Pelosi warns Clinton diehards

[Newsjock]

Source: San Francisco Chronicle

House Speaker Nancy Pelosi Friday warned supporters of Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton, who are threatening to take the delegate fight as far as the Democratic National Convention, that they are pursuing "a scorched earth philosophy" that would seriously damage the chances of electing a Democratic president in November.

"There is too much at stake in our country for us to be thinking that we can afford the luxury of intra-party battles eight weeks before the election," said Pelosi, in her strongest words yet on the battle over seating delegates from Florida and Michigan. "We've had many months to have a debate, to come to a conclusion. And one way or another ... we have to come together."

... Pelosi responded to Clinton supporters who have vowed to take the New York Senator's fight all the way to the floor of the convention - chaired by the Speaker.

"I admire the enthusiasm of those who want to take this to the limit," Pelosi said. "But it will harm our party's chances to win in November. Their enthusiasm is wonderful ... but it's a luxury I can't afford."


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/05/30/MNQE110L6T.DTL&tsp=1

[TwilightGardener]

1. In a battle betwen Nancy and Hillary, Hillary will lose--

because Nancy actually gives a shit about the party, flawed as she is.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tnlefty]

21. This language is offensive to women, and it's only going to

further anger supporters of Sen. Clinton and a lot of women who post and/or read here. You're really not helping by referring to Sen. Clinton as ignorant, which she is not, nor by using offensive words referring to her.

I'm not a supporter of Sen. Clinton, but was this really necessary?

edit: this applies if you're referencing Speaker Pelosi, too.

[MindMatter]

25. Why do you assume he's talking about Hillary?

[tnlefty]

35. I edited it to include Speaker Pelosi, also.

It is offensive to refer to either in that manner. Both may be doing or not doing what one would like, but there truly are better ways to express it.

Calculating? Perhaps, and the calculation that I don't agree with truly pisses me off(i.e. impeachment is off the table; Hillary's IWR vote). Not liking votes or positions? Fine, but find a better way to express it. To this day I don't think that I've referred to Dimson** on this board as a 'dickhead' or a 'dickwad'. However, in this energized climate, I really don't think that using offensive language directed toward women is going to help bring disgruntled Hillary supporters, women in general, to accepting the presumptive nominee.

[pingzing58]

53. Nancy who "caved in" to Bush policy at every turn? Ms. "impeachment is off the table?"

[susanna]

55. No cr4p, pingzing58.

And I'm not even a Hillary supporter! Nancy has not impressed me at all, so her "advice" is pretty much useless to me.

[Fovea]

10. I think in a battle between Nancy & Hillary

Steny Hoyer, Rahm Emmanuel, and other right wing and center-right Dems in the House lose even bigger than Hillary.

Because she can hurt them more and longer if there is no hop when she shouts frog.

[math please]

20. its obvious, Pelosi needs to give Hillary a math lesson

So, Hillary is almost there . . . .

For her to get the nomination, as it currently stands,

with a majority of delegates (2,025) being recognized as the goalpost

Hillary, with a current total combined delegate count of 1,781

only needs . . .

65% of pledged delegates in Peurto Rico (36)

55% of pledged delegates in Montana (9)

55% of pledged delegates in South Dakota (8)


and only

100 % of the remaining Super delegates of (191)

to get to 2,025.

As Jim Kerry so eloquently put it. . .

In the movie (ironically enough)

Dumb and Dumber

“so you’re sayin' I’ve got a chance”


I understand enthusiasm, but what happened to understanding simple math?

Isn’t there some minimum math qualifications that a candidate has to met, in order to become the president of the United States?

[papau]

38. No -no impeachment Nancy cares only about being top female in DC - screw her

[Orrex]

2. Sounds like Nancy has swigged the Obama Kool-Aid

When we she acknowledge that the candidate with stronger campaign, the most delegates, and the majority of the popular vote just isn't electable?

[rainy]

4. Obama is electable. He has already proven that.

[Orrex]

34. Every time I choose to omit the :sarcasm: smiley, this happens

I had hoped that the sarcasm was obvious from the tone of my post.

:shrug:

[TheMadMonk]

42. not when your post immediately follows paupau's. n/t

[Fovea]

11. Don't panic

but I think Hill-aide is being re-called.

[gateley]

13. I think she first voiced her displeasure of Clinton when she said,

in response to a question about a Dream Ticket:

"I think that the Clinton administration has fairly ruled that out by proclaiming that Senator McCain would be a better commander-in-Chief than Obama," she said.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/03/11/pelosi-joint-ticket-impossible/

[robinlynne]

17. Good one gateley!

[Baby Snooks]

19. I think she first realized what a fool she was...

I think she also realized what a fool she was not to have allowed impeachment. I will always believe it was the "Clinton machine" at work. God forbid anyone stand in the way of Hillary becoming the first Madame President. Madame Speaker might have made a good Madame President. Until she made the decision to keep impeachment off the table thinking the Democrats could use George W Bush the way the Republicans used Bill Clinton. No doubt a decision influenced by Hillary Clinton.

And then along came Barack Obama...

[Lautremont]

3. THANK YOU POSI.

[Fresh_Start]

5. Nancy, just imagine if Congress had been effective

under your leadership. Maybe it wouldn't have an approval rate lower than Bush.
If there's a problem in November, count yourself as one of the contributors

[Frisbee]

6. Why...

Why is Nancy a sexist? :)

[seriousstan]

7. Empty can bluster. Exactly how is she going to stop Hillary from campaigning till the convention?

How is she going to keep Hillary from taking advantage of every Obama gaffe and using it to prove she is more electable? When the delegates vote, then there is a candidate. Until then, nobody has the power to make a candidate drop out. Hillary can still travel the country pushing her points all the way to the election. Should she is arguable, but Pelosi has no power to force her.

[gateley]

14. I would think her -- and many others' -- concern for the PARTY

would mean something. Apparently not.

[pnorman]

18. That's just as Nancy described it: "Scorched Earth"

n/t

pnorman
PS:

[truedelphi]

36. Oh I don't think many would quibble with you. Pelosi can make

Some noise but can't stop the process of Hillary dragging down the Demcoratic Party, and the entire country with it.

It is bad enough that Hillary helped stick us with four more years of Bush. But now she is willing to give us four years of McCain on top of it.

Just where DID the Clintons say their 109 million dollars came from anyway??

[CookCountyResident]

57. Exactly.

Pelosi is infusing more political power than she really has here.

[indimuse]

9. SYATC...Nancy!

WELL BAHAVED WOMAN

[Prophet 451]

12. SYATC? n/t

[The Diest]

16. See you at the convention? nt

[pnorman]

44. Here's another Sack cartoon, and my all-time favorite:

pnorman

[gateley]

15. Nancy needs to warn Hillary.

On second thought, she probably has. Nice of Hillary to share her concern for the future of the Party.

[stimbox]

22. District 8 Clinton supporters should vote for Shirley Golub!

http://www.shirley08.com

Send Pelosi a message.

[clixtox]

41. No matter who you prefer the Dem. prez nominee to be...

please send a message to Nancy Pelosi, if you are able to. Vote for Shirley Golub on Tuesday 6/3. Send her even a small contribution now!

[tidy_bowl]

23. Don't count Hillary out...nt

[FatDave]

24. Why the hell not?

At what point can we count her out then? When Obama crosses 2026 delegates, can we count her out then? Or when he crosses whatever the magic number is if we let Hillary break every rule that isn't in her favor...oh fucking forget it, I just don't have the energy for you fucking dead-enders anymore.

[Hart2008]

26. Pelosi is a sexist! n/t

[appleannie1]

27. For speaking the truth? If this continues we can kiss the chance

of a Democrat in the Whitehouse goodbye.

[Hart2008]

28. That was sarcasm...

Everyone who doesn't support Hillary is sexist, right?

[DWilliamsamh]

29. Nancy Pelosi is DEAD to me now! Sexist.

[ckramer]

30. Cat fights

Meow

[Peace Patriot]

31. I think I would disagree with Pelosi if it weren't for that "four weeks to the November

election." I don't know how that happened--how the convention got scheduled so close to the election--but that is a powerful argument for ending Clinton's campaign now, especially given its acerbic nature, affecting two of the Democratic Party's biggest voting groups--woman and blacks. I am not a Clinton supporter, but I feel that this primary contest has been great, and I would not mind at all seeing it "taken to the convention," if it weren't for the time frame. This primary fight is the most interesting thing that's happened in American politics in about 40 years. A REAL political contest, a knockdown dragout political contest as in the days of the Old Republic, with very real issues being slugged out between highly motivated candidates and their supporters. War--one of them for it, the other against. Refusing to talk to our "enemies" vs. willingness to talk and use diplomacy. Free trade--one for it, the other requiring mitigations. Topdown party vs. grass roots party. Big donors vs. a million little donors. And best of all, an unexpected, insurgent campaign against the front-runner, big name, big donor candidate--and that campaign's amazing success.

While I think that our political system is still largely manipulated by the global corporate predators who rule over us--and that an Obama presidency will likely be a disappointment to his supporters--this exercise in democracy that we have witnessed and participated in hones us for more democracy, and makes continued citizen activism--THE most important component of reform--more likely. I don't know about anybody else, but I've found the last couple of decades of corporate-TV orchestrated political conventions extremely dull, deadening and disempowering. I would love for us to have a REAL convention, where issues vital to our party and our country are argued and fought over. I think there would be high interest in it. But with four weeks to the general election, and with both the Clinton campaign and the corporate media prone to dwell on particularly divisive and irrelevant trivia, Pelosi is probably right. A lot of work needs to be done between now and the election--to pull us back together, after our raucous revel in a real political fight, and to do what we can to insure an honest, verifiable vote count, expose McBush and rouse the American people to an overwhelming Democratic mandate.

I tend to think that Obama will wipe the sidewalk with McBush, no matter what Clinton does at the convention. But it is unwise to take that risk, when it's perfectly clear who has won the nomination. Clinton should concede. She will have a lot more influence in an Obama administration if she does that now. And if something should go wrong with the Obama campaign--or if the corporate rulers decide to Diebold McBush into the White House--she will not be blamed. She has done us a great service by running. This political fight has produced a fully tested, fully vetted candidate who has already been through the fire. It is the best thing that could have happened to Obama, who was not very experienced in national politics to begin with. He has taken the worst pummeling she could give him, and has proven himself to be tough, resilient, savvy and unflappable--and has come up the winner, with fabulous grass roots support and organization. She should make a point of being onstage with him when he accepts the nomination, and get out there and help the party build upon the work they have both done to inspire party activists and voters. She could not do women--her strongest constituency--more good than this, being a force for unity, and for winning the November election in a landslide.

[John Q. Citizen]

33. No argument from me.

[truedelphi]

37. Your last statement is truly wondrous and hopeful

You say," She could not do women--her strongest constituency--more good than this, being a force for unity, and for winning the November election in a landslide."


And then your sig line - very nice!
"Anyone who isn't a conspiracy theorist these days isn't paying attention." --Paul Revere

[AlabamaBrightBlueDot]

39. actually she said eight weeks until the election

"There is too much at stake in our country for us to be thinking that we can afford the luxury of intra-party battles eight weeks before the election," said Pelosi, in her strongest words yet on the battle over seating delegates from Florida and Michigan. "We've had many months to have a debate, to come to a conclusion. And one way or another ... we have to come together."

I believe she was referring to the amount of time from the convention until the election...

[and-justice-for-all]

32. HRC fans, please do not ruin this for us all..nt

[BeatleBoot]

40. And Impeachment is Off the Table!!!

she screeched...

[kamtsa]

43. Does Nancy imply that we don't have the right to prefer McCain as a second best choice?

[hardtoport]

47. No, she isn't telling voters who they can vote for.

But she does have the right to expect members of the Democratic Party establishment to not insinuate John McCain is the second best choice. It wasn't cool when Zell Miller supported Bush. It isn't cool when Lieberman implants his nose in John McCain's wrinkled ass cheeks. It isn't cool to do things that damage the party. Period.

Besides, Hillary herself has made the point of saying that no one should consider voting for John McCain in the fall. She has said on many occasions that she will support the Democratic nominee wholeheartedly. If her supporters don't listen to her, or support the things she stands for, then they don't support Hillary.

What's more, John McCain is not a second best choice to ANYONE in the Democratic party. Read John McCain's platform and if you think that he is, then you are in the wrong party. And it would venture to say the wrong board. Just because some might mistake McCain for a moderate Republican doesn't mean they should try to form a fan club for him on Democratic webboards. They should find a Republican board that is pro-McCain...Oh, yeah, they don't like him, either.

[JCMach1]

45. So, Pelosi will get tough with Dems, but basically ignore Bush

:wtf:

[Amonester]

46. pssst

she's scared of the * family evil empire

[Lorien]

59. Nah, she just takes us for granted. She's under the same delusion

cherished by Dems for decades; that it's easier to win if you act like a republican-or at least kiss their asses.

[Seabiscuit]

48. "We have to come together" = FU to half of the Democratic voters who voted for Hillary.

And "unity" = Go take a long walk off a short pier, Hillary. Get out of the Messiah's way!

Welcome to the Orwellian Newspeak of 2008.

[harun]

50. What is she suppose to do? You Clinton supporters can't see past

your own noses. You have two choices Obama as the nominee or Clinton. Let's take Clinton getting the nod. Think through the scenario it would require for that to happen? You would need to have the super delegates over turn Obama getting the most delegates. This would fracture the party for years not to mention losing the election against McCain. Is that what Clinton supporters prefer? Because that is the only way this would play out for a Clinton nom.

If you don't want that to happen you need to have Hillary get out of the way and unite behind Obama giving him as much support as possible before Nov so he can beat McCain.

[Seabiscuit]

49. Since when did 68 days = 8 weeks???

The Dem Convention is being held from August 25-28.

The Presidential election is being held November 4.

There are 68 days between Aug. 28 and Nov. 4.

There are 7 days in a week.

8 weeks = 7X8= 56 days.

Pelosi is off by 12 days.

There are just 2 days shy of 10 weeks between the Convention and the GE.

And here I thought I was bad at math.

And some clown in this thread is actually deluded enough to suggest that Pelosi give Hillary a math lesson? Geeeesh!

[Sterling]

51. EGO's are out of control

Honestly I am disgusted by all the parties involved in this craven power grab. True colors have shown through. It seems you have to act ;ike a selfish douche bag to gain power? That kinda leaves us SOL in terms of finding leadership that will help us out of this crisis.

Now waiting for Clinton-Obama nuts to accuse me of favoring one candidate over the other or some other BS. We should all be ashamed of how our party has handled what should have been a great opportunity. We blew it before we even started by creating this "punishment" of our own fucking people because the happen to live in one of two states that dared disobey the almighty Party. Fuck that, the party and pols work for US! I could care less which candidate we pick at this point, the process itself has degraded what we claim to stand for.

[girl_interrupted]

52. Nancy Pelosi who took impeachment off the table, warning Democrats?

Sorry, can't help but find that amusing. Big Tough Nancy who let bush skate. Real scary. Between her and Harry "Joe Lieberman is a good friend!" Reid, what a joke. Nancy, you ought be concerned with getting everyone's vote counted so it doesn't come to that.

[cstanleytech]

54. You wanna bring up impeachment fine then

I will bring up the fact that it probably would have been political suicide for the democrats and they could have kissed pretty much any chance they had at winning the whitehouse if they tried that.
While the republicans are weak they are not weak enough for the democrats to force an impeachment of bush through regardless of how many of us think it is or is not warranted and the last thing the democrats like pelosi want is to give the republicans anything they can use to rally their base around and an attempted impeachment would be that.
It sucks, its sucks bad but its the bald faced truth.
Maybe they can nail Bush in criminal court after the election, I hope so but impeachment itself? That's a pipe dream these days not to mention you are blaming the wrong people, it was the republicans who failed the nation on impeaching bush, not the democrats...the democrats just truthfully lacked the power then and still do now really, simple as that.

[CookCountyResident]

58. Wow!

You pretty much took the words right out of my mouth.

[Popol Vuh]

56. What I saw today on TV from the Hillary supporters

Reminded me of this scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-DSTNsViLU