Please Don't Shoot My Husband: Some Facts

[EFerrari]

Two Facts to Keep in Mind:

People with mental illness are FIVE TIMES as likely to be the victims of violent crimes as people without mental illness.

The number of people with mental illness who are violent (who victimize other people) is less than 1% of that total population. Of these, 50% of violent incidents are directed toward themselves, family members or friends.

In the Communities:

NAMI has been fighting the criminalization of the mentally ill for years. Here is a snip from their library:

http://www.nami.org/Content/ContentGroups/E-News/19982/March_19982/Urgent_Request_to_Contact_your_Elected_Officials_about_theCriminalization_of_People_with_Serious_Bra.htm

Urgent Request to Contact your Elected Officials about the Criminalization of People with Serious Brain Disorders

A special report today on the front page of the New York Times highlights what is the most egregious fall-out of inadequate care for people with serious brain disorders such as schizophrenia: incarceration. The article quotes NAMI’s executive director, Laurie Flynn, E. Fuller Torrey, and NAMI Board member from California Carla Jacobs, and is written by reporter Fox Butterfield.

Entitled "Prisons Replace Hospitals for the Nation’s Mentally Ill," it argues that: (1) jails have become holding places for people with severe mental illnesses—the new mental hospitals; (2) imprisonment usually occurs as a result of arrests for minor crimes (disorderly conduct) that are the result of the illness or so-called mercy arrests, where police pick up individuals with these illnesses because they have nowhere else to go; (3) 1 in 10 of people behind bars has a severe mental illness; (4) imprisonment is damaging for the consumer with a severe mental illness often resulting in inappropriate treatment and extremely stressful and even dangerous circumstances; (5) there is an increasing number of juveniles with severe mental illnesses finding themselves behind bars; and (6) the criminalization of mental illness is a direct result of a flawed public mental health system.

POLICE DEPARTMENTS KNOW THAT LETHAL SHOOTINGS OF THE MENTALLY ILL HAPPEN TOO OFTEN AND ARE TAKING STEPS TO REDUCE THESE INCIDENTS:

CIT Training:

http://www.nami.org/Content/NavigationMenu/Find_Support/Your_Local_NAMI/State_and_Local_NAMIs/Crisis_Intervention_Training_(CIT)_on_the_Move_Across_America.htm
Crisis Intervention Training (CIT) on the Move Across America

Crisis Intervention Training (CIT) programs are designed to educate and prepare police officers who come into contact with people with severe mental illnesses to recognize the signs and symptoms of these illnesses, and to respond effectively and appropriately to people who are experiencing a psychiatric crisis. Because police officers are often the first responders in these incidents, it is essential that they know how critical periods of mental illness alter behaviors and perceptions, can assess what is needed in the moment, and can bring understanding and compassion to bear when they are handling these difficult situations.

CIT training provides them with the skills to make a safer intervention for themselves, for the consumer in a crisis, for the consumer’s family and for the community. A key feature of the training teaches police officers effective methods of de-escalating the crisis situation and "reaching" the person in crisis. This approach allows consumers in distress to participate in the decisions about their treatment and facilitates consensus about the immediate safe course to follow.
CIT History, Training Curricula and Outcomes

Memphis, Tennessee is credited with the first program started in 1987. The Memphis, Tennessee Police Department established their CIT program to address concerns from the public over a few high profile incidents. A number of jurisdictions across the United States have adopted similar programs, and NAMI organizations are urging more to do so.

The Memphis Police Department CIT Academy program is a forty-hour course that is completed in a one-week session. The instructors include Physicians, Psychologists, Licensed Social Workers, Specialists, and Police Instructors. CIT Academy students receive training in:

* Introduction to clinical disorders, including Borderline Personality
* Psychotropic medications
* Dual Diagnosis and Substance Abuse
* Legal Issues
* Suicide Prevention
* Elderly and Children’s Issues
* Developmentally disabled
* Community resources
* Consumer perspectives
* Intervention strategies

CIT Academy students also complete scenario-based training and testing. Students must complete a series of scenarios taken from actual mental health related cases. Students are evaluated by mental health professionals and experienced CIT officers.

A large portion of the academy is hands-on training that is facilitated by site visits. Students will interact with mental health consumers who are high functioning, as well as consumers with civil commitments to treatment, and those who are committed to a forensic unit. Students will tour various facilities to receive an understanding of the entire mental health system.

Findings of program effectiveness, compiled by the Memphis Police Department's CIT teams, are beginning to be replicated in outcome studies in other states where the program has been instituted:

1. Criminal recidivism by mental health consumers is reduced.

2. The relationships between law enforcement and mental health care providers are improved.

3. Less than 1% taken to a hospital emergency room were found NOT to need emergency medical or psychological care

4. Officer injury rates are reduced.

List of States and Localities offering CIT Programs*

* Memphis (TN)
* Portland (ME)
* Montgomery County (MD)
* Baltimore County (MD)
* Louisville (KY)
* Frankfort (KY)
* Lee’s Summit (MO)
* Kansas City (MO)
* Orlando (FL)
* Jacksonville (FL)
* Pinellas County (FL)
* Seminole County (FL)
* Akron (OH)
* Toledo (OH)
* Minneapolis (MN)
* Houston (TX)
* Austin (TX)
* Albuquerque (NM)
* Tucson (AZ)
* Portland (OR)
* Seattle (WA)
* Anchorage (AK)
* Athens-Clark County (GA)
* Roanoke County (VA)

* This list is incomplete, as it is still in formation

MORE: COPS STARTED THE CONSENSUS PROJECT TO BRING STAKEHOLDERS TOGETHER AND IMPROVE THEIR RESPONSE TO MENTAL HEALTH INCIDENTS -- specifically, to the shooting and killing of 2 schizophrenics in a period of months by the Milwaukee PD. To their credit, cops in that Department got this very valuable program rolling.

http://consensusproject.org/about-the-project/history_methodology_ab

snip:

The Criminal Justice / Mental Health Consensus Project Report is the result of dozens of days of meetings among leading criminal justice and mental health policymakers and practitioners from across the country, surveys administered to state and local government officials in communities in 50 states, hundreds of hours of interviews with administrators of innovative programs, and thousands of hours reviewing materials describing research, promising programs, policies, and legislation. This appendix describes the history and the methodology of this project in greater detail.


Project Origins
The Council of State Governments (CSG) developed the Criminal Justice / Mental Health Consensus Project in response to requests from state government officials for recommendations to improve the criminal justice system's response to people with mental illness. State government officials identified this issue as particularly pressing for several reasons. Practitioners and advocates have approached lawmakers in capitols across the country explaining the urgency of the problem. Newspaper headlines describe tragedies involving people with mental illness that seemingly could have been prevented. And, the current approach to responding to people with mental illness has placed an enormous strain on criminal justice and state budget resources.


A valuable message from the Consensus Project may be, law enforcement knows that the mentally ill get dead at a rate unacceptable to law enforcement professionals themselves. Kudos to the guys at the Consensus Project.

And btw, the thread title is literal: Please don't shoot my husband! :(

[DELUSIONAL]

1. Thank you for this information

If the death (murder) of this innocent man can help EDUCATE everyone about mental health issues -- then perhaps his life and death will not have been in vane? It isn't for me to say but those who knew and loved him.

[EFerrari]

3. Yes. Because we are all involved. Our decisions shape

this policy -- even if we have to kick and scream to be heard.

:hi:

[The Stranger]

2. Kick and recommend for greatest.

[goodhue]

4. It has been a big issue here in Minneapolis

Minneapolis cops killed Barbara Schneider and then several others with mental illness.
After community outcry, city revamped its CIT program.

[mzmolly]

7. I remember that. She was about 100 pounds dripping wet.

The original complaint was that her radio was too loud. Very tragic.

I have a bipolar family member who has become delusional on several occasions - and to a bipolar person who is paranoid, everyone is trying to kill them. There is no reasoning, in many situations.

At times my family member was manhandled into the hospital by members of our family as we had no alternative. The thought of her dying at the hands of police who are not properly trained has crossed my mind on more than one occasion.

Here is more on the Minneapolis situation you note:

http://news.minnesota.publicradio.org/features/200203/12_hughesa_shootingfolo/

So tragic. I've often wondered why tranquilizer guns are not used in some cases?

[EFerrari]

11. After the Long Beach PD shot and killed a schizophrenic in

2001 (it was right around there) I sent the department a letter of support and a referral to the Consensus Project AND THEY FOLLOWED UP.

Sometimes, offering a decent resource can do a lot.

:)

:kick:

[mzmolly]

51. Very thoughtful of you.

:hi:

[EFerrari]

53. Or, check this out:

We have to build the network, mzmolly.

Because, who could do this alone?

:hug:

[EFerrari]

16. You know, my OP may be wrong! It may have been the

Minneapolis PD that got the Consensus Project going.

Their "about us" is so abstracted at their site. But, I talked to one of the cops involved and he was the best. He was turning it around for his department and, ultimately, for the rest of us.

:kick: for Minneapolis PD

[EFerrari]

5. And, a kick for all our cops who have to deal with this

with no training or support.

:kick:

[hunter]

6. Kicked and recommended.

This situation is so messed up, and I am astonished by all this "blame the victim" stuff I am reading here on DU.

Yeah, folks, this story is the ugly face of the United States. We won't solve the problem by looking away from the mirror.

[EFerrari]

8. hunter: notice the OP shows COPS taking a leadership

role in changing this situation. That's very encouraging.

On the other hand, Air Marshalls don't have ties to a physical community and may need extra support to get their stuff straightened out.

[hunter]

29. I'm not feeling any great hostility towards the marshalls.

But there was a time in my life I was estranged from my family and living in my broken down car behind a church. The pastor offered me a room, but truth be told, I was happier in my car. ;) Yes, I was a bit unhinged, but utterly harmless. (Some people on DU know why I take this personally, and others may have guessed.)

[EFerrari]

34. Hey, I've been "mostly harnless" myself .

:hi:

[patrice]

9. There are Great Psychologists who regard some "Mental Illness"

as a functional response to De-Humanization and the Generalized Insanity of our lives.

[EFerrari]

13. Freud said neurosis was a defense against reality.

He was right about that, lol!

[SoCalDem]

10. In Riverside, a few years back the cops shot an old homeless lady

who was swishing a broom at them..

[EFerrari]

12. These incidents are legion. But notice, not acceptable

to COPS any more. In the kinder, Clinton era, we were making big gains. Let's not allow these to be wasted.

:kick:

[EFerrari]

14. Kick for the families dealing with this as kindly as they can

with limited resources and little community support and for life. Kick for our families.

:kick:

[Im with Rosey]

61. Kick for everyone

This can affect everyone, my personall feeling is that there are varying degrees of mental illness that have yet to be identified. Until we completely understand all the possibilities, we must not allow incidents to go unchecked. Who amoung us can honestly say they have always been completely "under control"? Who can honestly say that there have not been situations that have pushed us over the edge?

[proud2BlibKansan]

15. Kicked and recommended

[BronxBoy]

17. Thanks for posting this.

I was getting extremely frustrated by the inattention being paid to the training issues in this tragedy. I guess it's eaiser to pick a team and get on it that to try to look at the real issues.

I have read several accounts of your husbands struggle and I admire both you and him.

[EFerrari]

18. The thing is, people want to get it right!

If we devise an action to encourge the personnel involved, to demand training for them, we may well get somewhere.

NAMI's statement is here:

http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Section=December3&Template=/ContentManagement/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentID=28896&lstid=641


And while I usually support NAMI, after a while, orgs get tone deaf to them.

Grassroots have a good chance of breaking the sound barrier.

:hi:

[EFerrari]

19. Kick for all the people who were frightened

by this terrible incident so carelessly. Who are afraid to fly on airlines they are subsidizing.

[goodhue]

20. This really should be the focus.

CIT for air marshalls.

[EFerrari]

30. I couldn't agree more. I don't want any of those guys

who signed on for the most dangerous duty possible to have to live with the fact that they shot and killed an innocent person.

We can change that. We can get them the training they need if we keep our heads.

:kick:

[EFerrari]

21. This is mr sfexpat. Does he look like a terrorist threat to you?

Here is a short list of his community work:


San Francisco Symphony

Celebrity Pool Toss / TNCC (benefits affordable housing)

BGP Earthquake Benefit

Thunder Road Benefit Celebrity Roasts (benefits rehab center for teens)

Toys For Tots

Santa Rosa First Night New Year’s Ball (clean and sober event for SR Families)

Travis Air Force Base

Men’s Health Magazine

Rotary Clubs

Walden House (rehab center)

Run For A Drug Free World

Bureau of Primary Healthcare (conference on mental health and homelessness)

* * *

That's the short list. We laughed when someone gave him an award inscribed, "Thank You, Doug Ferrari, for Making Mental Health Possible."

Lmao!

If Doug was dead, he couldn't have done any of this. Something to think about maybe.

:kick:

[Jim__]

22. I wonder if air marshalls are trained in dealing with the mentally ill

It does seem like a civilized nation ought to give some consideration to the fact that in protecting ourselves from mass murderers, we should not accept a high probability that we will kill people who present no real threat. The latest things I've read on the air marshall shooting on the plane indicate that they've now backed off that this man ever actually claimed to have a bomb; but rather they shot him because he was "acting like" he had a bomb - whatever the hell that might mean.

The history of suicide bombers does not lead us to expect that they will run up and down the aisle of the airplane, "acting like" they have a bomb. So, maybe this is not the type of behavior that air marshalls should be looking for, or that should trigger a "shoot to kill" response from them.

My belief is that these marshalls probably acted within the guidelines that they have been given. If so, I think that we, as a society, should fight to change those guidelines. We should also ask that law enforcement officials, especially those who are trained to respond with deadly force, be given some training in recognizing behavior that indicates a mental or emotional illness.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[hunter]

31. Are you even reading this thread?

:shrug:

[Critters2]

35. There was no reason to think he had a bomb

Passenger witnesses concur that he never said he had a bomb, and that he was trying to get off the plane (which is a damned peculiar way of blowing it up). His wife even said, as he was trying to get off "He's sick. He needs to get off the plane". But, I guess to a federal employee that would sound a lot like "He has a bomb." Doing a heckuva job.

These Air Marshalls should be prosecuted for murder.

[EFerrari]

37. Or, they need to be trained to distinguish between

a person in distress and a terrorist. :(

[bettyellen]

40. what was the situation at the time exactly?

[EFerrari]

41. We're still assembling facts.

But more and more it looks like, the air marshals had no training to dealing with a brown skinned guy having an attack of panic or paranoia who just wanted offa the plane. :cry:

And this is a problem. Because travel is a huge trigger for some people tilting with mental health issues. Not to mention, the concerted cya spin that the networks unloaded on us.

There was no bomb, most likely no talk of bombs, just air marshalls trying to do their job according to their training and a whole culture still in denial about mental illness.

:(

[bettyellen]

44. in serious denial is right. people attitudes haven't changed much since

i was a kid and my oldest brother was suffering from schizophrenia. Even within the family we were sort of expected to ignore it. People used to say it was better he died, there were no good meds back then, there seemed to be little hope of getting him back on track.
Better off dead at 19. Hard to believe, huh?
And I didn't realize the similarities until today, he was panicked, and running from the guards. Not bullets, but the roof's edge.
Scared people run as much as guilty ones do, what's so hard to understand?
Thank you for the OP, Beth.
:hug:

[EFerrari]

45. I never met my sister in law.

because she took her own life at 25.

We can do better than that.

:toast:

[bettyellen]

49. this society has a long way to go, i'm afraid.

but yes, we need to do better.
:toast:

[EFerrari]

57. And we will. We certainly will.

:toast:

[EFerrari]

33. I agree. Our Air Marshals can only be as effective

as the training they receive.

Let's make sure they get some better training, and not this cut rate bs they are being stuck with.

[EFerrari]

79. You put it much more clearly than I did. Thank you.

:hi:

[bettyellen]

23. kicking w/ thanks.

[EFerrari]

39. . . . .

:hug:

[Catchawave]

25. Again, common sense.....

"Special Needs" people are "teddy bears with a fuse", as I posted in another thread addressing yet ANOTHER topic on the Miami tragedy.

My special needs adult child doesn't fly very often, we take the train and auto :)

[EFerrari]

28. Yes! Creative alternatives -- make life possible.

:)

[bloom]

50. Common sense

The topic of this thread is education for law enforcement - and an appeal to people to consider that things may not be as simple as they seem.

Your family member (FAM) may recognize mental illness when he sees it and know how to respond appropriately. Not everyone does. So some people - esp. those charged with protecting the public - may need training so that they can act with "common sense" when faced with a difficult situation.


What is common sense for you does not necessarily make sense for others.

Flying is what made sense for the couple coming home from South America.

Flying may never have been a problem for this man before - so you can't assume that this couple could have predicted that the man would go running off the plane. Or that it won't happen to someone else.

I expect there will be people with various problems/concerns who will also think twice about flying after this episode. A lot of people already avoid it.

[Catchawave]

56. yes, I understand......

..which is hard right now, coming from yet another thread started by a mod calling fam's killers.

I have both in my family.

Special Needs kid, who is MY responsibilty as his parent/mommy and legal guardian to keep him safe from harms way. You betcha the gate agents/conductors/and mall dicks know when we're passing through...BECAUSE.. if he freaks on me, I'll need their help.

FAM boy's been doing his gig for over 4 years, since 9-11, he left a cushy state probation/parole job to risk his life every day in this uncertain world :( Yeah, I'm proud of him, I'm also on any 'breaking news' airline "disaster" in the world with my heart in my throat. FAM's can't even tell their mommies their schedules :(

Is it a shooting in Miami or a plane skidding off a runway in Chicago...these are all deeply personal to me.

I assure you the FAM's are trained to protect us, just as I am trained to protect you from my whacky special needs kid :)

[EFerrari]

59. Hey, I' ll trade you

:)

[PA Democrat]

26. Great info, sfexpat2000

I also want to say how much I admire your efforts to educate people about mental illness despite some of the hurtful remarks I have read here.

I have a child with autism and the autism community has also been actively working with law enforcement to prevent tragedies due to lack of training. It is a win-win scenario.

[EFerrari]

27. Yes, it is! Let's carve out this little space for sanity

effective policy and a better way for the kids.

:toast:

[zippy890]

32. thank you, great information nt

[understandinglife]

36. Thank you. Very compassionate of you to post this.

Peace, my friend.

[EFerrari]

38. We do what we can, UL

Peace to you and yours.

[Ladyhawk]

42. I couldn't make it through your post without reliving something

horrible that happened to me as a result of severe depression a couple of years ago. A certain nurse in an ER needs to have her ass fired for how she treated me, but even though I've complained, not a damn thing has been done. Confronting the emotions that well up whenever I think about what that day cost me is so hard that I don't want to pursue the issue any further. That's the problem. When I'm functional, it's all I can do to stay that way. I don't have the energy to go out and slay dragons, too.

Shame on the system and on people who coddle those who mistreat the mentally ill.

[EFerrari]

43. You are NOT alone, Ladyhawk.

:hug:

And if we use our heads, we can get this cleaned up.

:kick: for all of our great DUers who are willing to look at this situation and who know we can ALL do better, that we will ALL be safer if we insist on proper training for our Air Marshals.

:kick:

[Ladyhawk]

46. I'm looking at both sides of the current issue.

It seems we need some more facts to ascertain exactly what happened. Regardless, I feel for this man and his wife.

When I was at my lowest point, a nurse in an ER berated me, had me held down and injected me with an unknown drug without my permission. I was completely non-combative. She just wanted me to suffer because she said her other patients were "more important" than me and that no one had shoved "those pills" down my throat (referring to a drug overdose). When she brought me a charcoal "shake" to drink, she made it perfectly clear she'd rather forcefully pump my stomach.

As far as I know, she was never even confronted after I filed a complaint. I wish I could make her pay in some way, but I have no power.

[EFerrari]

47. kIck for all of us who have been frightened with bogus bogey men.

:kick:

[EFerrari]

48. Please kick for a better policy

:kick:

[goodhue]

52. .

[goodhue]

54. .

[EFerrari]

55. Let's kick this for a better outcome please.

We can do that.

:kick:

[goodhue]

60. okay

[goodhue]

70. .

[goodhue]

76. .

[goodhue]

77. .

[goodhue]

84. .

[RedOnce]

58. Excellent , much needed post! Thank you.

[EFerrari]

62. Could we have one more nomination, so more DUers will see?

Thank you, DUers. You are the best.
:loveya:

/I couldn't type my way out of a tea cup

[nicknameless]

63. Kicking for real help.

Incarceration, abuse and capital punishment for people in need?

Sadistic sociopaths are sick too. When will that be recognized in this society? Individuals like that seem to just be winding up in higher office and positions of "authority".

Better that they get professional help than be hired to protect and serve those they hate (other people).

:(

[EFerrari]

64. kick

[EFerrari]

65. a little kick right here

[Bluerthanblue]

67. there is not vaccine

to prevent mental illness- if folks really comprehended that, this thread wouldn't need kicking-
Thanks Sfexpat2000.

something positive needs to rise out of this mess-

[EFerrari]

68. Yes and that positive thing would be us.

:hi:

If Doug and I can make it work, ANYONE CAN.

:kick:

[EFerrari]

66. a kick for DU

:kick:

[EFerrari]

69. kick

[merh]

71. kick

and please, don't shoot her husband. :grouphug:

:loveya:

[EFerrari]

72. merh

:hug:

[merh]

73. sfexpat2000

:hug:

[Rebelry]

74. oops, wrong placement.

[Rebelry]

75. thank you! Very important info!

[EFerrari]

78. Hi there, Rebelry.

Hope you're enjoying DU. :)

[freedomfries]

80. thanks for sharing sfexpat!

[EFerrari]

81. This situation is common as corn.

We might as well get good at dealing with it.

:hi:

[ArmchairMeme]

82. Learnilng new compassion for those I know

who deal with Bipolar.

Thanks all for this discussion.

[EFerrari]

83. Welcome to DU, ArmchairMeme.

:hi:

[hedgehog]

85. Society is so confused on this entire issue

Families can't get help for sick members because of medical costs and/or because of patient's rights, but it's perfectly OK for a sick person to be left to wander the streets to be a victim of the real sickos out there.

[EFerrari]

86. That's right! Being homeless, okay.

Flying one a plane, not okay.

:crazy: