" or "rimfire". yagotme Jun 2017 #47
"Which would include me, as a former infantryman?" SQUEE Jun 2017 #56
Please ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #57
IMO, there are several problems with your argument friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #59
I found some faults with yours as well... ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #63
Seems I am under no responsibility to defend my position. SQUEE Jun 2017 #66
I'm glad you mentioned definitions of different powered rounds and rifles: ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #68
That's the NRA, *not* the Army-the organization where you got the technical expertise.. friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #70
I'm afraid the other military on the thread don't really back your argument: ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #78
"(I)t is certainly capable of killing unarmored civilians" As are almost all types of ammunition friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #85
Why is your ire directed at that round in particular? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #87
Do you also wish to ban all magazine-fed, semiautomatic rifles? friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #89
7.62 is also considered, technically speaking, an "intermediate" round. SQUEE Jun 2017 #91
You must be the only one confused by this ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #92
So another misappropriation by the NRA. SQUEE Jun 2017 #71
Anti-gun threads and subthreads by self-described ex-military have gone awry before friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #73
Well, that was an officer.. AF no less. SQUEE Jun 2017 #76
It has been stated that the round is not "high-powered", ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #79
I would counter thusly: 1) Squee may not have, but gejohnston certainly did... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #67
gejohnston's argument appeared to turn on ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #69
Your 'former employer' disagrees with you- and so do all his other 'ex-employees'... friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #72
The other ex-employees in this thread ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #81
As I stated earlier.. SQUEE Jun 2017 #86
Is there any 7.62 rifle round that is not technically an "intermediate" round? nt ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #95
yes SQUEE Jun 2017 #99
Please pay attention to the subject discussed. oneshooter Jun 2017 #90
Uh, you need to pay more attention, bro! (edit) ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #93
considering how he also stated 7.62 is not "high-powered" SQUEE Jun 2017 #75
I think him and I agree then that it is not just "caliber" that makes ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #80
The accepted differentiation between "high-powered" and other rounds... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #83
Interesting ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #84
Your arguments have been all over the map. What, specifically do you object to? friendly_iconoclast Jun 2017 #88
Here is the run-down: ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #97
The military vs civilian aspects discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #102
Have we reached the "official" definition of "high-powered" yet? ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #106
Suggestion discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #108
I don't see any definition of "high-powered" on that Wiki page. nt ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #96
not all 7.62s are created equal gejohnston Jun 2017 #77
Words mean things SQUEE Jun 2017 #60
Words have power for a reason ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #64
Why are you using a bogus definition? tortoise1956 Jun 2017 #49
So your definition of "high-power" is based on ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #100
Here's the thing... tortoise1956 Jun 2017 #112
That's an easy one ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #115
You still didn't provide an example... tortoise1956 Jun 2017 #124
I'd maybe take up a hobby while you're waiting on an answer n/t discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #127
Think they'd be interested in a model designed around the old Gyrojet-type model? Decoy of Fenris Jun 2017 #31
re: "high-powered assault-style" discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #82
This is a little off-base. ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #98
I inferred that the OP... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #104
Finally, Nail on the head Alea Jun 2017 #105
The gun experts here have constantly been claiming certain cartridges are ExciteBike66 Jun 2017 #109
Maybe this will clear it up discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #111
Thanks Hangingon Jun 2017 #113
You're welcome for sure discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #121
This thread really went off following a rabbit trail. Hangingon Jun 2017 #122
rabbit trail??? more like Alice's rabbit hole and through the mirror... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #123
7.62-51r is .30-30 Hangingon Jun 2017 #125
I was a fan of the soft points discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #126
I have a 788 in 30Win. oneshooter Aug 2017 #129
Fsounds sweet! Hangingon Aug 2017 #130
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