Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

AndyS

(14,559 posts)
45. More deflection I see. That's obviously all you have.
Thu Mar 18, 2021, 09:24 AM
Mar 2021

Last edited Thu Mar 18, 2021, 03:41 PM - Edit history (2)

First point of deflection is re-defining suicide as something other than gun violence. First do a google image search on suicide by gun then take into account that a loved one is usually the first to find the body and tell me again that this isn't violence of the worst kind. Further, guns are very effective in suicide. Many, if not most, suicide attempts by other means are unsuccessful and only one in ten attempted suicides is completed in a subsequent attempt. We can safely assume that a number of households would not replace the gun sold [confiscated with compensation] so reducing the number of guns available to suicidal people will necessarily reduce death by suicide.

Second point of deflection is the either/or dilemma of Medicare for all vs gun violence. It is not a binary choice. Stop pretending it is.

Third point of deflection is the offer of an alternative to the immediate purchase [confiscated with compensation] of guns; the 'grandfathering' of existing inventory. Why even bring that into the conversation? (I do appreciate your evaluation of effectiveness though, thanks!)

Fourth point of deflection, the market will react with a substitute for semi auto guns. I've said there is always a work around with gunners and you seem to prove my point. I guess we just need to go the route of Australia and include such things as lever action and pump action as well. When we achieve what I'm advocating it will be a simple matter to include the other methods of rapid fire IF they become an issue which I hope they will not. The goal is not to remove all guns, it is to reduce the number of deaths and injuries.

The final point of deflection is the 'stirring up the Republicans' meme. Do you seriously believe that one more issue will 'stir up' the opposition more than it is now??? You are either demented or mindlessly repeating an NRA talking point.

Now to the next point you will eventually try to make; it costs too much.

Though a lack of data makes it difficult to fully calculate, researchers have estimated that after accounting for direct and indirect costs, gun violence in America has an annual price tag of $229 billion, over two times the size of New Mexico's economy.
https://www.jec.senate.gov/public/_cache/files/a8c89469-30a1-4b88-b3f5-0c5e54ad5df0/economic-impact-of-gun-violence-final.pdf
Reducing gun violence will greatly reduce the cost of a gun buy [confiscated with compensation] program and over time more than pay for it. Plus there's that whole humanity thing . . .

Then there's the fact that mass shootings (four or more shot excluding the shooter) are increasing in number. By this definition there were 417 mass shootings in 2019. The majority of these shootings are domestic (in family) incidents. They account for at least 1700 deaths/injuries per year. The weapons of choice are the very ones I'm advocating against. It's hard to shoot that many people with a bolt action rifle or a revolver.

"So why pick this hill to die on?" Interesting choice of words. I don't plan on dying, I plan on saving lives. You?

Hope my edit makes you feel better . . . it's all about your feelings
Democrats can address more than one issue at a time. TwilightZone Mar 2021 #1
As I mentioned in the post, there were 2 bills introduced on BGC krispos42 Mar 2021 #2
Yep empedocles Mar 2021 #4
*sigh* sarisataka Mar 2021 #3
Yet another bill based on "military" appearances MichMan Mar 2021 #5
Yeah, "they" are a real pain in the ass for you gun enthusiasts, aren't "they"? (nt) Paladin Mar 2021 #6
I'm not a gun enthusiast, but banning weapons based on appearances doesn't accomplish anything. MichMan Mar 2021 #7
Not true: it makes the self-righteous feel better, and gives the GOP a handy wedge issue friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #11
At least those left can be sure to pass the purity test discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #12
These are neo-Puritans fighting what they regard as evil. Actual crime stats are almost irrelevant friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #13
To use a somewhat older meme: Got false consensus effect? friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #9
re: "This bill might save as many as 10 lives a year!" discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #8
The gun-averse have "learned nothing, and forgotten nothing" friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #10
I really don't like the Nestle company discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #15
This message was self-deleted by its author discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #16
Very well put. krispos42 Mar 2021 #42
I'm glad you and your family etc. are all okay discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #53
Gun supporters need to just get over themselves. AndyS Mar 2021 #14
Personally, I believe your 10% number may be off, yagotme Mar 2021 #17
Gun controllers are every bit as puritanical as some of the various subgroups in the GOP friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #19
The old: yagotme Mar 2021 #36
"No more compromise" I was waiting for the "no loaf is better than half a loaf" crowd to show up friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #18
You can't argue with gun controllers more than any other fanatic The Mouth Mar 2021 #20
I appreciate your position krispos42 Mar 2021 #21
Really? That's the best ya' got? AndyS Mar 2021 #22
So rather than have the government confiscate all handguns, you would have them confiscate "only" Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #23
No, buy backs. nt AndyS Mar 2021 #25
A mandatory "buy back" is, by definition, confiscation. Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #27
As is eminent domain. So what? You have a point or just more AndyS Mar 2021 #28
You're advocating that the government consficate about 200 million firearms from private hands. Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #29
First, not nearly that many. Only semi auto with AndyS Mar 2021 #30
I would estimate that roughly 75% of privately owned handguns are semiautomatics, and of those Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #31
It's not personal. It's about numbers and the exaggerated AndyS Mar 2021 #32
"Take part or sit back and let people like me do it for you." Forced teaming? Really? friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #33
"Take part or sit back and let people like me do it for you." There is a third alternative. Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #34
Another high profile shooting in Atlanta today. AndyS Mar 2021 #35
Yes, committed supposedly with a revolver. yagotme Mar 2021 #37
So I guess those murders just don't count. Paladin Mar 2021 #38
People have been arguing that massive gun control is just around the corner for *decades*. Dial H For Hero Mar 2021 #39
"Talking points": The gun-control version of "Widespread voting fraud" friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #40
The government can't "buy back" what it never owned in the first place. krispos42 Mar 2021 #43
You know you've won the argument (debate?) when one side resorts to niggling AndyS Mar 2021 #44
Says the person claiming confiscation isn't confiscation krispos42 Mar 2021 #46
Imminent domain. AndyS Mar 2021 #47
"For public use" would seem to be the operative words there krispos42 Mar 2021 #48
Really? You're still stuck on that upsetting Republican voters thing?🤡 AndyS Mar 2021 #49
Yup. Because, you see there's this funny thing where the party in power gets to do shit krispos42 Mar 2021 #52
So, what "public use" are the firearms subject to? yagotme Mar 2021 #50
So he's thinking buy backs discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #26
You've declared "No more compromise" and "take 'em all, and round up the people that don't comply".. friendly_iconoclast Mar 2021 #24
If it's not a culture war, why are the guns most attacked the ones that cause the least harm? krispos42 Mar 2021 #41
More deflection I see. That's obviously all you have. AndyS Mar 2021 #45
Need to brush up on firearm history: yagotme Mar 2021 #51
Reality is not deflection, sorry krispos42 Mar 2021 #54
I give up trying to have a cogent conversation with you. AndyS Mar 2021 #55
So you're okay with the other parts of my post? krispos42 Mar 2021 #57
You're as good at deflection as Kellyanne Conway. AndyS Mar 2021 #58
You're as good at deflection as Kellyanne Conway. AndyS Mar 2021 #59
From the land of post hoc ergo propter hoc discntnt_irny_srcsm Mar 2021 #56
"re-defining suicide as something other than gun violence" EX500rider Mar 2021 #61
Eh? Straw Man Mar 2021 #62
"about close to 40,000 deaths" with most those being suicides of course.. EX500rider Mar 2021 #60
One thing I'll never understand about these bills ... Straw Man Mar 2021 #63
Latest Discussions»Issue Forums»Gun Control & RKBA»"Senate Dems introduce 'a...»Reply #45