so. i want to get one of these automatic weapons

[shugah]

are they on sale at k-mart now? i won't shop at walmart, so it doesn't matter if they sell them. do i have to go to the local sporting goods store to pick one up? or is there a particular gun place one goes to purchase automatic weapons?

i've decided on an ak-47. i don't know why, particularly - it's just the gun i want!

i've always been pretty much in the "anti-gun" camp, and all my friends and family are having a pretty good laugh when i tell them i am going to buy an ak-47. i guess i'll laugh last, because i really am getting one. i'm not sure why, but i have an urge.

how much do these automatic guns cost?

[rockymountaindem]

1. Automatic weapons are still illegal.

Sorry pal.

[shugah]

4. so i can't get an ak-47,

pal?

[RivetJoint]

45. Sure you can.

But it's not a full auto AK-47. It's semi-auto only. Type in AK-47 on Google. It will tell you where you can buy one.

[mhr]

15. What If I Travel To Iraq As A Haliburton Truck Driver And Buy One

From the Iraqi Insurgents.

Then I take it apart and ship it back to the states in little bitty pieces.

Seems that this could be a thriving business on Ebay now that Ebay business has been officially sanctioned by the VP.

How could anyone complain since I'd only be selling the parts, not the complete weapon.

I'd call my Ebay company Iraq War Souvenirs.

[rockymountaindem]

43. I believe that's already been tried.

Someone noticed that AK-47 parts were being sold by one guy on e-bay that added up to the whole gun piece by piece. They shut down the auction and banned the dude. They watch closely for these things, especially considering that European restrictions are much tighter than American ones.

You can still get AKs right here in America, but they will be semi-auto, not full auto.

[Shopaholic]

2. Ah--but you can take one of these semi-automatics

and turn it into an automatic weapon with a minimal amount of fuss--ain't AmeriKKKa great?

[EstimatedProphet]

5. Can you?

How, exactly?

[mdredmond]

22. No, you can't <nt>

[mdredmond]

7. Re: automatic weapon with a minimal amount of fuss

No you can't. For some of them full-auto parts are available, but you must legally own a registered full-auto model to buy them - no dealer who doesn't want to go to jail for a long time will sell them to you.

[EstimatedProphet]

9. Exactly

That's a common statement-"they can be easily converted". But who really knows how? I don't.

[mdredmond]

19. Any semi-automatic

can be turned into a fully-automatic weapon with varying degrees of difficulty/reliability. There is no legal way to do it. For those weapons that are/were available in both semi & full auto versions, the full-auto parts could be put into the semi-auto model. But the parts are themselves considered automatic weapons and are impossible to come buy if you don't have a license & registered full auto weapon.

[greblc]

23. All you need is a good Machinist.

[EstimatedProphet]

24. Besides

it's not like the average person who gets a gun can simply take it apart and put in the new parts, and have a machine gun just like that. there's a little matter of gunsmithing knowledge, so that you can know how to go about doing that. I'm no gunsmith, so I seriously doubt I would be able to do it.

[mdredmond]

29. Anyone who owns the weapon

would know how to install the parts. I, for example, have an AR-15. If I were feloniously-inclined and had a source for the parts, I could install them - it doesn't take any gunsmithing knowledge. But that's for my rifle.

For most rifles the parts aren't made at all. You'd need to (a) know the weapon intimately and (b) have machine-shop skills to fabricate the parts. So yeah, gunsmithing-type knowledge.

[EstimatedProphet]

41. OK

what I am opposed to is the media-driven attitude that all one has to do is go get an AK-47 and a screwdriver, and after 5 minutes work, have a fully-automatic weapon. Bullshit! In most cases it can't be converted, and in ALL cases it can't be converted anywhere near that easily and legally.

[greblc]

30. No but...

If you own a weapon you should know how to:

Take it apart , clean and reassemble it. (This could give you the knowledge to swap out parts)

Know how to store and operate it safely.

[EstimatedProphet]

3. Well, even though a Democrat, I want an AK-47 too.

However:
1) AK-47's are not fully automatic. You won't get one of those legally, period. You don't have the right licenses, and it is doubtful you ever will.
2) The AWB didn't change anything about automatic weapons, even though the media painted it in that way. The AWB really didn't address what the problem guns are-I used to have a .22 that was covered by the AWB!

[shugah]

8. what if i know someone who has one?

and would sell it to me? could i legally own it?

[mdredmond]

14. IF

they own it legally, then they could transfer it to you. You would have to pass a background check, get fingerprints & photos taken, get approval from your local police chief or sheriff and pay a $200 transfer tax to the BATF.

If they don't own it legally, they can't transfer it to anyone legally. And had better be damed careful if they don't want to go to jail forever.

[shugah]

25. they own it legally. BUT

you are throwing alot of red tape out here. is it this difficult to purchase a gun?

i see guns (shotguns and handguns) at garage sales. granted, they are not automatic, or semi-automatic, but no background checks or other criteria required. if i ran across an ak-47 at a garage sale at a bargain price, i'd grab it! are there serial numbers or something to identify? how does it all trace?

thank you, mdredmond, for any insight you can offer.

[mdredmond]

32. Red tape

I was speaking of a fully-automatic weapon. Yes, tons of red tape for that but doable, depending on where you live (some states have stricter laws than others).

In most states you could buy a rifle or shotgun at a garage sale with no paperwork required. Yes, they all have serial numbers. The numbers are tracable from the manufacturer through distribution to at least the first retail sale (customer). After that, private transfers aren't traceable (at least though the serial number) - BUT they remain traceable to that last retail customer.

For example, XYX makes a gun. They sell it to the dealer. The dealer sells it to me. I sell it to you. You rob a bank and drop the gun. The FBI traces it to to the dealer. The dealer provides them with paperwork showing he sold it to me. I tell them I sold it to YOU. They come get you.

Nobody with half a brain will sell a gun privately without getting the name/driver's license number of the person they are selling to - perhaps with a signed bill of sale.

Note that all of the above applies to SEMI-auto weapons. If you lucked into someone selling FULL-auto at a garage sale, then you MUST do all the red-tape stuff to do the transfer. And if the weapon isn't already legally registered, it can NEVER be legally registered - it is contraband forever.

[ArkDem]

44. You have to have a class III license. $1500 annually.

[FeebMaster]

47. You're mistaken.

You only need the license to deal in machine guns, not to own them. You can own them after paying for the tax stamp, which is a one time payment of $200.

[FeebMaster]

6. They aren't on sale at K-Mart.

Cost? Well I'm not really up on machine gun costs, but probably not less than $5000. Probably closer to $10,000. Assuming of course that you live in an NFA 'friendly' state. Maybe you should just get a semi-auto AK clone. Those are generally less than $500. I don't know if they sell those at K-Mart, my guess would be no. Walmart doesn't sell them, at least not the ones around here.

[mdredmond]

10. Screw the AK

Best bang for the buck is an AR-15. It is also the most versatile - a bazillion combinations of stocks/barrels/accessories make it a terrific gun for everything from plinking to small animal hunting to to competition target shooting. http://www.bushmaster.com

[FeebMaster]

13. I'm not really interested in arguing which gun is better

This fellow said he wanted to buy a machine gun, specifically an AK-47, so I discussed the AK-47.

[mdredmond]

16. Ok

Well the AK-47 isn't a 'machine gun' - it's just a semi-automatic rifle that shoots the same size bullet as a hunting rifle. It looks scarier though. As you said, he could pick one up for 500ish give or take. Depending on who he buys it from there could be some paperwork involved.

[FeebMaster]

28. Well he specifically said automatic

so that would make it a machine gun.

[mdredmond]

33. Sorry

I was having a hard time keeping up with the thread. I was the one digressing.

[shugah]

31. so i can buy an ak-47? n/t

[mdredmond]

34. Yes <nt>

[shugah]

12. clone, hm

well, that is an option... but i think it's an ak-47 for me. nothing else will quite do. and so far, this thread makes me think that i will not be able to get one. damn! where the hell is MY 2nd amendment????

[Eye and Monkey]

18. Gun Shows.

Go to gun shows in your area. You'll find something close to what you're looking for, and you'll get a cultural immersion experience as well.

[Eye and Monkey]

27. how about this - from the online gunshow classifieds? an AR-15?

Hey, I know it's not an AK, but maybe it'll do?

http://www.okcgs.com/bbs/

In Response To: Looking For Used AR 15 (Tracey)

I have a Bushmaster 16" HBAR carbine forsale. It is about 1 month old and has about 100 rds through it. I'm looking to get $795 for it. I just paid $905 brand new. It comes with 4 - 30 rd mags. Email me if your interested.

Here's what it looks like (more or less):


please note: I am in no way a gun affectionado, I found this that quickly thru a yahoo search...that's really kinda sick, isn't it. It took me about 9 minutes to find someone who's ready to sell such a lethal weapon to people he doesn't know, online.

[mdredmond]

37. Illegal

for him to ship this to someone across state lines without doing the transfer through a licensed dealer, who will get required paperwork from the buyer.

[Eye and Monkey]

39. Aw. I guess Shugah'll have to actually go to a local gunshow.

Well, at least she can sorta window-shop the online classifieds, maybe she'll find someone in her state.

[FeebMaster]

26. Well if you really want an AK-47

there's not necessarily anything stopping you, provided you live in a state that hasn't banned machine guns. DU has a number of machine gun owners and I'm sure they'll be able to point you in the right direction if you really want to buy one. It's a pretty craptacular process, though.

First, as I mentioned you have to live in a state that allows machine guns. Most do, as far as I know. You'll need to find one for sale, which might be harder than it sounds since Reagan froze the civilian machine gun supply at around a quarter million in 1986. An AK probably shouldn't be too much of a problem, as long as you don't want anything fancy like an original Russian one, since importing them got dicey in 1968, but you could still legally manufacture them here until 1986.

Of course, once you've got one lined up to buy, then you'll need your fingerprints and photographs to send along to ATF with your paperwork. The Chief Law Enforcement Officer in your area will also have to sign off on your paperwork or its no machine gun for you. Then you send all that stuff off to ATF with the $200 tax and just wait a few, or many, months for them to give you the OK.


Now, if you decide that's a load of crap that you want no part of, I certainly wouldn't blame you. In that case, you could go to a gun store and they'll probably be more than happy to find you a relatively cheap semi-auto AK clone, if they don't have one in stock. Unless, of course, your state has it's own version of an Assault Weapons Ban.



damn! where the hell is MY 2nd amendment????

They dragged it out into the street and put a bullet in its brain 70 years ago.

[greblc]

11. Every Iraqi is entitled to one Automatic Rifle...

and by god and every American should have one as well!

When they enlist...

[TA]

17. Here's a good site to find reading material on AK-47's and more

In case we need to get ready for the revolution.

http://www.ak-47.net/catalog/military.html

[greblc]

20. Carefull TA...

you don't want to lose the element of suprise!

[mdredmond]

21. They are so well armed

I don't think surprise would help much.

[mhr]

38. Watch Out Freepers - So Many To Choose From - Thanks For The Link!

eom

[jpgray]

35. Find someone who owns one manufactured before '86

Buy it from them, pay the tax, send out your passport and fill out some paperwork, and presto! it's yours. Have fun, er, doing whatever the hell it is you want the thing for.

[Comadreja]

36. Hunt Deer?

[shugah]

40. nah- i'm not going to hunt deer

i'm a vegetarian, and a tree-hugger (read: environmentalist from the deer POV ;-) )

my gun thing has nothing to do with "the natural balance." i couldn't shoot a living being.

for some reason, i find i want to have a gun - and i feel that i want it to be a superior gun. i'll probably take it out for target practice a time or two, and never think about it again.

or, frame and mount it - the gun, i mean.

[-..__...]

42. You're in the wrong department.

J/PS is 3 aisles down to the left. AK's are 4th shelf on the right.
Ask for a sales associate or Mr. Pantload for assistance.

[Surf Cowboy]

46. They're not automatic, hot rod. Spread crazy somewhere else.

Believe me, we're OK here.

[slackmaster]

48. Please read up on the subject

You appear to be badly misinformed.

http://www.recguns.com/Sources/IIF1.html

[hiphopnation]

49. DU loves 'em some guns. n/t