New York families of 9/11 victims came out swinging against Clarke

[0rion]

March 28, 2004 -- A group of New York families of 9/11 victims came out swinging against Richard Clarke yesterday, accusing the former White House anti-terror chief of cashing in on the tragedy with his explosive book.

In a scathing open letter, the furious families also ripped Clarke for releasing the controversial tome to coincide with his appearance before the 9/11 commission on Wednesday.

New York Families of 9/11 victims came out swinging against Clarke

[0rion]

1. Sad that 9/11 Families are attacking Clarke.....

who is making the TRUTH known, how the Bush Administration failed the American People.

In his interview with Russert on Meet the Press, he stated that a percentage would go back to the 9/11 families......

I feel like these 9/11 families who aren't supportive of Clarke are gold diggers. Why should they get anything from Clarke's book? He isn't exploiting the families, he is trying to HELP them get answers, what more do they want? MONEY?

[PaDUer]

3. Those families

each got a couple of million dollars each, hushmoney.

[shanti]

and the commission moms didn't

get the hush money?

[0007]

46. No. The hush money was to bribe the victim not to say anything

negative about the government and no protesting against the government once the money was accepted.

[Blue_Roses]

123. how do you know this?

link?

[0007]

133. I read it three or four weeks ago

You can probably google it as easy as I since your interested.

[saigon68]

19. The spouse of a service person killed in Iraq gets Peanuts

Some of the families of the environmental credit traders, stockbrokers and bond traders who got shredded, working at Cantor, Fitzgerald on the 90th floor got $$$$$$$$ MILLIONS and so it goes in the Great Democracy.

And apparently the company is doing fine with the following:

http://www.emissionstrading.com/index_profile.htm



Cantor Environmental Brokerage offers a full suite of environmental credit trading services.

"The Cantor Fitzgerald Clean Air Auction is easy to use, requires minimal effort on my part, and produces results. All of the associates are well versed in their knowledge and expertise, and extremely helpful. We will be back."

Ron Kawczynski
Shell Oil Products Company

[PaDUer]

41. It's a shame

that big corporations always come back...will even hide in bankruptcy, such as Dow Corning..none of these people care a rats ass about anyone who's been a victim of them--even the implant victims, also agent orange....

[aquart]

94. The company chose to take responsibility for its employees' families.

And prospered with that mission.

Why do you find fault with that? Do you believe any of those families are richer than they would have been had their family member lived?

(Full disclosure: The Cantor Fitzgerald head who appeared on TV looked familiar to me but I couldn't place it. Turns out I grew up next door to his cousin.)

[saigon68]

112. Its hard to respond to your comment, please bear with me.

"And prospered with that mission."

I have problems with "Clean Air Auctions". Selling the rights to acquire someone elses "Carbon Dioxide Emissions" I have problems with the whole idea of corporate greed. Read about their "mission" on their Website

"Do you believe any of those families are richer than they would have been had their family member lived?:"

Of course not---- they would have made MUCH MUCH more had they lived As one woman on TV so righteously stated, when who refused to settle with the Federales, "I can't take 4 million, the children would lose their polo ponys"


And thanks for the critical comments. I love it, when we can get tgether here at DU and debate in a civilized manner, on common ground.

[ProfessorGAC]

119. Ever Heard Of Time Value of Money?

The answer to your question is yes, they are richer. That doesn't mean they wouldn't rather have their loved one alive.

But, your conclusions about the financial benefit are incorrect.
The Professor

[nwstrn]

5. It is sad

I think the vast majority of 9/11 families want to understand what happened.

The families' statement reads: "The notion of profiteering from anything associated with 9/11 is particularly offensive to all of us." I hope they all objected to *'s use of remains at the WTC site to promote his campaign, and his use of a signed photo taken on 9/11 for fund raising. Who has attempted to profit more from 9/11 than *?

[The Backlash Cometh]

9. Who they should be protesting are the family members who agreed to

a million dollar settlement WITHOUT requiring an investigation. In fact, are these family members who are protesting, the ones who signed the contract?

[PaDUer]

2. There weren't actually

that many families..I read the thread at freepsville and even they said it wasn't that many..

[0rion]

4. Still sad. On NOW, the group of 9/11 families were very supportive....

of Clarke. I'm glad it is only a few people who are trying to take advantage of Clarke, are not representative of all the 9/11 families. I'd like to see that open letter to Clarke tho.

[nostamj]

59. 42 names according to MTP this morning

the bushies have their little crop of RW widowbots, starting with the "Let's Roll" widow. but, it's a very small and well-paid group.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

69. I wonder how many 911 victims those 42 people actually represent.

[progressivebydesign]

81. 42 names? Hmmm... do the math.

If there were (sadly) 3,000 people killed, each having at least TWO family members.. usually tons more.. then that would be at least 6,000 family members. Nothing against these 42.. but what in the world are these people thinking? They think Bush is protecting them? They think Rice is coming clean for them? They think that this man, who has 30 years of service in the biz is cashing in now? They should be ashamed of themselves for allowing partisan politics creep into this. Not Clarke.

[keithyboy]

87. I disagree with almost everyone posting to this thread.

These family members are entitled to their emotions and feelings and thoughts and opinions just like the rest of us. I can see where they might actually resent the publication of this book at this time. They are still dealing with the pain of their losses and to see someone attacking the President who stood on the rubble and proclaimed that he would get the people responsible for the 9/11 attact that killed their loved ones might be offensive to them.

Just because we disagree with them doesn't make them insincere, wrong, or foolish. Let us not stoop to the loweness of our opposition by doing the very same thing we criticize them for.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

90. I guess they missed the part where Clarke asked for their forgiveness...

...for his part in the failure to protect the people who died on 911.

I guess they also missed the part where a lot more of the 911 families support Clarke's actions, and protest Junior's use of 911 ads for his 2004 election campaign.

They may have also missed the part where Clarke is donating quite a bit of the money from the sale of his books to the 911 victims and special troops in Afghanistan.

Maybe you've missed the part where this move looks highly suspicious and smells Rovian to me.

JMHO.

[Name removed]

110. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[revcarol]

117. Do you want to detail Clintonian appeasement or Clarke perjuries

or just throw out charges to see if they will stick?

[frylock]

127. clarke did apologize..

unlike any of the assholes in the admin who are truly responsible. And if Clinton's policies were such crap, then how come the strategy created by the current lot of fuck-ups resembles the same plan Clinton pretty much had?

Speaking of appeasement, you do realize that one of UBL's demands was that the US abandon the bases in Saudi Arabia. You realize this, right?

[saigon68]

137. adios

[devinsgram]

106. I'm sorry, but I have to disagree

with your disagree. True, no one should get down in the mud with pigs, but when it comes to * and the rest of his group, you have to fight fire with fire. If the shoe was on the other foot, the repulsives wouldn't even blink about it.

[robbedvoter]

115. I'd have to make sure they are even 9.11 families

Freepers have been known to lie on occasion ;-(

[progressivebydesign]

121. I disagree with those that disagree with this thread...

Clarke is hardly playing politics... these families know better. He actually appears to be rather conservative. I find it so odd that I've heard (even from a Republican on the commission), that somehow Clarke is trying to secure a spot in Kerry's White House... his reply to that assertion was a very intense NO! Not one think Clarke has done has smacked of politics.. The families of the 9/11 victims did not suddenly become apolitical, saintly, or given a super-human grasp of international affairs... they are simply people who suffered a tremendous loss. A terrible loss. It does not put them above politicizing, either, whether they see it that way or not.

[BR_Parkway]

105. And how many of these people were in the middle of the

same sort of stuff that we all go through. Relationship problems, infidelity, separations and divorces. This is going to sound bad, but I can't help but think maybe a few of these folks came out "ahead" of where they would have. Settlement for their loss vs equitable distribution. Perhaps that is why they don't seem to want to get to the bottom of it - guilt.

[John_H]

125. So the 42 hard core republicans out of the at least 10,000 family members

decide to help chimp. Love the way the media gives that more play than all of the 911 families previous letters combined.

[toopers]

134. I think a lot of people question his sincerity.

Nothing he has told the public is new information to him. If he was sincere in his criticisms, apologies, and thoughts, he should have spoken up 2 years ago. His timing has made him suspect more than anything.

[Cooley Hurd]

6. Are these the same "familes" that also approved of...

...Shrub's use of images from 9/11 in his ads? Funny, you hear the same two names, Jim Boyle and Capt. John Vigiano Sr. And, just like before, no other names are produced, nor is the alleged "letter," itself.

Just as I said before, I doubt the letter exists - this is something straight from Rove's desk.

(0rion, that's for re-posting this with the proper title! :hi:)

[0rion]

14. That's what's most offensive! **** using 9/11 images to get REELECTED!

GRRRRRR!

[GalleryGod]

102. Round up the Usual Suspects! See If Lisa Beemer is Running for Congress?

The GOP wants her to run against Rush Holt sooooooo bad!
So??? EVERYbody's Lying? Is that it, STILL? O'Neill? Liar! Rand Beers? Liar!

[dai]

7. If Clarke had

blamed everything on Clinton, and written an anti-Clinton book, this same group of families would be praising him instead of bringing up accusations of profiteering.

[Snellius]

8. "He's showing a lack of loyalty to the president."

"It's all about greed. He shouldn't be doing this. He's showing a lack of loyalty to the president. It's awful."

This is such nonsense!

[Occulus]

95. Well, I'm almost done with his book, and

it's definitely not about greed, as much of it is a matter of historical fact, and he's not showing a lack of loyalty, because Clarke no longer works for the WH and had several other Presidents over him besides.

So, of a possible two accurate charges against him, the anti-Clarke camp ends up with a fat zero.

I agree; it's nonsense, and their outrage quite clearly shows that they haven't read the damn thing. He doesn't really start discussing the * admin until chapter 11.

[teach1st]

10. Releasing the book to coincide with hearings...

In a scathing open letter, the furious families also ripped Clarke for releasing the controversial tome to coincide with his appearance before the 9/11 commission on Wednesday.

I guess none of Clarke's detractors listen to what Clarke has actually said. As a reminder, the book was turned over to the White House for approval, the White House sat on the book for months, and it was published shortly after the White House released it. Clarke has said he wanted it published this past December.

[cloudSeven]

15. Clarke, bush and everyone else are liars in this scam

I'm sick of people using 911 as a wedge.

[TankLV]

18. It's bush* and his gang of thugs who are liars. Clarke is not one of them

That has been proven by the facts.

Stick around, you may learn some of the truth, not the drivel you spout.

We are also sick of people using 911 as a wedge, or for political purposes.

Glad you are sick of bush*.

[cloudSeven]

24. We could all use some "learning" Tank

It's cool to have a turncoat against bush but I'm not into lying. The 2002 versus 2004 stories don't jive and I'm calling him on it. We all know bush is lying so that is a moot point. I want some honesty out of Clarke and no more bullshit.

[scarletwoman]

28. Clarke has already said, "go ahead and release ALL his testimony"

AND his emails, AND the responses to his emails. He's not hiding anything, or trying to bullsh*t about anything.

I don't know where you're getting your information (Faux News, perhaps?), but you sure don't have the whole story.

I think YOU'RE the one who "could use some learning".

sw

[cloudSeven]

31. Faux News my butt

Lay off the personal attack please. I don't watch that shit.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

64. Yeah? What DO you watch?

[cloudSeven]

70. CBS news...the only near-liberal media left

Thank God for Dan Rather because he is the last of his kind.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

92. Oh, brother. I guess you missed out on the fact that CBS has been...

...a long-term CIA asset. You probably also don't know that Rather, and Cronkite before him, were CIA assets that were debriefed by the CIA after every trip abroad.

Operation Mockingbird
<http://www.prisonplanet.com/analysis_louise_01_03_03_mockingbird.html>

One more point...Rather lied back in 1963 when he stated that he had actually seen the assassination of JFK. Subsequent searches of all available photographs and film of Dealey Plaza do not show him to be anywhere near where he claimed that he was. He also lied when he was given an advance showing of the Zapruder film and he stated that JFK fell in a direction different from that actually seen on the film. In return for Rather's support of the official Warren Commission findings, Rather soon found himself reporting on LBJ as the new CBS White House correspondent. Rather continued to shill for the official Warren Commission findings on at least two CBS specials on the JFK assassination.

Hopefully, Rather is the last of his kind, but I regretfully doubt that to be true.

[TankLV]

32. I know plenty - I've been paying attention.

Clark isn't the one lying - HIS statements do not conflict.

It's ONLY Bunkerboy and his gang of thugs who have "inconsistencies".

YOU are the only one in need of education here.

Glad you got all your (one) repuke talking points handy.

Might want to try out a new suit for your final rest.

[PsN2Wind]

33. Bill Frist told you so, Huh.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

66. What do you know specifically about what Clarke said in 2002...

...and how that supposedly differs from Clarke's 2004 sworn testimony? I doubt if you have anything specific at all.

Here's another point...after Big Bad Frist ranted about wanting all of Clarke's 2002 testimony declassified so that they could get Clarke for perjury, the very next day Frist was back-pedalling at warp speed. So much for honesty, eh?

And one last point...Clarke has gone public with a request to declassify every bit of his previous testimony, documents and email.

You didn't seem to know the last two points when you started your little bad-boy exercise...now who's slinging the "bullshit"?

[Occulus]

96. There's nothing to call him on.

Even the people who were there confirm they can find no sign of conflicting testimony. The lack of a perjury charge to accompany these allegations is itself an indication that there is no discrepancy. Truthfully, Clarke should have called his 2002 testimony what we know it as: spin. He spun things to look pretty and buffed off the tarnished spots. * and his cronies do this every single day of the week.

Read the book yourself if you haven't. It's an eye opener to a very great deal more than just the * administration. It reads easily, and it's put together in a way that is designed to bring people up to speed with what's going on regarding global terrorism and counterterrorism efforts. I've learned more about those topics in the past four days than I learned in the past ten years.

Every single suggestion this man had ought to have been given due consideration. Richard Clarke comes across both in the book and on television as an intelligent, capable expert on counterterrorism, and his leaving the * administration may well end up leaving our leadership in Washington a whole lot more in the dark.

[9215]

71. What did Clarke lie about??

:eyes:

A wedge to divide whom?

:eyes:

[Occulus]

98. another disruptor in another thread

used just that term: wedge.

I think it was someone by a different name. Haven't the Bushbots figured out yet that if they all say the same things, people will eventually realize it's a coordinated effort and they'll lose credibility?

Oh, yes. Bushbots can't think for themselves, so of course they'd miss that little tidbit of information.

[9215]

108. I'm impressed with how DU'ers spot

these disruptor/freeps so quick.

[progressivebydesign]

122. Must be a hot topic!

We're getting a lot of new faces here.. same old bullshit.. new faces. I can always tell when the republicans are getting scared, we see an influx of brain-drains here.

[Occulus]

97. Read his book

and then retract that. 9/11 is only the culmination of decades of events around the world. I'm almost done with the book, and hey- it's really, really isn't what the detractors are saying.

Chapter one deals with 9/11/01, at the WH. He recounts what happened that day. The chapters that follow jump way back in time- twenty years or so- and deal with how we got to 9/11.

It's powerful stuff, and I remember bits and pieces of the results of operations he writes about in his book. This is history that occurred in my lifetime; the book fills in a great many blanks regarding the events I remember. It tells the 'why' of a lot of things.

My eyes are wide open after reading this- we need to fight a war on terrorism. We do not need a Bush leading our fight.

[Windy]

61. If the Whiteshouse approved it than obviously

there was nothing Libelous in the book! That speaks volumes!!!

[Llewlladdwr]

82. Actually, no.

The only thing the book was vetted for was whether or not it contained any classified information. It could still be libelous, false or anything else.

[Zhade]

103. Ding ding ding! Exactly.

I don't doubt that Clarke is telling the truth.

That said, I maintain that this is a limited hang-out, probably approved by the White House, likely without Clarke's knowledge. The dam is breaking on the truth about 9/11 - LIHOP or maybe even MIHOP - and the WH is doing a partial admission of possible negligence to avoid getting nailed for the true traitors they are. It's a huge risk on their part, and it may already be blowing up in their face, but the cabal is desperate. People are waking up, at least in regards to the BFEE, and that must have them plotting furiously.

It's like a controlled burn. They let Clarke run his course, but they held the book, so you know nothing truly earth-shaking can be in there. (I have yet to read it, of course, but I would be surprised if there's anything significant that was previously unknown in there.)

There's more to the story here.

[private_ryan]

11. any idea what paper this appeared on?

n/t

[Florida_Geek]

12. On MTP

The number was listed as 43 People signed that out of 3000 families that lost ones in 9-11

[cloudSeven]

13. Clarke, bush and everyone else using 911 makes me sick

None of these jerks deserve my respect for using 911 to their benefit. So Clarke gets an extra million or five to sell his book and bush gets the hawk vote. The praise of any of these whores here makes me ill.

[Union Thug]

16. What's the option?

Is telling the truth about the elitist slime in the White House now considered "using" 911? I consider it the most sublime act of patriotism.

[cloudSeven]

20. All sides are using 911 and it's disgusting

No side can use 911 in a positive manner so just stop it.

[scarletwoman]

23. So, what are you saying?

No one should talk about how 9/11 came about at all? You just want all discussion of how and why it happened to be shut down?

Head in the sand, "nothing-to-see-here" -- is that what you'd prefer? Pretty pathetic, imho.

sw

[callous taoboy]

129. Exactly, Scarlet:

By Cloud's standards it is wrong to write about any situation in which loved ones died (WW I and II for example) even if such writing could prevent another 911.

Clarke is perfectly believeable, he's stirring up the pot and now the scum is rising up against him.

[Katarina]

35. So what do you want done?

You want everyone to shut up about it? Is that what you want? I really don't understand mentalities such as yours. Someone steps forward to tell the truth and he's the bad guy? What are we supposed to do? Just forget that 9/11 happened? Not try to find what could have been/should have been done so we can prevent these kinds of things in the future. As far as I am concerned Richard Clarke put his life in jeopardy to step forward to tell his story. He's not the bad guy here. He has my respect and thanks for what he has done.
Point your anger towards the right people. Richard Clarke is not one of them.

[Crunchy Frog]

76. Well, since we know that the other side

will use 9/11 shamelessly as propoganda for their reelection campaign, do you think our side should just let them get away with it and not challenge it in any way? Why would you think that our side should do that?

Besides, these are in fact very important issues. If the Bush administration didn't do everything that it could to stop a 9/11 from happening, if they had intelligence and warnings, and just ignored them, that is a valid issue to bring up in the Presidential campaign. The American people deserve to have that information as a basis for helping decide how to vote.

Anyway, I believe that Richard Clarke is not engaging in partisan politics here. He is not connected in any way with Kerry's campaign. He is a man of honor who had a front row seat for the Bush regime's failures before and after 9/11, who has finally decided to tell his story, one which all American citizens have a right to know.

He is not "using 911" and he is not on any "side".

[scarletwoman]

21. How is telling the truth about warnings going unheeded "using" 9/11?

Do you understand what's actually going on here? The bush* White House has been lying to the American public for 3 1/2 years, Clarke is shedding light on the TRUTH -- and doing so at great personal risk.

Whistle-blowing is a far cry from "whoring".

sw

[dai]

27. Shutting up discussion on the Clarke

testimony would be the best thing for the Bush administration. They can't win, since it's his word vs. theirs and Clarke is the one testifying under oath.

Who do you think CloudSeven is looking out for?

[scarletwoman]

30. Well, he ain't looking out for the truth, apparently... (n/t)

[Crunchy Frog]

78. I think it only qualifies as "whoring"

if it actually does damage to the Bush regime, or hurts its election chances in any way.:eyes:

[maggrwaggr]

22. you don't approve of Clarke getting the truth out?

how the hell else was he gonna do it?

The whore media is only gonna report it if they can make money on it. Thus, a book. Think they would have given Richard Clarke the time of day if he hadn't written a book?

Give me a break.

[cloudSeven]

36. Give ME a break

Clarke is not telling the whole story and that is what pisses me off. All I want is the TRUTH and the whole TRUTH!

[Katarina]

37. So CloudSeven....

What IS the whole truth? You seem to know, so you tell US.

[cloudSeven]

40. That all previous and current admins are complicit in the death of people

like us.

I want ALL the dirty crap from every admin in the past exposed. We have been used for years as pawns and a single finger pointing at bush does not make me feel any better. I want ALL the past criminals exposed for their crimes. Bush, Clinton, Bush, Regan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy and on and on.

We have been raped by the elite and I am sick and tired of it!

[dai]

43. Then you'll be happy to know

that Clarke is calling for the declassification of all his past testimony.

What exactly Clarke is supposed to do about Kennedy's crimes is beyond me, but then again I think you're just trying to change the topic.

[Katarina]

44. And you think Dick Clarke can tell you that?

He came out with what he knows! You can't blame him for the sins of all past administrations! He's trying...which is more than a lot have done. We should be happy some people have felt compelled to come forward to tell their sides of the story. They are under no obligation to, yet they have. Why don't you turn your anger towards people like Condi Rice who does know things but refuses to tell the truth.

[cloudSeven]

49. He has been there 30+ years

I want ALL the dirt and all the lies through the years...not just the last few.

[Katarina]

52. well then you

are looking for the pie in the sky. We all know it's always been dirty politics. It's been that way forever and it always will be. Richard Clarke was damned if he did and damned if he didn't. People will look at attitudes like yours and say why bother. If coming forward gets them nothing but flack from all sides what the hell is the point. <sigh> Unfortunately we can't have it all.

[cloudSeven]

68. We can demand it all

And only vote for those that deliver it all.

[Crunchy Frog]

80. Good, then I hope you won't

be voting for Richard Clarke for President this year.:P

[never cry wolf]

84. Have you read the book?

I havn't yet, but from what I understand he does not pull punches against Clinton either. He has said in interviews that he was not satisfied with all that Clinton did either but at least Clinton did SOMETHING, unlike bunnypants who did absolutely nothing. This book is not about shrubbie's failures causing 9-11, it's about the US terrorism policy in general as he has seen it from the inside for decades, much of it goes into the mistaken action of the Iraq war as a response. That issue cannot be discussed devoid of 9-11 but it is NOT a book ABOUT 9-11.

[TiredTexan]

85. Clarke was only in the White House for

12 years when he resigned in 2003. Before that, he was in government service, but not on the White House staff in any capacity.

My Mom had a good saying about people like you. She'd always point out those who were arguing for the sake of arguing, and say: "Honey, never argue with a drunk."

You are a drunk. In other words, a waste of time to argue with in this context. You've made up your mind to discredit Clarke and his motives, and every time someone refutes your argument with either logic or facts, you come up with a new angle.

Also reminds me of an admonition I received from one of my law professors many years ago: "If you don't have the facts, argue the law. If you don't have the law, argue the facts. If you don't have either, just argue."

You're just arguing.

[Crunchy Frog]

79. How far back do you want Richard Clarke

to go? I believe he only goes back, either to the GeorgeI admin or possibly the Reagan admin,(I'm not sure which). Do you want him to either blow the whistle on every administration going all the way back to George Washington, or else shut up about what he actually knows about and was involved in?

I must admit, I find your arguements very mystifying.

[WhereIsMyFreedom]

126. I agree

I would love to see ALL of the dirty crap from every administration in the past exposed. After years of partisan investigation the only dirty crap that came up on Clinton was a blow job, so I think we've exhausted that admin. We're finally hearing about Bush Jr. After we finish with little Bush, it is time to move on to big Bush and then Regan.

So our wish is slowing being granted. Why are you so unhappy that little Bush is being exposed when you just claimed that's what you want?

[callous taoboy]

130. Feh

:eyes:

[9215]

73. Goodbye Psy-ops dude. nt

[revcarol]

118. First it was, "He's making money off the book."

Then it was, "He timed the book to coincide with the election."

Then it was ,"Everybody does it."

AND NOW you want the "truth," WITHOUT INVESTIGATION.

Methinks you've been bested and won't admit it because of your ideological bent.

But thanks for keeping the thread bumped anyway. We appreciate the dissemination of the information that a few families think loyalty to the President should supercede any actual investigation of the facts and prevention of future attacks. So, THANKS.

[yardwork]

25. So we're supposed to just ignore it? Pretend it didn't happen?

Since people are dying in Iraq I guess we should just ignore that too?

I don't understand your reasoning. A bad thing happens. So it's rude to talk about it?

[cloudSeven]

38. Using lies to push 911 is what bothers me

Using 911 to make a SINGLE DOLLAR bothers me even more.

[dai]

45. Push 9-11?

What does that even mean?

I'll probably get my message deleted for saying this, but are conservatives getting progressively dumber?

[Occulus]

99. Using lies?

Have you proof? Exactly what does Clarke lie about in his book?

Please, enlighten us.

[Zhade]

104. I'm going to go out on a limb here...

When you say

"Using lies to push 911 is what bothers me"

could you be trying to say

"Using lies to push (the government's version of what happened on) 911 is what bothers me"?

I think I'm getting a sense of you, and I'm not getting that you're pro-b*sh. If I'm reading you right, you're not a Republican.

[0007]

53. Hey goddamnit,

Richard Clark is giving a substantial share of the money from his book to the 911 victims and special troops in Afghanistan. Tell me what Clarke has lied about? If you can?

I don't think your up to speed on what's going on.

[Tellurian]

54. I'm not worried about Clark making money..

on his book...the people who are, however, are the smoke and mirrors crowd, who frequent this forum with their unrequited pomposity.

[9215]

72. You just want it to go away, Right?

:eyes:

[kysrsoze]

75. I don't think you've considered the fact that putting out a book like this

1. Allows for a wide dispersal of a LOT of damning information which would otherwise not have been reported by the media.

2. Protects the author's life by throwing all the info out there so it's not a question of just shutting that person's mouth by killing him/her.

Another poster also hit on the fact that the book was delayed for 3 months by the White House and THEY approved it for release. You don't like this? Wait for the book from Woodward.

[burrowowl]

77. He said this morning

on TV news that he had already made sure that part of the proceeds would go to 9-11 groups.

[74dodgedart]

109. Check outs Frist's Book

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0742522458/ref=cm_rev_next/103-6588421-8745418?v=glance&s=books&vi=customer-reviews&show=-submittime&start-at=31

Read the reviews.

Cashing in on the politics of fear

[DubyaSux]

17. Uniter?

Bush, the guy that claims he was a uniter, divided the entire world over the Iraq issue. Now he's dividing America, one family at a time.

[hyphenate]

26. It must be those same families

Who praised Bush when his ad campaign first debuted and they saw nothing wrong with the chimp-in-chief taking complete advantage of the WTC tragedy, even though he had said he wouldn't. Seems some of those families care for the money this administration is feeding them than the truth about * and his true goals and agenda.

[Malva Zebrina]

29. this is really a testimony to the complete disregard Bush has for anyone

these people are as compassionate as Bush. I cannot understand why they would want to pick a fight with others who suffered a loss, as they did. It simply does not make sense that the "with us or against us" mode of Bush has carried over onto these families. It is disgusting that it has come to that.

[yardwork]

34. Who are these people?

Has anyone actually seen these letters signed by purported families of 9/11 victims? Whose names are signed to the letter? Have they appeared in person anywhere? Do we know if they exist?

We know that the families who thanked Clarke exist. They appeared in person at the hearings and for TV interviews.

[Catfight]

39. Denial

Think about this, if you knew someone you loved died for no reason other than profiteering and neglect from someone you voted for, you wouldn't want to believe the facts either. At least I can understand some of these families that just don't want to face that ugly truth. That's why Bush has done more damage than he's little pea brain can imagine. Not only the 9/11 families, but the soldiers families who died for oil. How do you find peace with that truth? Plus you have this president stonewalling the truth, cover ups, no plan to end the war, and who got into office by cheating? When America sees Bush for what he truly is, a liar and an opportunist, there will be a wrath Bush won't be able to hide in his big Texas ranch from, and that day will be a good day for me. Bush has made a mockery of our country,he is the worst president in history. I pray every morning this will be his last day in office and impeachment will begin.

[Zorba607]

42. off topic

'"Richard Clarke is doing all of this to sell his book," said Boyle, whose Bravest son, Michael Boyle, died in the WTC.'
His Bravest son? And why is it capitalized like that? Did I miss some other part of the article where Bravest was explained or identified as a group or something? The way it's worded just sounds really amusing to me. It makes me wonder about this guy's other sons, they must feel kinda inferior. Or, since it's capitalized, maybe this guy gives each of his sons some familial title. Michael was dubbed the Bravest, Joey was dubbed the Sexiest, Jimmy was dubbed the Most Improved.
I don't know, it just makes me laugh.

[TheBlob]

55. It means he was a Firefighter. n/t

New York's Finest = NYPD
New York's Bravest = FDNY

[0007]

47. I can't get either link to work for me.

[genius]

48. Is this a Republican site? That's not what I'm hearing from the families.

My guess is that reporter is a Bush puppet.

[Tellurian]

50. No doubt there is a PLANT within the 911 families...

playing on their sympathys by deflecting their frustration and rage away from *!

[RhodaGrits]

51. Most of the criticism I've read is coming from people who

have obviously not read the book and have no intention of reading the book. Like the woman who told Leslie Stahl that she should be more fair and balanced like Fox News LOL

[pinkpops]

56. Is this the same group that published the other "open letter to america"

The one saying GWB was not exploiting 9/11 in his ads?
answer: yes
http://www.txcn.com/sharedcontent/nationworld/nation/030604ccktnat911KinSupport.5d1dadd8.html

[BiggJawn]

57. And what about "Let's Roll!"(tm)

Bet Lisa never dreamed Todd would bring her so much fame and money...

Pot, meet Kettle.

[Tellurian]

58. Hey, hey, whatchit!

you'll have Armorosa breathing down your neck for that racist remark!

Then, again- "She's FIRED!"

[BiggJawn]

62. Racist?

Oh-oh-I get it....I'm discriminating against exploited dead guys, right?

[leesa]

60. What kind of people are these? GOP operatives? Their family members

may have been killed by the negligence or complicity of the Bush administration and they don't want to know??? They are angry at the newsbearer???

I would check backgrounds on these people. Is this phenomena similar to the GOP operatives protesting the recount in Florida?

[hayu_lol]

65. Article on Buzzflash today clearly states that the Clarke...

book has been at the white house for clearance since November...it was just cleared for publication. Why blame Clarke for the publication date?

So far as Clarke has gone, he seems to be quite open about his part in the affairs of state. He is willing to have all the papers declassified(never happen under shrub)so that the people can see for themselves. Now, that is really pretty open.

[Neecy]

83. well...

I know someone who lost a brother in the WTC. She used to be a very liberal Democrat (came from a freeper family, and overcame it while in college).

Sad to say the loss crossed her back over to the freeper side for complicated reasons. Not all of them are GOP operatives, I think the events radicalized (especially when it comes to Muslims) some of the family members. People deal with it in different ways. I'm still shocked by a former liberal who is now radically pro-Bush, but it's not for me to say.

[yardwork]

86. She should take a close look at the connections between Bush and Saud

in that case. If your friend is angry with Muslim terrorists, suggest that she read the book.

[Neecy]

88. nuh-oh

Normally I'd try, but given the situation it would be a wasted effort, like someone outside of the grief circle trying to persuade them that their perceived lifeboat (Bush*) has feet of clay.

With anyone else I would, but not a 9/11 family member.

[Occulus]

100. Yeah, they're more sacred than everyone else.

:eyes:

[Neecy]

116. not really

But this family is still in a lot of pain, and the last thing I'd do is start a fight about politics. I only hope that my friend will come back to the light after more time has passed, as she's too intelligent to be a freeper for life.

[Bonhomme Richard]

63. I would bet my house that the firefighter, I think his name.............

is Moran, anyway he is the guy that got up during the 9/11 concert and wanted the terrorist to kiss his ass and told the terrorist who he was and where he lived. He lost his brother. He got a huge response and I believe he went on to do a song about 9/11. Well anyway, he is real close to Hannity, he even called the show a couple of weeks ago, when he was on vacation, to support bush. I would bet the house that this guy and Hannity are behind the letter.
Just my gut feeling. He is a big supporter of bush and loves Hannity.

[Bonhomme Richard]

67. The guys name is Mike Moran and

here is a link (it's an article at freeperville from newsmax) about how he came out supporting bush's 9/11 ads. He is also real tight with Rush.
the link:
http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/1091529/posts

[progressivebydesign]

124. His 15 minutes of fame...

People like Rush and Hannity make pets out of these people... use them to further their cause, then discard them like used tissues. It's that 'ooh, I get to say I know famous people' thing. It's rather embarrassing.

[Bonhomme Richard]

74. Hannity, Rush and the shrub machine are.............

behind this letter 100%. I'm sure of it.

[daleo]

89. The attack produced thousands of victims, thus thousands of families

With numbers like that, you can always find some representatives of any point of view. These seem like a very small minority.

[stopbush]

91. They're overlooking something important: Clarke was CALLED to

testify. He didn't call the commission and say, "hey, can I come in and testify?"

He's under oath. He has to tell the truth or risk perjury charges.

Do these families want him to get up and lie? He told the truth as he saw it. If his book hadn't come out, he would have given the exact same testimony. The WH could have released his manuscript long ago, or they could have sat on it until after the election. It came out now because that's when it came out.

He told the truth as he lived it and has provided more than enough documentation to support his claims. That's life.

[rocktivity]

93. Look who's talking about bad timing and exploitation

Why didn't they complain when they heard the book was coming out? If they were going to to say anything like this, they should have done it last week instead of first thing Monday morning.

The families who support Clark should release a similiar statement, and let's see how much press it gets.

:headbang:
rocknation

[oasis]

101. 9/11 is an American tragedy that has touched us all. Those of us

who seek the answers which led to this horrific event are grateful to Mr. Clarke.

[hippywife]

107. Not all of the 9/11 families

are toeing the adminstration line. Many want the truth...period.


http://www.commondreams.org/headlines04/0328-01.htm

But the hammering that Bush took during the hearings did little to appease (Andrew) Rice and other family members like him. To Rice, who chairs the 9/11 Commission Committee of the September 11 Families for Peaceful Tomorrows organization, the whole inquiry is one big fix that will do everything it can to hide the truth of what the US president and his closest advisors knew about the attacks.

www.peacefultomorrows.org

[Yavin4]

111. I Don't Take This Story Too Seriously

It says a "group of 9/11 families". I think that this is Rove counter spin.

[PA Democrat]

113. If the Bush administration hadn't been asleep at the wheel

I doubt this book would have been written. Clarke saw other terrorist attacks and worked for other presidents of both parties, and never felt he was compromising his principles, until bush.

[Mike Daniels]

114. Sadly, Clarke's testimony isn't making all that much of a difference

From further below in the article:

Meanwhile, a Newsweek poll released yesterday found that 65 percent of Americans say Clarke's testimony hasn't affected their opinion of the president.

Fifty percent of those polled said they believe Clarke is motivated by personal and political reasons.

----------------------------------------------------------------
Partisanship has basically destroyed critical thinking. It no longer matters what the person in power does. As long as he's from your party of choice then anything he does is acceptable vs. having the opposing party take over.

[PassingFair]

120. On the positive side...

the poll is totally bogus. The SAME newsweek poll, conducted on-line, showed something like 80 percent being adversely affected towards Bush. Also the 65 % that they DO show is a combination of two answers, including those who ALREADY HAD a NEGATIVE opinion of the pResident (and thus were unchanged in their opinion).

[atreides1]

128. My Question

Are these the same families that came out in support of BushCo using pictures of 9/11.

If they are, then that explains a lot.

[louis-t]

131. Is this 'open letter' similar to the phony letters from ..

soldiers in Iraq?

[0rion]

132. WOW! What a great response!

I need plenty of time to read all the replies!

[Joanne98]

135. Those 9/11 families care more about Bush than their dead loved ones

Just like rethugs sending their children to die for Bush. They're disgusting. They don't have the right to get in the way of the truth. This country belongs to all of us. Not just Bush worshipers. We deserve the truth and we're going to get it. Whether they like it or not.:P

[IconoclastIlene]

136. Better off dead

Like the woman who said; after 9/11 and she received a lot of the monies coming to her: "I hate to say it, but we will be much better off financially now than when (so and so) was alive.........sad but true.