If Lincoln ran today in the Democratic primary, would he have a chance

[efhmc]

to win. I know that he would not ever be a repuke in these times. He was too much a man of the people. I don't think he would make it as the party's candidate and he certainly would not have had a snowball's chance in hell of winning the presidency. (Suffered from depression. Had a crazy wife. Too tall, lanky and pretty ugly. And then there were the issues.)What do you think?

[thom1102]

1. Lincoln didn't have a chance when he ran

He ran against a split democratic party. Democratic party was split between the north and south over the issue of slavery and its abolishment and that was the only reason he won.

[efhmc]

3. Good point.

But I was thinking how far afield we have come in many ways in selecting candidates. Looks and intimate details of ones family life seem to be more important than character. In his corner were wonderful speaking skills, a great logical mind, a fabulous sense of humor and the ability to align himself with the average person.

[rooboy]

2. Nah... his clothes, the hat... nobody would vote for him now. n/t

[efhmc]

4. Well, he could probably hire a pr person to help with some of that.

Remember how much his wife was criticised for being a spendthrift and sort of silly.

[Boudicea]

8. Giggling at your (rooboy, that is) silly remarks!

nt

[efhmc]

10. He would probably be seen as a country boob or worse a redneck.

//

[Ohio Dem]

12. Plus, how old would he be?

190? That's too old to run for President.

[efhmc]

14. Yeah, but think what he would have learned through the years.

Probably could have warned us not to trust a bush.

[WoodrowFan]

27. 194 Years Old. (Born Feb 1809) NT

[Maddy McCall]

5. That's really the kind of question that can't be answered...

Even though he is best known for the Emancipation Proclaimation, he was a racist who thought of black people as "beasts." He didn't want them in the U.S.; he wanted to send them back to Africa after freedom because he believed that blacks and whites could never live in harmony.

People are products of the context of time in which they live. IF he had lived in the 20th century, he would have been a different person. The world is different, and he would be too, so there is no way to answer that question.

[efhmc]

6. Of course, you are right. I guess I was thinking more about his

appearence and how much emphasis is put on that today, rather than of his policies and thoughts since they would have been shaped by the times.

[Cthulu_2004]

17. It's unfair to judge him by today's standards.

To us, he seems to be a racist. Yet compared to the rest of society at the time, he was anything but. There's no way he'd hold those views if he was raised in modern times.

[efhmc]

23. I have noticed that many of the issues that we see as old hat now were

once VERY controversial. I think in a few years no right thinking person will see Gay rights as anything but normal and necessary. People are still arguing about women's rights so I'm sure that issue will be around for a while, but it has been accepted by all who are clear thinking.

[LincolnMcGrath]

7. Have I been nominated?

[efhmc]

9. Please send us a picture and a resume and we'll let get back to you.

But I'm not sure when.

[Cthulu_2004]

11. He'd lose...

nowadays, he'd be running on a socialist platform or as a Green.

[Maddy McCall]

13. Are we talking about the same Lincoln?

n/t

[Cthulu_2004]

16. Yup...

Think about it...if he was around today, do you REALLY think he'd hold the same ideals that he did then? Of course not. His ideals were a product of the times. For example, his solution to the issues regarding African-Americans was (at least as stated in the Lincoln-Douglass debates) to ship them all back to Africa. Why is this? Because it was the ONLY plausible and politically acceptable solution at the time. Would he hold this position now? NFW. Think about what would have happened if Lincoln had lived long enough to read Marx.

One of Harry Turtledove's "alternate history" books has exactly this scenario in it. It's a good read.

Lincoln was a far-left, hard-core progressive. His positions, viewed today, are laughably conservative. Yet at the time, they were incredibly radical, to the point that his election precipitated a civil war, with the conservative states pulling out of the Union rather than stay with him at the helm of the nation. Additionally, he certainly "bent" the Constitution more than a little to keep the Union together. Given that, what on earth makes you think that Lincoln would be any LESS radically progressive today than he was back then?

[efhmc]

22. I think he would be VERY progressive. That is why I know he would

not be a repuke. So maybe you are right, he would have been part of a less establishment group. The only part that I don't buy is that he really wanted to be elected so might have compromised for that.

[efhmc]

15. Now that is very interesting. Please tell me more.

Please.

[sujan]

18. Lincoln = Big business

[efhmc]

24. Okay, could you please explain how that is true and if so would it

make him electable?

[pizzathehut]

19. No, the far left would have accused him of starting a war.

He would of had protesters holding signs saying "No Blood for Cotton" in front of the white house. They would have said we should not interfere in the internal affairs of other countries (and in those days individual states were). But if he hadnt slavery would have lasted at least another 20-30 years.

[efhmc]

20. You are comparing Lincoln to bush???

What is that about?

[WoodrowFan]

25. No, but

We did have people arguing here a few weeks back that he was a war-monger dor "starting" the Civil War...

[WoodrowFan]

26. No, he'd be too damn OLD!! (n/t)

[efhmc]

28. That is not what bothered me about his statement,. It is, in my mind, his

comparing bush and the Iraq situation to the Civil War. And by the way, we were not considered to be "countries". Texas came in as a counrty and gave up her rights as such when she did.

[WoodrowFan]

31. Ah ok,

I misunderstood.... :spank:

[efhmc]

33. The tone of his whole statement disturbed me and I was trying to get

some feedback. It seemed a little "conservativeish" to me. Could be wrong, have been a time or two before. (Ha-Ha)By the way, I am assuming the poster is male.

[efhmc]

21. Also, the "far left" of the time was against slavery .

[efhmc]

29. One would have to say that the people who elected him started the war,

since everyone was fairly sure that once Lincoln came to power war could not be averted.

[Fight_n_back]

30. Most of you

would consider him too moderate and be angry at his railroad money backers. His looks would be the smallest concern. He was made fun of aqt the time. Politics isn't dirtier now than it was then. Alexander Hamilton publicly accussed Aaron Burr of incest for cryin' out loud

[efhmc]

32. I believe you are right.

I always liked Lincoln and considered him a flawed but great person. (Like another I could mention.} I especially liked his humor but even that not taken against the time is often quite racist. Thanks for your insight.