Teens Support More Gun Control

[MrBenchley]

Just one more indiccation of how out of touch with most Americans the Republicans, the RKBA crowd and the corrupt industry they pimp for are:

"More than a third of American teens personally know victims of gun violence, and almost 74 percent of them believe there should be stronger gun controls, according to a national teen survey to be released today in Chicago."

http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst-nws-gun26.html

[Romulus]

1. what controls do they want?

That is the question.

Do they want:

a ban on the unlicensed interstate selling of handguns? already there
a ban on straw handgun purchases? already there
a ban on underage possession of handguns? already there
strict ownership rules on machine guns? already there

I want "more gun control," i.e. no transfers w/o a background check. Do I count as a "more gun control" supporter?

[MrBenchley]

2. Yeah, be sure and tell us

there's all the gun control we already need in place...

[Romulus]

3. didn't you read what I wrote?

I give up. :shrug:

And you never answered my other question.

[MrBenchley]

10. Course I did

and gave it all the response it deserved

[DonP]

4. I rely on teenagers for most of my political and civil rights input

Are these the same teenagers that have trouble telling the difference between the Civil War and WW II and can't identify the three branches of government?

If they support your point of view and you're happy with that, great.

I'm not sure I want to view any survey of American Teenagers, however statistically valid as a reliable source for making my decisions. The same way I won't rely on either the biased VPC or the biased NRA for my point of view on the second amendment.

Don

[CO Liberal]

8. This is the Next Generation

And it might be the generation that finally does something about the gun problem in this country.

[slackmaster]

18. Like other generations, they'll grow up

By the time they come into power they will have outgrown most of their irrational fears. Gun ownership peaks when people reach their late 40s and early 50s.

[CO Liberal]

19. Maybe, Maybe Not

This generation may have seen enough violence to realize that guns are NOT the answer.

[MrBenchley]

11. Better than relying on right wing loonies

and a corrupt industry

[DonP]

21. Ummm, no it's not better

Read my post again.

I don't rely on either the biased NRA or the biased VPC for my input.

Teenagers that have the lowest incidence of voting as an age group, are generally totally dependent on t heir parents and, if memory serves me correctly, usually have a life view that is 180 degrees away from what their parents believe.

I'd like to meet a teenager that says; "Yup., my Mom and Dad are right about everything."

If anything this could indicate that their parents feel exactly the opposite of their point of view, e.g. we don't need more gun control. But that's totally unscientific and just based on anecdotal observation of course.

Anyone out there have a teenager that agrees with their parents on all, most or any point of view? Show of hands please?

I thought so.

Don

[MrBenchley]

22. Yeah?

Surrrrrrrre....

[CO Liberal]

26. "Teenagers that have the lowest incidence of voting as an age group"

Uh, Don ...... the voting age is 18. Most teenagers CAN'T vote.

Your statement makes about as much sense as the brain-dead GOP politician here in Coloraado (Mary Ann Tebedo) who said that teen pregnancy rates tend to fall after age 25..............

[DonP]

30. I knowt it starts at 18 but ...

I'm a part of the generation that fought for the age being lowered to 18 from 21. I can't tell you how many forensic clubs had "Resolved: Old enough to fight, old enough to vote" as a topic when I was in school (back before the crust of the earth had fully cooled as my school teacher daughter frequently points out).

It was really disappointing to me to find out that after all that effort the voting rate for the newly franchised 18 to 20 year olds was miniscule and that the MTV "Rock the Vote" and other efforts had little or no effect.

I saw the numbers for every age from 18 through 70 plus last year somewhere and the teenagers were way behind every other age bracket. Sad but true. It's their world to run and I wish they took more interest and were more involved. I guess that comes with time, experience and having a mortgage and school loans to pay off

But, I still don't want to take advice from them on much of anything, unless of course I decide to buy a surfboard or MP-3 player

Don

[Township75]

5. This is my favorite quote from the article

"A total of 36.5 percent of teens said they could get a gun if they wanted to..."

So the solution is to pass new ineffective gun control laws, rather than attack the problems (e.g. economy/poverty, broken families, depression) that push people to act violently?

Unfortunately, to some it is.

[MrBenchley]

13. What a silly post

"attack the problems (e.g. economy/poverty, broken families, depression) that push people to act violently? "
So instead of doing something that is easily accomplished and would cut down onn the violence, RKBA "enthusiasts" want to re-engineer American society and human nature. Ho-kay.

[Township75]

68. I have bookmarked your post so that in the future...

people can know the anti gunner mentality.

"RKBA "enthusiasts" want to re-engineer American society and human nature."
This is the anti gunner response. Forget the poverty, broken families and other problems that can drive people to crime, they do not exist. It is the guns! The guns make them do it! How dare you think that attempts to give peopel jobs, stable families, and hope would impact crime. WE MUST GET THE GUNS!!!!

All the Dem candidates talking about the economy and Bush's tax cuts must be RKBA enthusiasts, because they seem to speaking more like me than you...I haven't heard them address gun control nearly as much as the economy and jobs. You anti gunners must hate them all.

[MrBenchley]

72. Hell, tattoo it on your eyelids if you want

"Forget the poverty, broken families and other problems that can drive people to crime, they do not exist."
It's good to see that distortion and lying are still part of the RKBA tradition.

"How dare you think that attempts to give peopel jobs, stable families, and hope would impact crime."
Is that what all that sniveling about "liberal judges" and calls for harsher punishment from the RKBA crowd are about?

"All the Dem candidates talking about the economy and Bush's tax cuts must be RKBA enthusiasts"
Even if they were, the RKBA crowd and the gun lobby would lie their asses off about them.

[demsrule4life]

78. Nothing silly about it

You have also said what about gun control in other countries in other threads. Gun control is tough in Germany but shooting is a very popluar sport. And being stuck in the middle of europe it is not hard to bring guns in from other countries but the rate of crime commited with guns is very low. I would have to guess it is because Germany has a much better social system then ours when it comes to education, job training, medical care, if you lose your job you dont have to worry about starving. But the taxes are enough to kill you. In our country it's every person for themself and everyone else be damned. Yes we have to be re-engineered to be more like the way we used to be, when neighbors cared about each other and if a person fell on hard times could count on help untill they could get back up on their feet. If you could answer one question for me without your normal one line remarks why was crimes committed with firearms so much lower 40 years ago when it was so much easier to buy them then it is now? My guess is people still cared about each other.

[slackmaster]

6. Teens smoke crack, drive without seatbelts, and have unprotected sex

Maybe we should lower the voting age to 13, eh Benchley? :freak:

[MrBenchley]

14. What a silly post

No wonder John Lott seems like a scientist to RKBA enthusiasts.

[slackmaster]

16. Pinch us another loaf of gun-grabbing monkey shit

You're a barrel of laughs today, Benchley.

[MrBenchley]

23. Gee slack, we can tell

from the RKBA screams of rage...

[slackmaster]

25. Broadcast another hernia-inducing guffaw

America awaits your words of whiz-dumb.

[MrBenchley]

34. Sorry, slack, but I got facts

and the RKBA crowd got horseshit.

[slackmaster]

35. You've got propaganda and lies and fairy tales

Tell us all about how I've sided with Ted Nugent and the Michigan Militia, only this time provide links to prove it.

[MrBenchley]

44. Nope, that's the RKBA position

which you're valiantly trying to prop up with ire.

[slackmaster]

52. You attributed it to ME, PERSONALLY

I consider your remarks to be defamatory and demand that you either substantiate your claims (that I support Ted Nugent and the Michigan Militia), or retract them, or go to your grave a liar. (Not meant as a threat, just a statement of what will eventually happen.)

[MrBenchley]

59. Hahahahahahaha!

Yeah, ri-i-i-i-i-i-i-i-ght.

[Spoonman]

7. Wow

opinions from teens. I wonder how many of them know what laws are in place already? Probably less than 5%.

Teens, the same ones that think MTV programs such as Punk'd and The Real World are great sources of "news".

Would these be the same "teens" from all the school shootings that you are now pimping for?

Tom Vanden Berk, president and executive director of Uhlich Children's Advantage Network, a Chicago-based child welfare agency that will release the survey. "We ought to listen to what young people are saying."

We should listen to;
I am a good driver
I have nothing to wear to the prom
I hate school, the teachers are mean
I love pro wrestling, you know it's real
Are baggy jeans still in fashion
I would vote for that candidate - They're hot!

[MrBenchley]

15. Cry us a river, spoon...

They show better sense than the entire RKBA crowd combined.

[Spoonman]

20. Yea,

keep hanging out with your "informed" teens, you won't get any wiser, but you may learn a whole lot about MTV.

[greenwow]

9. Nice

> almost 74 percent

Wow! That's almost 3/4 that would rather have a safe life than destructive toys. Teens have been paying more attention that I thought.

[CO Liberal]

12. Maybe They're Taking Out Their Frustrations With Video Games

Rather than on other people.........

[MrBenchley]

17. Interesting, eh?

Another hopeful sign...

[Superfly]

24. Yeah...when I was a teen

I still believed in Santa Claus.

[MrBenchley]

27. You said it, not us, fly

Now you believe in Charlton Heston and the gun fairies....

[Superfly]

28. Boy, nothing escapes you, huh Benchly?

Except the occasional sarcasm.

Now go peddle the pantload to the river.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

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[Superfly]

33. Ahh...what do I say in response to this

brilliant logical counterattack? How about I just say

"Go peddle that pantload to somebody who cares...over by the river which you should cry"

Leckmichamarsch

[Spoonman]

29. Take me to the river,

Drop me in the hooey,
Take me to the river, dip me in the pantload

COME ON, everybody sign along!

[MrBenchley]

32. You're already soaking in it

as the old Palmolive ad used to say...

[nn2004]

36. What new gun laws are needed?

Can you enumerate some new laws that will help reach your goals?
Post them here.

[slackmaster]

37. MrBenchley is on record as supporting a BAN on handguns

Outrageous but true. You will notice that Benchley is long on rhetoric and short on details. For example, how to get a handgun ban passed when almost 3/4 of the states now either have "shall-issue" laws for concealed handgun permits or have no restrictions on concealed carry (Alaska recently joined Vermont in that status).



And if you press for specifics on how a ban would be actually implemented, you'll probably get one of Benchley's trademark one-line putdowns.

Wannabe gun-grabbers are all mouth and lacking in practical ideas.

[MrBenchley]

38. Gee slack

that was YOU claimed I was in favor of a ban on handgun sales...

But in fact given the irrational and half-hysterical gibberish I see daily from the RKBA crowd, I'm convinced that a ban on further sales would be a damn good idea.

As for being all mouth and no details, I leave that to the RKBA crowd and their half-ass propaganda.

[nn2004]

39. How about presenting your list of new gun laws that are needed

Can you post a copy here?

[slackmaster]

41. Don't think I'll let you weasel out of this one, Benchley

Referring to http://www.banhandgunsnow.org, MrBenchley wrote:

"And for the record, I don't see a damn thing wrong with that proposal."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=5689&mesg_id=6382

Benchley is a typical gun grabber with no plan on how to make it actually happen. All bluster and no details.

[MrBenchley]

45. I'm not weaseling

I said I've been persuaded by the hysteria and lack of reason on the RKBA side of the coin.

[slackmaster]

53. Nobody's buying your monkey shit this time Benchley

It's all there in 1s and 0s for the whole world to see.

[MrBenchley]

60. Surrrrrrre.....

Peddle it to some "enthusiast"

[MrBenchley]

40. Happy to

I see no reason guns shouldn't be registered. I see no reason why gun owners shouldn't be licensed and asked to renew that license regularly. I see no reason ammunition sales should not be limited to licensed gun owners.

I see no reason why anyone should be allowed to buy more than one gun a month. I see no reason why ALL gun sales should not include a waiting period and a thorough background check.

I see no reason why gun manufacturers should not face the same liability other industries face. I see no reason why they should not be treated like any other consumer product and subject to CPSC.

I think that BATF should be beefed up, and that restrictions on when and how often gun dealers can be inspected should be jettisoned. I think that the national database for background checks should be expanded. I think that the national database for gun related injuries and incidents should be established. I think a ballistic signature database is a good idea. I think handgun sales should be limited to "smart" guns, and I could be persuaded to support a ban on ALL handgun sales.

I think the AWB should be extended and made permanent.

[slackmaster]

42. That's 7 "I see no reason"s and not much proposed law

Fortunately Benchley's inability to see reasons not to do things does not constitute a complling argument in favor of doing those things.

"I could be persuaded to support a ban on ALL handgun sales."

What's this? Is Benchley backing away from the extremist position he voiced support for just yesterday?

And for the record, I don't see a damn thing wrong with that proposal. (Referring to http://www.banhandgunsnow.org)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=5689&mesg_id=6382

[MrBenchley]

46. Gee, slack, ask me next if I care

what you think about that.

[Name removed]

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[slackmaster]

76. Your notion of "100% correct" leaves much to be desired

Considering that it's been established that the Ruger recall not only happened, but is still happening.

[Name removed]

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[Superfly]

43. What a pantload! Go peddle that BS someplace else

Just kidding. Was that too hard? Now, do you think you can defend those positions without the "pantload" comments?

Brian

[MrBenchley]

47. Next ask me

whether I feel the burning need to defend them in any way from people trying to pretend Austria never had Nazis, fly.

[Superfly]

48. There you again

I never said that, and you damn well know it.

B

[MrBenchley]

49. Yup...another fact

"Superfly  (1000+ posts) Wed Aug-27-03 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #102
104. Wow!
I didn't know that Austria was the seat of Nazism."

[Spoonman]

51. Can you not

read?

"I didn't know that Austria was the seat of Nazism."

It appears to be nothing close to a "defensive" statement.

The spin master strikes again!!!!!

[MrBenchley]

54. Your spin is getting lamer, spin master

And your attempts to defend the corrupt gun industry and the morally and intellectually bankrupt RKBA movement are getting more desperate.

[Spoonman]

50. You should learn

from others mistakes.

I see no reason guns shouldn't be registered. I see no reason why gun owners shouldn't be licensed and asked to renew that license regularly. I see no reason ammunition sales should not be limited to licensed gun owners.

Here are two good reasons, it doesn't work, and it's a waste of money that could be used elsewhere.

Minister of Public Safety and Security Bob Runciman -

"The federal firearms program is a billion-dollar black hole," said
Runciman. "It's clear from the Auditor General's report that the real costs of the program could end up significantly higher than the current public estimate of $1 billion."
In her recently released report the Auditor General said: "We stopped our audit when an initial review indicated that there were significant
shortcomings in the information provided. We concluded that the information does not fairly present the cost of the program to the government."
"This is an unconscionable waste of taxpayers' money on an initiative
that focuses primarily on law-abiding citizens," Runciman said. "One can only imagine the kind of impact a billion dollars could have had if it had been used for practical measures to fight crime or fund legitimate social needs like education and health care."

Toronto Police Chief Julian Fantino -

"We have an ongoing gun crisis including firearms-related homicides
lately in Toronto, and a law registering firearms has neither deterred these crimes nor helped us solve any of them,"

http://www.cnw.ca/releases/January2003/03/c7191.html

I see no reason why gun manufacturers should not face the same liability other industries face. I see no reason why they should not be treated like any other consumer product and subject to CPSC.

Your wrong, absolutly no manufacturer is responsible for the criminal misuse of their product. They never have been and never will be.

Criminal misuse of a products carries no "product liability". This has been a well established tort law principle.
This priciple applies to ALL manufacturers of all products.

I think a ballistic signature database is a good idea.

If it worked, it would be. A cure for aids is a great idea too.

I think the AWB should be extended and made permanent.

Why, it didn't slow crime down the first time it was passed.

Philip J. Cook, a professor of economics and sociology at Duke University, spoke Thursday to a standing room only crowd about gun control. Cook lectured about different laws regulating gun control, problems with the laws and ways they could be improved.

One of the first things Cook said at the lecture was that the results he found in his study were actually damaging to the gun control movement, a movement that he is for.

The ineffectiveness of the Brady Act was one of the major findings of the study that Cook felt was damaging.

http://trw.umbc.edu/articles/3224?Newspaper_Session=b32bfa49ab650bc02036b0041d227bd7

I'm happy you pointed all this out to us.

[MrBenchley]

55. Peddle it to someone dumb enough to buy it

And ask me if I care what someone trying to pretned there were no Nazis in Austria has to say about what I had to say..

[Spoonman]

57. I would not use the term

dumb or ignorant in your case.
You see dumb and ignorant indicate the lack of knowledge.
STUPID indicates unable to retain or understand the knowledge.

And ask me if I care what someone trying to pretned there were no Nazis in Austria has to say about what I had to say

I have no idea what your refering to.

Which brings me to my next point boys and girls.

Stay away from crack!

[MrBenchley]

61. Nor would anyone use the word "honest" when referring to

the RKBA crowd...

"I have no idea what your refering to."
Hahahahahahahaha! Another good one from "Who's Orrin Hatch?"

[Spoonman]

63. The evils of

crack demostrated again.

[MrBenchley]

66. Yup...it's what explains your posts...

[DonP]

58. Bravo Spoon: Golf clap for points nicely scored

...and all using current information, none of it please note, referenced the evil NRA.

Don

[MrBenchley]

62. Funny, the clap is what sprang to mind

when I read that drivel too...

[Name removed]

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[Name removed]

67. Deleted message

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[Spoonman]

69. Just like the

pantload, river crying, peddling original shit you spew.

[MrBenchley]

74. Cry us a river, spoon.