Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

2016 Postmortem

In reply to the discussion: Bernie Sanders in one word [View all]
 

AOR

(692 posts)
36. I think I've made clear why leftist support of Sanders is luke-warm at best...
Fri Oct 23, 2015, 12:00 AM
Oct 2015

I'm far, far away from the only one saying this. If you venture outside the liberal/progressive cocoon... the leftist criticism of Sanders is everywhere. It is what it is Sabrina. Leftists are not buying what Sanders is selling by running in the Democratic Party. His insistence and complete capitulation in backing Clinton and the Democratic Party - if he fails - automatically disqualifies anything he has to say in the eyes of many. The Democratic Party is a party of capitalists. Leftists are not capitalists and bourgeois elections are of token value in the big picture. It is not hard to figure out Sabrina.

There is no "political revolution" coming out of the Democratic Party. Not from Sanders, not from Liz Warren, and not from anybody focusing on capitalist reforms as the be all and end all of "left" political solutions. I've listened to Sanders and Warren for ages. Sanders is a liberal with an edge at best. Leftist and Socialist my ass. He is also fine with the foreign policy of Empire. A mass movement for what ? Reforming capitalism so the "middle class" can trumpet their portfolios and talk of helping those "less fortunate" by providing "more ladders to the middle class." "The poor will always be with us so we must help them." Capitalist bullshit. We've seen this act before how many times.

The vicious and marginalizing attacks on leftists from Sanders supporters elsewhere are beyond words. Accusations of being right-wing trolls, "dogmatic cults", "utopian purest assholes", and worse. One can't claim to be "of the left" while supporting the continuation of a ruling class political system of capital and capitalism as the only possible system of political, social, and economic arrangements in society. Working for reforms as an organizational tool and a means to an end is fine. Defending capitalism and promoting working within the electoral system for reforms - as the only solution - while discrediting class struggle and class analysis is not.

As I said to someone else elsewhere. If any proposed Sanders solutions help with the leftist demands of labor, the working class, fighting racism, the struggling, then I am with those proposed solutions not Sanders the personality or Sanders as savior. If the "proposed solutions" include marginalizing leftist criticism, class analysis, and exposing the foundations of capitalism then I am not on board with that.

You've been around here a long time Sabrina and you know many who have passed through here. This below is how another leftist we both know put it and I couldn't agree more and it's how I see the Sanders campaign also. You're not obligated to agree but I'm telling it like it is from the standpoint of many leftists. The question you need to ask yourself is what course does this "movement" take if Sanders loses the nomination. The most likely course is that all the energy and the "movement" is consumed right back into the Democratic Party machine and the political impotent bullshit of lesser of two-evils groveling. How many times does the liberal/progressive faction of the Democratic Party need to be told you can fuck off now and you have nowhere else to go. They don't have anywhere else to go because they can't face the realities that capitalism is an abject failure and the Democratic Party is beholden to capital and there will be ZERO chance of "taking back" the Democratic Party.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

First, anything and everything I might say on the topic is subject to rigorous critical review and analysis. Sanders is not the "one we have been waiting for," not a guru or savior. The yearning for a savior or guru is an expression of individualism, a product of the corrupt ideology of the bourgeoisie.

There will be people taunting us in the coming months - "hey, nobody's perfect! If you don't like Bernie, then who do you like?" In other words, the can only think in terms of personalities, in the context of individualism. Leadership does and will emerge form the working class. It will not come in the form of gurus and saviors. It will come in the form of martyrs and fighters.

The simple answer is that we support the authentic aspirations of the working class, and resist any attempts by the ruling class to turn those aspirations against us and into the service of advancing the interests of the ruling class. Universal public healthcare? Yes. Universal public education? Yes. Sanders is saying those things. We support that. Not because Sanders is "good" or "right," or "our guy," but rather because, as I said, we support the authentic aspirations of the working class.

At the same time, this is no cause to abandon the left wing positions, and there will be pressure to do just that. We will see two contradictory phenomena unfolding simultaneously. Working class people will be attracted to the Sanders campaign because he is expressing some components that comprise working class aspirations. The enabling class, the functionaries and administrators and sycophants and toadies, will be promoting Sanders as a tool for crushing the Left and co-opting the working class.

Keep in mind that elections tell us where we have been, not where we are going. They are an effect, not a cause of social and political change. You will be told that your left wing criticism is hurting the Sanders campaign, and therefore "helping Republicans." That is a lie. It reveals the speaker to be more committed to preserving the current social and political arrangements than they are committed to the Sanders campaign. Left wing criticism will make it more likely that the Sanders campaign will succeed, not less likely. There would be no Sanders campaign were it not for the desperation of working class people. That is the wind in the sails, not the "beliefs" or "ideals" of the progressive policy wonks. Strong advocacy for working class interests increases that wind. "You lefties need to shut up, stop criticizing and get on the bandwagon" takes wind out of the sails.

We advocate the abolishing Wall Street, not merely reining it in a little.

We advocate the disbanding of the police forces as presently constituted, not merely "citizen oversight" or "reform."

We advocate abolishing so-called "private property" (the commons and the means of production) in the hands of the ruling class not merely some weak and half-hearted effort at making the system of "private property" look a little more equitable.

We advocate the dismantling of the social conventions and arrangements upon which racism and misogyny and bigotry are based, social conventions and arrangements that are forcibly imposed upon us by a small minority of people for their exclusive benefit, not merely the admission of a handful of a few tokens to the halls of power. We advocate the complete and utter demolishing of patriarchy and white supremacy. We do not want to see more African Americans and women sitting on corporate boards, we want to see more corporate board members sitting in prison.

We advocate dismantling the global empire and the reign of terror being waged against humanity, not merely "more diplomacy."

At the same time, we support the aspirations of the working class, in whatever form they may take. Supporting the people who will be attracted to the Sanders campaign is one thing. Promoting the personality involved, the candidacy, and the system of which he is a creature, is yet another.

Recently I watched the Burns documentary in the Dust Bowl. It is his best and with watching, I think, in stark contrast to that abomination he made about WWII. It is very compelling hearing the stories of people who lived through the New Deal era. People were put to work, people had access to healthcare and retirement and unemployment benefits, people were freed from the threat of eviction and foreclosure. Massive public works projects to retire and protect the environment were happening. Unions gained in power. Research and education were being financed. Real suffering was being alleviated, and the bankers and industrialists were fighting hard against any and all reforms.

The battle lines were clearly defined.

It is all very seductive and compelling. Yes, Sanders will either fail or else will ultimately serve the purpose of saving Capitalism from itself. Yet, I find myself thinking that maybe if we could back the snarling dogs of Capitalism down for just a brief period of time...

The degree to which the Sanders campaign presents opportunities to advocate the positions I outlined above, use it. The degree to which the Sanders campaign is used to silence the Left, resist it.







Bernie Sanders in one word [View all] Gregorian Oct 2015 OP
I was expecting another word - integrity. Democracy works well too. nt Mnemosyne Oct 2015 #1
ETHICAL in_cog_ni_to Oct 2015 #2
Catalyst. Ron Green Oct 2015 #3
Americans gave away their power when they stopped participating in the process. Gregorian Oct 2015 #6
Gregorian, I have tried for years and years and years senz Oct 2015 #20
Wow. 1962! Gregorian Oct 2015 #26
You may have heard about the political upheavals of the Sixties? senz Oct 2015 #33
Great bit of history in summation. Gregorian Oct 2015 #34
Leader demwing Oct 2015 #4
Promoting capitalism IS promoting the staus quo... AOR Oct 2015 #7
So what's your answer? demwing Oct 2015 #9
Your response is standard-issue deflection on what's being said... AOR Oct 2015 #11
So you have no plan demwing Oct 2015 #12
And you have NOTHING but business as usual as I suspected... AOR Oct 2015 #15
all, or nothing at all demwing Oct 2015 #23
It's not a question of all or nothing... AOR Oct 2015 #25
And you think this can be achieved, how? You think that a few people agitating, protesting, sabrina 1 Oct 2015 #28
You didn't digest a single thing I posted... AOR Oct 2015 #32
You haven't listened to Sanders at all, have you? You just repeated what he has EMPHASIZED sabrina 1 Oct 2015 #35
I think I've made clear why leftist support of Sanders is luke-warm at best... AOR Oct 2015 #36
I'm not sure where to begin, but I'll start by saying that if you want to communicate your iideas sabrina 1 Oct 2015 #38
With due respect you're not listening... AOR Oct 2015 #42
Respect marlakay Oct 2015 #5
Yuge Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #8
This Country and Planet are in trouble and I am heartened that glinda Oct 2015 #10
Senator. That's my word. MineralMan Oct 2015 #13
Genuine Yurovsky Oct 2015 #14
Principled. senz Oct 2015 #16
Courageous. senz Oct 2015 #17
Quaint...nt SidDithers Oct 2015 #18
I like where this thread is going. Gregorian Oct 2015 #22
Absolutely Correct Armstead Oct 2015 #19
Evolved olddots Oct 2015 #21
rec Cheese Sandwich Oct 2015 #24
Realist pinebox Oct 2015 #27
Earnest Prism Oct 2015 #29
Mensch sorechasm Oct 2015 #30
Visionary n/t TexasBushwhacker Oct 2015 #31
Two words BainsBane Oct 2015 #37
Principled. nt Bonobo Oct 2015 #39
Authentic. TwilightGardener Oct 2015 #40
Concerned AgingAmerican Oct 2015 #41
Latest Discussions»Retired Forums»2016 Postmortem»Bernie Sanders in one wor...»Reply #36