Reuters: U.S. drafts resolution condemning Holocaust deniers

[Eugene]

U.S. drafts resolution condemning Holocaust deniers

By Evelyn Leopold

2 hours, 43 minutes ago

UNITED NATIONS (Reuters) - The United States intends to introduce a U.N.
resolution on Tuesday condemning deniers of the Holocaust, a document aimed
at a conference in Iran last year dominated by delegates who questioned the
extermination of 6 million Jews by the Nazis in World War Two.

U.S. officials hope the resolution, which so far is backed by 39 nations
including Europeans, Russia and China, could be adopted on Friday in the
192-member U.N. General Assembly.

The measure urges member states "to reject any denial of the Holocaust as a
historical event" and "condemns without reservation any denial of the Holocaust."

It does not mention Iran by name, although American officials said it was a
reaction to the Tehran conference convened in December by President Mahmoud
Ahmadinejad. Most speakers threw doubt on the mass extermination of Jews.

-snip-

Full article: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070123/pl_nm/un_holocaust_usa_iran_dc

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

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[Behind the Aegis]

5. What a pathetic response!

[bunyip]

7. That all you got, George?

[Behind the Aegis]

9. To a pathetic post like the one you wrote...

...what more do you require?

[bunyip]

10. Truth, insight & commitment to human rights.

That's why I don't post in I/P.

[Behind the Aegis]

14. Probably a good thing...

...since your post provided nothing resembling 'Truth, insight & commitment to human rights."

[Behind the Aegis]

15. Allow me to help you

If ONE human being was imprisoned, starved, sent to a shower only to find it was cyanide instead of water coming out, and finally cremated in a crematorium, it is a lasting horror and a nightmare which should haunt all who learn of it.

It should be a "...nightmare which should haunt all who learn of it", but it seems, to some, not to be a real 'nightmare,' simply another ploy by the crafty Jews to claim "victimhood."

What I don't get is why it matters so much that this was done to Jews. I expect someone to answer that it matters because it was done to Jews BECAUSE they were Jews.

Do you really not understand this issue? Do you not understand that HALF of the WORLD'S population of Jews were eliminated?! Do you NOT understand that the population of Jews is STILL less than the population of Jews BEFORE the Holocaust?! Do you NOT understand that MOST Holocaust denial revolves around the number and victimization of Jews?! The only other version of Holocaust denial I have seen is from the far-right claiming that "homosexuals" really weren't victims; but I sure as hell have never seen a conference convened to deny that gays were killed en masse by the Nazi death machine!

But for every crime there is some "reason"--however spurious it may be. One killer kills his victims because they are women. Another does it because they all have long dark hair parted in the middle. Another does it because they are Moslem, or Jewish, or atheist. We should expect absurdity in the minds of killers.

You are correct that every crime has a "reason." However, what made this crime so chilling is that the end goal was to wipe out an ENTIRE group of people!

The lesson of such crimes should not be that Jews should forever after receive special favors and special treatment. The lesson should be that we should try to prevent any such crimes, wherever we may find them.

The above statement is so offensive for many reasons! You honestly think that Jews are "receiv(ing) special favors and special treatment..."?!? Would those "special favors" be the ever-increasing rise of anti-Semitism in the US and worldwide? Would that "special treatment" be the constant conspiracy theories of our desire for world domination?

If a bunch of people want to go around saying they don't believe something happened to Jews, they should be asked, "Do you believe it happened to ANYONE?" If their answer is yes, then they should be asked, "Do you want it to ever happen to anyone again?" I would hope their answer would be no. If their answer is no, then I have something in common with those people.

If you can find commonality with a group that denies the mass murder of one group, but willingly accepts that others endured atrocities in the same event (or a similar one) and don't want it to happen because it happened to the group they are willing to acknowledge, then you might want to reexamine your priorities! If someone said that millions of Africans were not really enslaved, but I found that they agreed that whites who were enslaved was true and shouldn't be repeated, I wouldn't want them on my "side."

Or maybe the U.N. should just draft a resolution recommending that those people who went to Iran should be imprisoned, starved, sent to a shower only to find it was cyanide instead of water coming out, and finally cremated in a crematorium. It seems nothing less will be satisfactory for some people.

What an ABSURD statement! I have yet, even from the most die-hard Holocaust historians and believers, require, or even SUGGEST, something like the absurdity you present!

I realize that even daring to respond to this post is an invitation to an argument. But why is it such a touchy subject, and why should it be offensive to anyone to say that 1)talk is cheap and therefore people should be allowed to talk, and 2)my constant hope is that no one is ever imprisoned, starved, sent to a shower only to find it was cyanide instead of water coming out, and finally cremated in a crematorium.

It is not 'daring' to respond to such posts. What is 'daring' is to minimize and mis-characterize the Holocaust and its outcome in the manner you have done!

[w4rma]

2. Good. (nt)

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[William769]

6. You want to talk about irony?

Oy vey. :eyes:

[Behind the Aegis]

8. How is that irony? You do understand what irony is, yes?

"Irony," in this case, is you using a Yiddish term to "praise" the prior post.

[William769]

11. You think I praised the prior post?

There is no irony, I was being sarcastic that the poster was trying to shift the blame from what was the Crux of the original OP to the U.S.

[Behind the Aegis]

13. My apologies.

Sometimes sarcasm doesn't translate well in the written form. Given the other responses, save one, in this thread, I reached the wrong conclusion about your post. I have found that posts about the Holocaust are often met with ridicule, misdirection, strawmen (like the post to which you were responding), and just plain ignorance. So, I apologize again for misunderstanding your response.

[Behind the Aegis]

12. How very sad.

Not an unexpected response to threads like these, but sad, nonetheless. The goal of the Vietnam War was not to eliminate all Vietnamese, you do know that, yes? Of course, I haven't seen an conferences denying that hundreds of thousands of innocent Vietnamese were killed. The US has, in many wars, killed hundreds of thousands of people, including innocents, yet, I don't ever recall US policy dictating an entire group of people should be eliminated for "racial purity."

Your last paragraph could have been written, it certainly has been stated, by the Iranian president, himself.

[atreides1]

17. As someone who has American Indian Blood, I disagree!!!

"I don't ever recall US policy dictating an entire group of people should be eliminated for "racial purity."

What about Native Americans?


Granted, the policy wasn't in writing, but the intent was there, and they almost completed the job!

"By conservative estimates, the population of the United states prior to European contact was greater than 12 million. Four centuries later, the count was reduced by 95% to 237 thousand.

And according to the 1990 Census Report, the total population of the 30 largest tribes was 1,878,285.


On edit I was wrong it was official policy.

The Removal Act of 1830 set into motion a series of events which led to the "Trail of Tears" in 1838, a forced march of the Cherokees, resulting in the destruction of most of the Cherokee population." The concentration of American Indians in small geographic areas, and the scattering of them from their homelands, caused increased death, primarily because of associated military actions, disease, starvation, extremely harsh conditions during the moves, and the resulting destruction of ways of life.

The greed of Americans for money and land was rejuvenated with the Homestead Act of 1862. In California and Texas there was blatant genocide of Indians by non-Indians during certain historic periods. In California, the decrease from about a quarter of a million to less than 20,000 is primarily due to the cruelties and wholesale massacres perpetrated by the miners and early settlers. Indian education began with forts erected by Jesuits, in which indigenous youths were incarcerated, indoctrinated with non-indigenous Christian values, and forced into manual labor. These children were forcibly removed from their parents by soldiers and many times never saw their families until later in their adulthood. This was after their value systems and knowledge had been supplanted with colonial thinking. One of the foundations of the U.S. imperialist strategy was to replace traditional leadership of the various indigenous nations with indoctrinated "graduates" of white "schools," in order to expedite compliance with U.S. goals and expansion.

Nothing about racial purity here, just greed, even if it meant the genocide of an entire race of people.

[William769]

19. As a Cherokee you are completely off base.

[leesa]

16. How stupid.

Thank goodness this idiotic idea comes from the Land of the Free.

[nodehopper]

22. why is it stupid?

[originalpckelly]

25. It's not stupid. The Holocaust was real...

and the only stupid thing is denying it.

[BlueIris]

18. ...egh. Condemnation of Holocaust deniers is fine by me,

and some of the responses in this thread really illustrate the need for widespread condemnation, I think.

[Hobarticus]

20. While we continue to deny ongoing massacre in Darfur...moral leadership, indeed

Maybe we should introduce a resolution to do something about that....oh wait, action in Darfur isn't a shrewd political checkmate against Iran. Never mind. I'm sure Iran will be quakin' in their boots at this one.

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

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[George1984]

24. You mean the U.S?? nt

[BrokenBeyondRepair]

26. the U.S. drafting resolution for UN..

[WindRavenX]

28. you cannot be serious

:puke:

[George1984]

30. About what exactly?

Condemning people who are killing innocents, like the U.S in Iraq, or the Holocaust? I was getting to the point that if we are on track to summon the U.N as a vehicle to stop some the hate mongers and people spewing lies like the nut job in Iran, which I agree the haters should be stopped, why wouldn't the U.N be used by other countries to stop the U.S in Iraq? I thought we wanted the war to end. I know most of the world does.

[WindRavenX]

35. no no, it was a response to a comment that has been deleted

Absolutely condemn Holocaust deniers.

A poster commented that because the UN is condemning holocaust deniers that there might be something to what the deniers say--hence my disgust.

[Name removed]

40. Deleted message

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[WindRavenX]

41. the former

They deny that it ever happened, though usually the deniers say they're "just" trying to investigate to get the facts straight.

Giving them any time to air their propaganda or giving them legitimacy is sick.

[Deja Q]

31. There are many ways to see this.

However, I'm not bothering with the tinfoilhat beliefs of jingoism, drumming up war against that tinpot little warmonger than runs Iran, or even reusing the same words to fit other incidents when it becomes politically necessary to improve one's image...

I'm glad it's being done. The holocaust DID exist and it's incontrovertible. Unlike other historical events that are more readily subject to one's personal opinions.

The holocaust was just lowly animalistic viciousness against the Jews. Hitler used the Jews as a convenient scapegoat for Germany's problems, and that's the fault of the German people of the time. Hitler was a raving psychopath. With only one testicle and no brains and too much charisma. No wonder Hitler had issues, what with being called "one ball wonder" and all... How can anybody deny it is crazy enough, anyone who can attempt to find proof it never happened is utterly delusional.

[George1984]

33. Well said (nt)

[WindRavenX]

36. (I agree--I was responding to someone else, not the OP)

NT

[George1984]

37. Have to hate the deleted messages

:)

[WindRavenX]

38. lol yeah

These threads tend to contain a lot of them...sadly.

[Zynx]

27. The filthy bastards who deny the Holocaust are not even worthy of

comment but for the fact that there are unfortunately so many of them in certain corners of the world.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

29. I don't understand Holocaust deniers

What took place was horrendous and to deny historical facts about the atrocities is inexcusable.

[progressivebydesign]

32. This is not about the Holocaust, sadly, it's about wanting to invade Iran. n/t

[0rganism]

34. ding ding ding ding!! We have a Winner!

It's truly sad that we've reached a point where this sort of cynical assessment resonates as well as it does.

[Lurking Dem]

39. How would this help that effort, exactly?

Maybe it would also keep leaders from Malaysia from spouting the Protocols of the Elders of Zion in their speeches at the UN.

[Danmel]

42. Any thread that has anything to do with Jews

is full of deletes. It's just a fact. I/P, Holocaust, anything. Makes me want to start using that "block" feature- but you know- you should always know what people are saying about you.


My dad, he got that tattoo on his arm, how? All those poor shtel Jews in my family, for whom an egg on their birthday was a real treat....they all disappeared to where? Oh right they all went to Australia- they swam there from Poland- How could I be so stupid?