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happyslug

(14,779 posts)
58. Like the Nazi did in regards to cold water temperature survival?
Thu Mar 29, 2012, 10:06 AM
Mar 2012

Remember we are dealing with PEOPLE, not animals and any double blind study has to do what the Nazis did in their study on Cold Water Temperature Survival, a test group who were dumped into the cold waters, and a control group who were not but otherwise given the same food, clothing and other care (Twins were idea subjects, one to go through the cold weather tests the other as the control).

Since, hopefully you reject what the Nazis did to the twins, you understand why it is hard to do a true "large scale double blind study" in this subject matter, and thus we have to use observations, In such "large scale double blind study" means handling children, as similar as they can be (Twins are ideal) in two different ways by their parents (to make sure we keep the two groups as similar treated as possible other then the subject the study is set up to test). Another way to do so is to take twins from their natural parents and give one child to one set of parents and the other to another set of parents, to make sure one is exposed to the idea being tested while the other is not (AND both sets of new parents rigidly controlled to keep difference in treatment to the children to a minimum).

Just thinking of HOW to do a "large scale double blind study" quickly show such a study, while not impossible, violates all types of rules of ethics.. Given that situation we have to use observations, as the next best way to obtain evidence. This is how the theory of Evolution was developed and how it has been able to defeat all other theories as to how animals and people became what they are (Almost impossible to do a double blind study on evolution given the time period evolution occurs, thus we rely on observation of fossils and how they changed NOT actual animals as they evolve).

Thus this author's observation are valid, but can be challenged by other observations. As to how valid are his observations we may have to wait and see, but it is in interesting point of view.

I certainly wasn't. Arugula Latte Mar 2012 #1
Yeah. I am real sure that five year old was never ever exposed to any christianity CBGLuthier Mar 2012 #2
Keep reading. While *membership* is high, less than 10% actually attend church. cbayer Mar 2012 #4
But you don't have to attend church to be exposed to the concept of God LeftishBrit Mar 2012 #11
My experience with Scandanavians, while anecdotal, is fairly extensive at this point. cbayer Mar 2012 #14
As regards Australians... LeftishBrit Mar 2012 #22
Due to your proximity to Scandanavia and your being a member of the Commonwealth, cbayer Mar 2012 #25
So from your experience Goblinmonger Mar 2012 #53
Really interesting read. cbayer Mar 2012 #3
I wasn't. I found Sunday School with God, the Bible Stories, etc. hard to believe. no_hypocrisy Mar 2012 #5
Sounds like an interesting book. Jim__ Mar 2012 #6
Kids of atheists - no matter how hard their parents might try to insulate them from religion TlalocW Mar 2012 #7
I've had two Chinese foreign exchange students... PassingFair Mar 2012 #43
I was born Buddhist, just like in my previous lives. :) nt Speck Tater Mar 2012 #8
The same group holds more reverence for the fetus than the unborn liberal N proud Mar 2012 #9
What group are you referring to? cbayer Mar 2012 #17
I think he's talking about the dumbass creationists. n/t Goblinmonger Mar 2012 #55
nonsense. nt bowens43 Mar 2012 #10
Astounding bongbong Mar 2012 #12
By your measurement then, there is no evidence infants are born atheist. rug Mar 2012 #13
Uhhh.... bongbong Mar 2012 #19
No. rug Mar 2012 #23
Strawman alert! bongbong Mar 2012 #26
I see. rug Mar 2012 #27
Strawman #2 bongbong Mar 2012 #29
And I'm sure your four year old self put up quite the argument. rug Mar 2012 #44
Yes! bongbong Mar 2012 #47
And it appears your skills at argument have progressed little since. rug Mar 2012 #65
Yes x 2 bongbong Mar 2012 #66
Infants aren't born with any belief systems, as far as I'm aware of... Humanist_Activist Mar 2012 #51
Great points, a little anatomy and physiology of SamG Mar 2012 #59
Reminds me of a joke I heard years ago ... eppur_se_muova Mar 2012 #32
The variation I heard involved German Emperor Barborssa happyslug Mar 2012 #36
Riiiiiiight. I got kicked out of Sunday School when I was 8 catbyte Mar 2012 #15
It depends what you mean by being 'born with religious belief' LeftishBrit Mar 2012 #16
It's an interesting question. rug Mar 2012 #18
+1 n/t Silent3 Mar 2012 #20
Your post inspires me bongbong Mar 2012 #21
So far, there's no evidence indicating that God has to be a sky daddy. THAT may NOT be wired in. saras Mar 2012 #24
The author is clueless right from the start skepticscott Mar 2012 #28
Not only that... laconicsax Mar 2012 #34
There have been several experiments with children raised in isolation FarCenter Mar 2012 #30
Ah, but see my post above ! :D eppur_se_muova Mar 2012 #33
Another avenue of inquiry would be to study the religious beliefs of primitive people. FarCenter Mar 2012 #35
The course of human development from birth to adulthood involves SamG Mar 2012 #31
First it is clear baby do HAVE mental needs, mostly to do with interaction with other humans happyslug Mar 2012 #37
I'm not sure what your point is. But the nature of human and SamG Mar 2012 #38
There are also studies about Children given a choice between a beating and being rejected happyslug Mar 2012 #45
The heliocentric model mainly explains the seasons, rather than the times of sunrise and sunset FarCenter Mar 2012 #39
Sorry, despite Beatles lyrics, I might admire you SamG Mar 2012 #40
To be fair... LeftishBrit Mar 2012 #56
The riff on the Beatles was in reply to Happyslug and his riff on Sherlock Holmes FarCenter Mar 2012 #41
And the author of the book under discussion does NOT say children embrace theology happyslug Mar 2012 #46
Farmers used direct observations of equinox, solistices and calendars since the megalithic FarCenter Mar 2012 #49
The best farmers have the most "Farmer's Sayings"/anecdotes or "Old Wives takes" happyslug Mar 2012 #54
Based on that reasoning, kids' imaginary friends are real. Odin2005 Mar 2012 #42
In many ways there are. happyslug Mar 2012 #48
But that doesn't make them REAL. Odin2005 Mar 2012 #50
That depends on your definition of "Real" happyslug Mar 2012 #57
Your post intrigues me and I am grateful for your input here. cbayer Mar 2012 #60
You you think the voices in a schizophrenic's head are real? Odin2005 Mar 2012 #61
Real to them, that's for sure. cbayer Mar 2012 #63
Seems like a book riddled with anecdotes and confirmation bias. Humanist_Activist Mar 2012 #52
Like the Nazi did in regards to cold water temperature survival? happyslug Mar 2012 #58
I mention the problem of ethics in a post above, no need to go off the wall about it. Humanist_Activist Mar 2012 #62
To interrupt the conversation here... LeftishBrit Mar 2012 #64
Your are right, of course, I wasn't thinking of that, they do do studies on children... Humanist_Activist Mar 2012 #67
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