Religion
In reply to the discussion: Whether Jesus existed historically [View all]struggle4progress
(118,278 posts)By extracting the parallel language from "Matthew" and "Luke," it is possible to reconstruct fragments of a lost gospel "Q" which is distinct from "Mark" and appears to contain a variant of the same baptism story. Variants of the baptism story in Mark 1 thus date from a time before the current gospels were written and circulated in very early Christian communities
The role played by John in "Mark" is somewhat problematic. Roughly, in its entirety, it says:
John appeared in the desert, proclaiming an immersion for conversion and cancellation of debts. And all Judea and everyone in Jerusalem went into the desert and received his immersion in the Jordan while admitting their debts. John dressed in camel-hair with a leather and ate locusts and wild honey. And he taught, Someone, stronger than I, is coming; and I am not good enough to kneel down and untie his sandals. I immerse you in water, but he will immerse you in the Holy Spirit. In those days, Jesus arrived from Nazareth in Galilee and was immersed by John in the Jordan. Immediately, as he came from the water, he saw the heavens split open, and the Spirit coming down like a dove upon him, and a voice from Heaven: You are my dearly-beloved Son, on whom my favor rests
Since the text we call "Mark" sets out to discuss (as indicated by its original title) the "the beginning of the good news of Jesus Christ" -- clearly indicating that "Mark" regards its central figure Jesus as "the Christ" -- "Mark" clearly intends by this pericope to say that Jesus is the "dearly-beloved Son" and the expected the "one who is coming." Since by "I am not good enough to tie his sandals," John means he is less than a slave in comparison to the "one who is coming," this quote fits nicely into the narrator's view of Jesus as "the Christ"
The awkwardness of the pericope is now evident: John's baptism of Jesus suggests Jesus was one of John's disciples. Why is "Mark" reporting John baptised Jesus, if "Mark" regards Jesus as the "dearly-beloved Son" and the expected "one who is coming"? And a natural reason for "Mark" to include this awkward story is that he could not easily avoid including it, if there were a widespread oral tradition that "Jesus was a disciple of John"
"Mark" is obviously written for an audience familiar with some stories about John the Baptist, since we next hear in Mark 1:14, Jesus came into Galilee after Johns arrest, without providing any details of the arrest or its aftermath; and John then plays no further role in the narrative. So stories about John were known, to the community addressed by "Mark," before "Mark" was written: the text overlaps part of a larger oral tradition. And this oral tradition includes some Jesus stories, since "Mark" does not title his work "the good news of Jesus Christ" but rather "the beginning of the good news of Jesus Christ," which presupposes that the audience has already heard "the good news of Jesus Christ" and now might be interested in "the beginning"
That's good evidence for the existence of John