2016 Postmortem

Jarqui

(10,123 posts)

8. I agree. Hillary represents basically more of the same, though a little further

Sun Jan 24, 2016, 04:15 PM

Jan 2016

to the right, with no guarantee she'll retain the White House - particularly if her scandals catch up to her.

Bernie represents change though some could argue accurately that he represents what liberal democrats used to stand for.

Hopefully, we realize and do what we didn't do for six Obama years: follow through and get the House & Senate for him. That's what it will take to get meaningful change.

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Let's go big, or go home. [View all] elias49 Jan 2016 OP

I agree totally! peacebird Jan 2016 #1

Liked the foreign policy of G.W.Bush? Then VOTE FOR HILLARY! John Poet Jan 2016 #97

yes!! Punkingal Jan 2016 #2

No no no... serious people favor an incremental, one step forward, two steps back approach. n/t whatchamacallit Jan 2016 #3

Much better to lose all your forward momentum with a Republican President? brooklynite Jan 2016 #55

It's about the future of Democracy and the only person who wants to help Most of us 99% . orpupilofnature57 Jan 2016 #4

You're all very sincere, and very wrong. Hortensis Jan 2016 #26

If we don't break the power money has on our system now.... daleanime Jan 2016 #56

Now. Bernie is one of many, not THE ONE HOPE. Hortensis Jan 2016 #61

And you'll tell us.... daleanime Jan 2016 #66

We will eventually join together, behind Hillary or Bernie, Hortensis Jan 2016 #98

Yes. I voted for McGovern way back when. Did he have a chance? No. Did I know it? Yes. libdem4life Jan 2016 #5

Funny thing about this going big, more and more people are with us! highprincipleswork Jan 2016 #6

Pedantic: On shipping containers jeff47 Jan 2016 #7

That takes the edge off, thanks. elias49 Jan 2016 #11

Thank you for saying that for me, jeff. It's an innovative and cost-effective building material. Hekate Jan 2016 #81

I agree. Hillary represents basically more of the same, though a little further Jarqui Jan 2016 #8

Let's go big, or go home enid602 Jan 2016 #9

Bought gas lately? ucrdem Jan 2016 #10

Yeah! Unbelievable! elias49 Jan 2016 #13

Iran deal, among other things. ucrdem Jan 2016 #14

Can I say 'yes' and 'no'? elias49 Jan 2016 #16

Kick - one minor quibble. Juicy_Bellows Jan 2016 #12

Easy for white males to say. They won't have as much to lose under a Trump presidency. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #15

Well, then why elect a democrat at all? leftupnorth Jan 2016 #17

Hillary's plans have a chance to peel off some GOP votes. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #30

Excuse me while I pick my jaw up off the floor.... daleanime Jan 2016 #78

n/t SamKnause Jan 2016 #79

Hillary does not support the TPP, and she started the ball rolling on the Iran agreement. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #82

Now, she doesn't, I have no reason to put any faith in that... daleanime Jan 2016 #85

A Sanders administration would face worse gridlock than Obama or Clinton. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #87

So 'go home', elias49 Jan 2016 #20

No, don't go home. Go forward. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #29

Sorry. All I can do is elias49 Jan 2016 #31

Achievable plans, eh? Do you recall Obama's negotiating strategy in his first term? hedda_foil Jan 2016 #53

n/t SamKnause Jan 2016 #80

I can't believe my eyes mikehiggins Jan 2016 #102

"White males" like this lady? Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #39

The African American community is not monolithic. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #46

Neither is the dreaded "white male" community. But, you brought it up. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #47

I didn't say it was. What I brought up was the disparate risk in "going big." nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #48

If President Sanders can't get Single Payer through, the ACA will still be there. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #49

His bashing the ACA rather than defending it makes override of a repeal veto more likely. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #50

Again, "calling for an improvement" is not "bashing" Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #51

He's not calling for an improvement. He wants to repeal and replace with single payer. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #52

No he doesn't want to repeal and replace and I'm pretty fucking sure you know that. hedda_foil Jan 2016 #57

You just admitted he wants to "replace" the ACA, not improve it. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #58

Golleee, sunny, you're working awfully hard at pushing this ridiculous drivel, aren't you? hedda_foil Jan 2016 #71

It's really not hard work at all. I'm just stating the obvious. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #73

There is clearly no end to the disingenuousness, is there. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #59

What if there's a GOP amendment deleting the replacement part? SunSeeker Jan 2016 #62

If they have a veto proof majority they can repeal it anyway. No matter who is President. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #63

There's more of a chance of a veto proof majority if Sanders gets in. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #72

So you claim. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #75

Polling does not suggest otherwise. Sanders does not support Dems. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #76

He will bring a lot more people to the polls than Hillary will, particularly Millennials Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #77

Wrong. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #84

And she's right on prison, but changing from Schedule I to II is the barest minimum of reform. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #93

That logic is a testimony to a fear-driven society... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #54

My logic is not fear, but reality driven. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #60

I can't change what you believe... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #64

Sure you can. Show me the text of Bernie's plan where he keeps the ACA. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #65

What part of the ACA? MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #69

Can you give me the link to Sanders current single payer proposal? SunSeeker Jan 2016 #74

Here it is... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #99

No it's not. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #100

This is more than a paragraph unless your scroll is stuck... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #108

I am asking for the actual wording, yes. It is not on Sanders' website. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #109

The insult here is your false desire to want an answer, SunSeeker... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #110

Thanks for confirming that there is no plan. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #118

... MrMickeysMom Jan 2016 #120

What is this Willie Wonka? The Golden ticket?? boston bean Jan 2016 #18

Why does that big red arrow point right in Hillary's logo? elias49 Jan 2016 #21

Veruca Salt says Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #37

As a baby boomer, female Faux pas Jan 2016 #19

You say 'Go big or go home,' murielm99 Jan 2016 #22

Don't dare dream. elias49 Jan 2016 #24

You don't follow my thinking because you choose not to follow it. murielm99 Jan 2016 #27

Ego?? You're shitting me? elias49 Jan 2016 #28

ego = Hillary. 840high Jan 2016 #68

No politician is without ego. murielm99 Jan 2016 #70

Yeap, including reparations!!! No!??!? where... where yaw goin!?!? So much for the going big uponit7771 Jan 2016 #23

Transcription please. Is that a Sarah Palin? elias49 Jan 2016 #25

Gee, why doesn't Sanders "go big" on what the AA left want? SunSeeker Jan 2016 #32

Sorry,but what's the AA left? elias49 Jan 2016 #33

African Americans. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #34

Ah, sorry. elias49 Jan 2016 #35

I agree. Reparations, at least in the form of a check, can't happen now. Neither can single payer. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #36

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2016 #83

Both are equally improbable in today's Washington. nt SunSeeker Jan 2016 #86

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2016 #88

Reparations can work. It does not have to be in the form of a check. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #89

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2016 #90

"We've already done everything that's reasonably possible to help African Americans." SunSeeker Jan 2016 #91

Message auto-removed Name removed Jan 2016 #92

Wow. Ok, maybe I shouldn't have given you the benefit of the doubt. SunSeeker Jan 2016 #95

+1 uponit7771 Jan 2016 #94

But Free college can!?!?! REALLY!?!?! Where's the "revolution"!? uponit7771 Jan 2016 #41

Nope, she's not offering unicorns with her platform Sanders is. If he's going to proffer the improba uponit7771 Jan 2016 #40

Hillary just plain sucks. What can I say? elias49 Jan 2016 #42

Unilateral measures that go around congress is what she's offering, Sanders will soon uponit7771 Jan 2016 #44

Because that's not even close to a logical argument, for starts. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #43

Sure you got the right post? Clinton's platform isn't calling for improbable measures to pass... uponit7771 Jan 2016 #45

A bicycle has wheels. An airplane has wheels. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #96

Not even close to what I posted, Sanders is political revolution except for reparations... that's no uponit7771 Jan 2016 #114

your point is that if he supports one idea that is unlikely to pass, he's obligated to support Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #119

Yes it is if he's calling for political revolution, if he's not calling for that then what you poste uponit7771 Jan 2016 #121

So he needs to be in favor of building a space elevator out of marshmallows Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #122

No, just be in favor of every left tenant available otherwise his chide against all others for uponit7771 Jan 2016 #123

.....okay. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #124

More Sanders camp ad hom, on this issue that's what people resort to... not cogent counters uponit7771 Jan 2016 #125

cogent counters. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #126

Mmmm, salad. Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #38

Aw, they went home on that one. wildeyed Jan 2016 #112

lol... went to their own tree house were they can call everyone who's not a Bernie Bro a sell out uponit7771 Jan 2016 #113

Or a Sarah Palin. wildeyed Jan 2016 #115

Happy K/R for Bernie 840high Jan 2016 #67

Honest question Thenewire Jan 2016 #101

The population is facing hardship NOW. And HAS for decades elias49 Jan 2016 #103

Not when there is big possibility Thenewire Jan 2016 #104

Ridiculous. I don't want the world to burn. elias49 Jan 2016 #106

Sanders will not be able Thenewire Jan 2016 #107

Trump is rich enough that he is even paying for his own jwirr Jan 2016 #116

It was actually pretty good under Bill Clinton. wildeyed Jan 2016 #117

Yeah. Too many presidents and Congresses have wasted too much time... Orsino Jan 2016 #105

Go home! wildeyed Jan 2016 #111

There is a real problem of Nope Addiciton in our country Warren DeMontague Jan 2016 #127