Does anyone here open carry....and have you been hassled?

[Bowline]

In light of recent news articles regarding open (and concealed) carry of handguns here in Virginia, I was wondering if anyone else here has had occasion to carry a handgun, either openly or concealed, and if there have been any repercussions from the police or the general public?

Gun-Toting in Va. Educates Public, Advocates Say

Gun rights advocates defend open-carry law.

[biftonnorton]

1. I feel hassled enough just going day-to-day

I wouldn't even try it.

[Bowline]

2. Where do you live?

I realize some states actually prohibit open carry.

[SheilaT]

3. I for one would

not hassle someone openly carrying a gun. Good grief! Even in my most rabidly anti-gun moods I'm not a total idiot.

[Bowline]

4. MOST people carrying openly are not criminals.

It's likely anyone you see eating in a restaurant with a holstered handgun is NOT a threat to you. Remember too, all of the people you meet with handgun permits have been fingerprinted, investigated by the FBI, and have NO criminal records. Can you say the same for anyone else you meet?

[TX-RAT]

9. Question?

(Remember too, all of the people you meet with handgun permits have been fingerprinted, investigated by the FBI, and have NO criminal record)

How do you know if the person ,openly carrying a weapon, has a permit?

As a Peace Officer I'm required to display a badge if I'm carrying a weapon openly, while in civilian clothes.

[Bowline]

12. Good point. You don't know.

However, in your experience as an LEO, how many criminals, gangstas, etc., have you arrested who were carrying an openly visible, holstered handgun?

[TX-RAT]

13. None.

Whats that got to do with it?

[Bowline]

14. Just illustrating a point.

It's highly unlikely that the person you see dining at Chili's or walking down the street openly carrying a holstered handgun is a criminal. Not impossible, just unlikely.

[TX-RAT]

15. I'm sorry ,but that's just speculation.

If you have a permit to carry openly, do i have a right to check you for that permit, especially with no more probable cause than seeing you wear it.?

[Bowline]

17. You have no probable cause in that case.

My opinion, of course.

[TX-RAT]

20. Thats the answer i expected.

Kinda makes it easy for criminals to openly carry, doesn't it?

[MrBenchley]

18. Gee, in your experience...

If a police officer saw an idiot with a gun entering a store or restaurant, what would be the response? Would he or she muse, "Why, there goes somebody with a visible gun into that restaurant. I bet that's not going to be a speck of trouble."

[Bowline]

19. That would depend on the behavior of the individual with the gun.

I believe police officers are trained to observe behavior as one determiner of criminal activity. If the individual with the gun was wearing a ski mask and left his car running by the front door, well that might be a clue that he's up to no good.

However, if the person entering the establishment is merely wearing a holstered handgun and is not behaving in a suspicious manner then the police officer should continue his duties and not bother the citizen.

I'm sure you knew this though.

[MrBenchley]

22. Excuse me, but I'm asking a real police officer

and not a trigger-happy "enthusiast."

[TX-RAT]

23. Don't think that would happen.

I do think there are those here, who think thats what should happen.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Mistress Quickly]

5. Yes

No

[Bowline]

6. In which state do you live? eom

[slackmaster]

7. No, but I have been hassled for driving an SUV

:eyes:

[Bowline]

8. Well shame on you,...slayer of the environment!

And don't let me hear anything about you using disposable diapers or styrofoam cups either!!! /sarcasm

[slackmaster]

10. Actually I was hassled by a woman who was driving a Geo Metro

Her beef was that if we had a collision she'd be crushed to death and I'd be OK. I told her it wasn't my problem if she couldn't afford something larger, and she ought to drive carefully so we don't collide. I started to explain the Lug Nut Rule (vehicle with the most lug nuts always has the right of way), but she drove off honking her horn and giving me the one-finger salute.

:evilgrin:

[Bowline]

11. She'll get over it.

I like the Lug Nut Rule though. Gonna have to keep that one in mind.

[library_max]

38. Ah yes, the old "I'm all right Jack, screw you" attitude.

How astonishing to hear it coming from an RKBAer! Not.

[Bowline]

39. The attitude of others is not my problem.

If someone doesn't like something I say or do, screw 'em! I'm not concerned for the feelings of total strangers.

[slackmaster]

40. You might try looking at the incident from my perspective

An obnoxious, ugly, loud person was shouting me down in public. I believe my response was appropriate.

What would you have done in my situation? Sat down with her to talk about her feelings? I suppose I could have just ignored her and pretended that she wasn't there, but some people consider that even ruder than responding in kind.

:shrug:

[library_max]

43. Kind of not what I meant.

I didn't mean that you were being rude in the way you spoke to her. I mean that you expressed the opinion that the danger posed to her and others by the size of your vehicle is her problem, not yours, and should be solved by her - basically, "If you don't want to be crushed, get out of my way."

Or were you just making that up in the heat of the moment, because she was rude?

[slackmaster]

44. In my part of the country we have a concept called "trash talk"

For example, I might tell someone their sister was good in bed just to piss them off, when in fact I have never met their sister.

It's a practice common among professional athletes.

[library_max]

45. Oh. I see.

So in fact it does bother you that the size of your vehicle is a danger to others on the road, but you just didn't want to give her the satisfaction of knowing it?

[slackmaster]

47. Neither

The size of my vehicle is not a danger to others on the road. I drive a medium-sized SUV about same size as a typical pickup truck, not one of those really huge ones.



Tell me something please, max: Why do you always come up with choices that exclude the possibility that I'm actually a good person in spite of our differences over gun control?

[library_max]

51. Okay, okay, fair enough.

Point taken. I apologize. But I hope you can see that the "Lug Nut Rule" is a classic example of I'm-All-Right-Jack-Screw-You.

[slackmaster]

52. The Lug Nut Rule saves lives

Especially when it's your moped against an 18-wheel truck.

It's not a screw-you thing, just a recognition that people in large vehicles sometimes don't see you or cannot maneuver well enough to yield according to the codified rules of the road. The LNR gets implemented by the person in the SMALLER vehicle. It's a self-preservation thing.

[iverglas]

62. actually

The LNR gets implemented by the person in the SMALLER vehicle. It's a self-preservation thing.

It's how the rest of us who share the world with the USofA have long conducted our affairs ...

We don't expect to be noticed by the behemoth. So I could see how somebody who lives within the behemoth in question would think it perfectly reasonable to choose to drive a behemoth that disables him/her from seeing the little folk.

Dog forbid that the party that is likely to cause the most harm take any responsibility and recognize that there are potential victims of its blithe lack of notice, and adjust its own behaviour to reduce the possibility of such harm occurring ...

[slackmaster]

65. Wow, what a cosmic USA- and slackmaster-bashing metaphor

So I could see how somebody who lives within the behemoth in question would think it perfectly reasonable to choose to drive a behemoth that disables him/her from seeing the little folk.

A Geo Metro would not be suitable for the tasks I assign to my modest SUV.

Dog forbid that the party that is likely to cause the most harm take any responsibility and recognize that there are potential victims of its blithe lack of notice, and adjust its own behaviour to reduce the possibility of such harm occurring ...

How dare you accuse me of taking NO responsibility for traffic safety?

:argh:

For your information my driving record has been spotless for over 20 years. Before that I was hit a few times, never my fault. I stand on my long history of safe driving, and I resent your totally baseless accusation.

:spank:

[iverglas]

68. yeah, well

I resent your totally baseless accusation.

If I'd made one, of course that wouldn't just be pointless resentment of the sort that ultimately leads to ulcers, heart attacks ... and probably running over pedestrians wearing the wrong colour shoes.

Tsk, you should be more conservative with your resentment. Or at least be sure never to have a firearm handy ... eh?

Before that I was hit a few times, never my fault. I stand on my long history of safe driving, ...

Reminds me of a story. Many years ago, I went out on a date with someone I didn't know. This was before I drove or had a vehicle myself -- I didn't acquire one until I was, hmm, 33 I think it was. It became a necessity for my law practice as demands on my time increased and the quality of taxi service decreased ... and the number of people wearing personal stereos on buses, and the volume at which they played them, increased to the point that my own resentment was quite likely going to lead to a charge of unjustified (in the eyes of people who didn't have to sit beside them) homicide.

Anyhow, he picked me up and we drove to the market for dinner. That's the trendy old part of town, lots of little one-way streets, too much traffic, no parking. On the way there, I became increasingly apprehensive for my safety. He went through a red light, and I don't remember what all else. I finally couldn't contain myself; I said "you know, I think you are the worst driver I've ever met". (Hey, things weren't looking good for the date anyhow.) And he replied: "I've never had an accident."

And I had a vision of what intersections looked like after he went blithely through them with nary a glance in the rear-view ...



just à propos of nothin'.

:P

[slackmaster]

70. Great photo - reminds me of one of the worst movies ever made

Smash-Up on Interstate 5 - A pseudo-documentary about a real pileup on a Southern California freeway.

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0075236/

My critique: A painfully predictable constellation of hackneyed heart-rending vignettes woven into a single gigantic flashback. A train-wreck of a film that wasted more perfectly good cars than Bullitt, The Blues Brothers, and the first two seasons of TV's The A-Team combined without any of the humor or excitement.

[iverglas]

77. life immitates art

(Okay, how many "m"s in "im(m)itate" in English? I imagine just one.)

http://www.msc.ec.gc.ca/media/top10/1999_e.html

9. Weather-Related Highway Disasters <1999>

On the Friday before Labour Day, dense early-morning fog enveloped sections of Highway #401 near Windsor, contributing to one of the worst road disasters in Canadian history. The horrific accident killed eight people and injured thirty-three others. In all, the chain-reaction pileup destroyed 82 vehicles, many of them fused together in the intense heat. Just moments before the crash, visibility was reduced to about a metre by the sudden occurrence of dense fog just after sunrise.

<as I recall, there were flammable liquids involved there -- yup: 20 to 30,000 litres of diesel fuel; all of the dead victims died inside burning cars>

Later in September, black ice conditions led to a 90-vehicle pileup in Calgary, closing the highway for 20 hours. The previous afternoon, snow melted on the road and then quickly froze as temperatures dropped around dusk.  Some stretches of the road had 2 cm of ice. More than 27 ambulances responded to the crashes.

<snow in September?? Here the Calgarian says to the Ontarian: but it's a dry cold>

I think there was a similar fog-related pileup on I-75 not too long ago.

That highway 401 accident was utterly horrific - and it was out in the middle of nowhere, so people were running to farmhouses, farmers were rushing to the scene in pickup trucks across fields. They all said they just kept hearing more crash noises coming through the fog from the far end of the pile-up.
http://www.windsorfire.com/services/major.php
It made the news on CNN: http://www.cnn.com/WORLD/americas/9909/03/canada.crash/

Heck, the Detroit Freep joined in the chorus of calls for Ontario govt action about that bit of highway:
http://www.freep.com/news/metro/crash12_199912121.htm
I've never understood the problem, other than fog -- that bit of the world is about the most boring in creation: a divided, restricted-access, not traffic-jammed 4-lane highway through flat empty farmland as far as the eye can see. At the time, it seems that highway construction was part of the problem (but I'll put northern Pennsylvania last spring up against anyone's highway-construction horror stories anywhere anytime), and the vile Tory Ontario govt was not doing anything about whatever it was. "Driver error" really does seem to have been the cause of much of the trouble. But when that's true, roads need to be designed to obviate it.

[FatSlob]

72. Great photo.

Is if from a real event? Or is it staged?

[Bowline]

75. The photo is of an actual event.

The result of flooding a few summers back in Spain or Italy. Can't remember which but I think it was Spain. The number plates aren't clear enough to read but the cars look European, lots of Fiats, Seats, and the like.

[iverglas]

78. glad somebody knew

I just did a couple of google image searches for things like pile-up cars, looking for something that matched my mental image of what the scene would have looked like if I'd uncovered my eyes and looked back.

[TX-RAT]

79. I was worried, you and your Samurai caused that.

[FatSlob]

81. <my dad> Darn women drivers </my dad>

O8) O8) O8)

[iverglas]

83. the breadcrumbs

If I'd uncovered my eyes and looked back -- when I was in the passenger seat of the car driven by the worst driver I'd ever met, who was also the worst date I'd ever had. Since I always thought dating was utterly dorky that would make him the worst of about three, but still.

No women drivers in that tale, nope. Me, I'm the *best* driver I've ever met. You can tell that when you see me on the highway, because I'm the one who actually has the requisite number of car-lengths between me and the next car in front of me.

[iverglas]

82. moi!

The Suzuki (please -- Samurais were for sissies and wannabes) could do a touch over 135 km/h (about 85 mph) downhill with a tailwind -- which I needed to do if I was gonna get up the next hill and still be doing 30 mph when I got to the top.

This is how I got through West Virginia, I think it was. When my battery light went on as I was roaring down one of those big hills, it confounded me. I pulled into the next garage-looking place, where the two good ol' boys with beer and dog had never seen such a creature. They did spot eventually the dangling alternator wire, and put it back on. So after that when my battery light came on, I just stopped and reattached the wire.

Until that fateful day in Missouri en route home from Plano, the date and place that the alternator chose to die ... When we finally got across the border, we went to a junk yard and got another one. But not before the idiot customs guy got all snarky about how I had stopped 3 feet before I got to his booth and got out of the car, like I did it on purpose. I mean: we could go push the car the 3 feet to where you are and then get back in and we could have this conversation through the car windo, or we could just have it while I stand here and then we'll push the car back onto our merry way ...

Anyhow. Car maintenance is not one of my fortes or favourite pastimes. And I reap the consequences not infrequently.

But come to think of it, I did almost run over some moronic sports car object once, when I did my shoulder check before changing lanes and didn't see it hiding down beside my wheel.

[TX-RAT]

84. Samurais were for sissies and wannabes

I didn't want to say it but i don't think a Samurai really qualifies as a SUV.

(I did almost run over some moronic sports car object once, when I did my shoulder check before changing lanes and didn't see it hiding down beside my wheel.)
Gal durn SUV drivers.

[iverglas]

85. shurely you're not implying

... that a Suzuki was a wannabe SUV!

Of course, there weren't any SUVs in 1983 -- as we know 'em now. It's just that the name has come to be associated with behemoths, which there really isn't much "sport"y about. Nobody actually drives the damned things for sporting purposes, or generally even for utility purposes.

The Suzuki was in fact just about the first SUV -- it was 4-wheel drive, and it was meant for off-road driving for leisure (rather than heavy work) purposes. No, I really wasn't a wannabe off-road driver -- I just have a long snowy driveway and I really hate shovelling, and hereabouts my city street in winter qualifies as off-road driving.

And the Suzuki was what an SUV oughta be now!

When I took one for a test drive, the sales guy pointed to the handle up above the passenger door, and said "that's for when you're in 4-wheel drive". What, I thought, it becomes airborne, or hops, or something? Turns out that what he was getting at was "that's for when you're going over really bumpy terrain".

I only remember anyone needing one of those handles once. I was driving my next vehicle, that cute '86 Toyota van, in a horrific snowstorm on the airport highway one night, and in the front passenger seat was the Minister of Transportation. We got to where the highway widened to 4 lanes, I went to move into the right lane, and when I shoulder-checked I saw that someone had appeared from nowhere behind me at some insane speed (I *do* look in my rear-view regularly), and was passing me on the right before I'd even had a chance to move over. I swerved back into the left lane, the Minister grabbed for the handle, I looked at him, and I said You're not wearing your seatbelt!!. And he said "zese seatbelts, zey are for boys".

Up here, you see, important persons don't get permits to carry concealed firearms ... they just consider themselves above the seatbelt laws.

Canadian rebels ...

[TX-RAT]

86. Canadian rebels ...

Gotta love I'm.

[iverglas]

60. well yes

And I owned an SUV for several years, too.

It was a pre-Samurai Suzuki. Looked kinda like this, only it had a solid top and was more tin-can looking; I mean, whitewalls?



It would have lost badly in a contest with the moose whose bum I saw moving away from the back highway in Maine on a moonless night as I crossed its crossing. And with just about anything else. When the battery died, as it had a habit of doing when I parked and left the lights on, I jump-started it by pushing with one hand and steering with the other. I actually did that all the way home from Missouri in 1988, since nobody on that side of the border had ever seen such a thing, although I fortunately had somebody else along to do the pushing every 20 minutes or so.

So I would never have expected any driver of a Geo Metro (the original Geo, btw, was just the sissified fancified version of my own tin can) to accost moi and harangue me about being a big bad SUV driver. I musta just assumed that somebody who goes to the trouble of doing that sort of thing actually targets big bad SUV drivers. Perhaps she was just randomly haranguing anybody who crossed her path, for whatever specious reason came into her head ...

[slackmaster]

67. Her behavior didn't seem reasonable to me

I think she was drunk and looking for a fight.

[iverglas]

69. oh, well, fine!

I think she was drunk and looking for a fight.

Now we get the FACTS!

Yes, drunks are good examples of just about everything.

So -- she was drunk, behind the wheel of a monster Geo Metro, and you didn't call the cops??

Of course, if I'd been nearby with one of those cell-phone jammer things, you wouldn't've been able to anyhow ...

[RoeBear]

89. never mind

my bad

[RoeBear]

90. Uhmmm...

...is that big thing for real?

[iverglas]

48. gosh, I like her perspective better

An obnoxious, ugly, loud person was shouting me down
in public. I believe my response was appropriate.

An obnoxious person was driving a extra-dangerous, extra-polluting, extra-wasteful vehicle in her environs, in her airspace, and with the resources that she and her fellow humans can't really spare. I believe her response was appropriate.

Hey, I'm sure you have a really good reason for driving the extra-dangerous, -polluting, -wasteful vehicle. haha.

What would you have done in my situation?

Uh oh. And have we stopped beating our dogs?

I would not ever *be* in your situation. So I, for one, just can't answer that. Mu.

Nobody's perfect. But some of us really are more obnoxious than others.

[slackmaster]

49. There you go making ASSumptions

Hey, I'm sure you have a really good reason for driving the extra-dangerous, -polluting, -wasteful vehicle. haha.

Actually, I do have good reasons.

On edit: This reminds me of the ASSumption you made about my car alarm making noise when it's enabled. Please take a Quaalude or something.

[iverglas]

59. ye gods and little fishies

This reminds me of the ASSumption you made about
my car alarm making noise when it's enabled.
Please take a Quaalude or something.

Well, it took a while:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=118&topic_id=53504

It was a discussion about the efficacy and advisability of some kinda supersonic thingy for unlocking "locked" firearms, and the possibility of a counter-thingy being developed to inhibit said unlocking.

slackmaster:

When there is no ship in sight I can unlock my SUV from 150 feet away reliably. If I'm parked along San Diego Bay the maximum range is reduced down to a matter of inches if I can get it to work at all.

moi: <and look: no adverse comment about the SUV even!>

My ability to unlock my car isn't affected by anything. It opens with a key. (I have just never felt any need to disturb the peace by making my car make whooping noises audible to anyone unfortunate enough to be in the vicinity just so that I don't have to put a key in a lock.)

Now, the phone jammer, that's something I want.

slackmaster:

Are you assuming that everyone who has a remote opening device disturbs the peace by making whooping noises? FYI my SUV makes no sounds other than a "thunk" when the doorlocks are engaged or disengaged.

"Now, the phone jammer, that's something I want."

Word.

moi:

Very good. If it weren't for those pesky firearms, you'd be welcome to move in down the block. Hmm ... which would I rather have ... you with the firearms and the quiet car, or the moron who lives there now who hasn't figured out how to operate any of the noise systems his car is equipped with ...

Meanwhile, can anybody explain to me why cars make whooping noises when people unlock or lock them remotely (let alone why some of them actually honk their horns), and why anyone with those devices would or could not disable the fucking noisemakers? (i.e., are the people in question stupid or evil?)

And here I'd just thought that was a little chat we were having. And what seems to have happened is that *you* assumed I was assuming that all car-door-locking sounds disturbed the peace, it seems to me. I don't seem to have made any statement about *you* 'n yr locking device at all! (Btw, I still haven't yet met one that isn't audible in my living room from the street, so I think we may all just have different definitions of what disturbs the peace.)

And now, back to our muttons ... or mechanical brontosauruses ...

Actually, I do have good reasons.

Aha. Sez you. That might be one of those matters of opinion things too, eh?

[slackmaster]

66. It's not a matter for discussion on this board

slackmaster: Actually, I do have good reasons (for owning an SUV).

iverglas: Aha. Sez you. That might be one of those matters of opinion things too, eh?

I must decline to elaborate because doing so would reveal more personal information than I care to on this board. I've already been threatened by one hostile gun control enthusiast who thought he knew my IRL identity, and I have no desire to expand the set of potential attackers.

[iverglas]

71. ah. well then.

I am equally close-mouthed because even the most basic info would make me identifiable. Which, of course, we all just have my word for, too.

My own personal stalker only knew my real-world geographic location, which she indicated by describing a holiday jaunt that (the part I don't think she knew) brought her within a few blocks of my home sweet home. There was creeping flesh in my living room that night.

The difference was that I *did* discover *her* real-world identity (and to this day have never disclosed it, just threatened to), so that put an end to that!

The evidence of her stalking and threatening has now disappeared from the net, so I can't substantiate my reasons any more than you can.

But then ... I'm not the one claiming to need an suv. ;)

But then ... of course there are people who need large vehicles for work purposes. My friend / former contractor/tenant, the one who had the firearms he was not permitted to keep on premises, drove the forerunner to the Yukon. What were those things called? Most often a sort of sickly tan yellow colour with a white roof. True benemoths, at least in their day. Suburban, that's it -- the name being an indication of who the actual target consumer was. But he was a contractor; he hauled loads of shit around; and it was quite old and being kept out of landfill, and he only had the one vehicle, rather than having another one to impress clients with. And his work at the time involved retro-fitting buildings, from single-family homes to big office buildings, for energy efficiency. So on net, he was more part of the solution than of the problem.

I will now imagine you as self-employed in the business of smuggling human cargo across borders, I think.

[slackmaster]

74. Hehehe - I found my stalker's IRL identity as well

Took advantage of the fact that real property ownership is public information in the USA, downloaded a satellite photo of his home, Photoshopped a scope reticle crosshair pattern on the building, and emailed it to him.

No more hassles.

[iverglas]

80. oh

I limited myself to joking vaguely but pointedly (with the other person in the know) about the evil one's past, and then, when she subsequently showed up on boards where I was (i.e. after the pact had been tacitly struck that she would avoid contact with me, when I made that the condition of my non-disclosure and she just upped sticks and left), asking what seemed to be silly questions that involved puns on her surname ...

That way *I* wasn't actually doing anything naughty.

[FatSlob]

16. I have open carried, and still do...every day.

In Ohio, the Supreme Court determined that open carry of firearms is a fundamental right (Klein v. Leis). However, they also at the same time determined that it was not a fundamental right if you are in a car. A number of months later, the legislature passed, and the Governor signed, a concealed carry bill. This bill stipulated that Sheriffs shall issue Concealed Handgun Licenses to people who meet certain requirements set forth by the legislature. Part of the law (found in ORC 2923) stipulates that a licensee who wants to carry in the car must do it openly. Non licensees are not permitted to carry a loaded firearm in a vehicle.

Because of this, I carry openly in my car every day. I also take occasional walks while open carrying. It is becoming more and more common in Ohio.

I have yet to be hassled by anybody.

[Bowline]

21. As this becomes more common the gloom & doom set will quiet down.

Some people simply can't get over the idea that some of us actually exercise our rights....without their permission. Imagine that!

[FatSlob]

25. Around Ohio, there are not many antis.

Heck, the Million Mom March in Cincinnati has only 6 members (don't know that to be a fact, only second hand information)

[Bowline]

27. The MMM has actually gone away.

They closed their doors and rolled their membership, such as it is, into the Brady Bunch. Apparently their political activities were bringing too much scrutiny upon their tax-exempt status. They were faced with the choice of paying taxes or folding. They folded.

[library_max]

46. How long didja expect them to march, anyway?

The Million Mom March was a single event organized in May of 2000.

[FatSlob]

54. Not quite.

They also were an organization. The organization was "united" with Handgun Control, Inc.

[library_max]

56. You get about a million people to march,

and some of them are going to have some enthusiasm inertia. That's only natural. And now they're with the Brady Campaign. Also natural and logical. So what was the point of your and Bowline's jabs?

[iverglas]

57. what those mums needed

Was a sugar daddy.

Somebody with the bucks to bankroll the efforts. Pay for the buses, buy the lunches, provide the photocopiers, print up the signs, cover the rent on the office space, buy the legislators a few nice lunches.

Somebody with a pecuniary interest in public safety. Somebody who would profit from enhancing public safety. Someone who could retire on what s/he/they earned from effective, public-safety-enhancing firearms control measures being enacted.

I'm thinking. Give me a minute. There's gotta be somebody.

Hmm. Drawing a blank. But if I think of anyone, I'll let you know.

[FatSlob]

61. Too bad that the last time they marched...

That they were 997,000 people short.

[library_max]

73. The Million Mom March was May 14, 2000.

There were dam' near a million of them - exact estimates vary.

[FatSlob]

88. There was another one this year.

It drew approximately 2500 people.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2004/05/10/MNG996IUEM1.DTL

The poor attendance was all over the news. Note that the MMM still has a website and an organization, even though it is now "United" with HCI.

[Bowline]

76. No jabs from me.

I just made the point that they rolled into the Brady Bunch organization due in no small part to the potential of losing their tax exempt status because of their political activities.

[TX-RAT]

26. Question

(also take occasional walks while open carrying)
Is that illegal?
If so, is it an arrest-able offense?
If so, why would you knowingly, break the law and risk arrest.

[Bowline]

28. Open carry is legal in Ohio.

As is concealed carry with the appropriate permit.

[TX-RAT]

29. Open carry in a vehicle, or on the body, or both.

Not familiar with OHIO sorry.

[Bowline]

30. Looks like open carry in vehicles is NOT allowed.

My source. Check to make sure you are reading the Ohio page. All other states info available too.

[TX-RAT]

31. Not to crazy about that link.

Hate tracking cookies.
(The information on this site should be considered "as-is" and is not guaranteed to be accurate in any way.)
Love their disclaimer.

[Bowline]

32. I clean out my cookies every day.

Don't like that stuff hanging around on my computer either. The site, however, does have links to the official state home pages for information concerning gun laws. It's a pretty good resource for research and education concerning gun laws, especially since carry laws vary significantly from state to state.

Are you covered by the recently passed nationwide concealed carry for LEOs law?

[TX-RAT]

34. Don't know

If it applies to Active, retired, or reserve, i guess i am.

Really doesn't matter anyway, because i don't carry as a civilian.

[Bowline]

36. Any particular reason you don't carry as a civilian?

[TX-RAT]

37. Haven't seen the need.

[iverglas]

58. what a funny question

"Any particular reason you don't carry as a civilian?"

The only reason I see offered, from some quarters, for walking around with a firearm strapped on is "because I can", and/or "because I want to".

Wouldn't "because I don't want to" be quite an adequate reason for *not* doing that, and wouldn't that be the bloody obvious reason why most anybody doesn't do most anything??

Really, in the real world, isn't it just more sensible to expect someone who *does* do something to be able to offer some reason for *doing* it, than to expect someone who does *not* do something to have and provide a reason for *not* doing it??

Gosh, if I had to come up with reasons for why I'm not eating a hamburger, or drinking a beer, or scratching my nose, or why I don't have a dog, or a pink lampshade, or a freezer full of fish -- well actually, if anybody asked me to provide a reason for not doing any of those things, I'd probably look at him/her a little strangely.

"Any particular reason you don't carry as a civilian?" That just about takes the cake, that does.

Any particular reason for not doing something that it would never have occurred to an ordinary person of reasonable intelligence, with rudimentary morals, and without any troubles in the head, to do? Nah, none at all ...

[FatSlob]

63. I think that is a great reason.

Some don't exercise rights because they don't want to. That is fantastic. I carry because I want to (amongst other reasons). Isn't choice grand?

[Bowline]

64. Not an odd question at all, considering his background.

I count four police officers as personal friends and I know that all of them make it a point to never leave the house without at least one handgun. I, therefore, thought it unusual that a cop/retired cop would choose to be out and about unarmed. Perhaps where TX lives it's a far safer place than where I live. That's why I asked.

[RoeBear]

93. It strikes me odd..

..what you consider odd.

How odd to ask a former LEO why he doesn't carry now that he is a
'civilian' on a message board about gun rights.

How odd indeed.

[FatSlob]

33. Only if you have a CHL.

If you want to carry, in a car, in Ohio, you must have a Concealed Handgun License, AND carry openly while in the car.

[FatSlob]

35. Of course it is legal

Ohio Supreme Court said it is a "fundamental right" see Klein v. Leis

[TX-RAT]

41. Is it legal outside the vehicle?

RE. restaurants, dept stores etc

[FatSlob]

42. Yes.

Open carry is a "FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT" in Ohio. See Klein v. Leis

In a previous post, just a short while ago, I posted that the decision said it is a fundamental right except in your car. To carry a loaded gun in your car, it must be carried openly AND you must have a concealed handgun license.

Strangely, though, they also determined that it isn't a fundamental right in places where liquor is served for on-premesis consumption.

[iverglas]

50. as usual, the logic escapes me

Because of this, I carry openly in my car
every day. I also take occasional walks while
open carrying.

Because of ... what was that? Because of a law being passed? You do something because a law says you may?

The constitution and the Supreme Court up here say that I may hang around airports and hand out pamphlets:
http://www.lexum.umontreal.ca/csc-scc/en/pub/1991/vol1/texte/1991scr1_0139.txt

Oddly enough, I've never done it ... and it just never occurred to me that "because I can" meant "I have to", or even "I need to", or even "I want to" ...

Well, of course, it doesn't. So I'm still confused.

[FatSlob]

53. I knew the logic would escape you.

It is a right, I do it because I can and I want to. Additionally, sometimes it is inconvenient to conceal.

[Jack_DeLeon]

55. I openly carry a fixed blade knife...

I've never been hassled for carrying it.

Its illegal to open carry handguns in Texas.

[brothermak]

87. Yes

I have carried openly and concealed(legally)in Arizona.

I have come across several people carry openly in the cities of Gilbert & Mesa, AZ. Also on hiking trails and jeep trails in Arizona.

No one seemed put off or intimidated by them, everyone just went about their business.

~BM

[mbnd45]

91. Legal or not,

open carry is just plain stupid, especially in the city. If I was a criminal, I would go after anybody with an openly carried gun, because I could just stick a gun on them and tell them to give me their gun. Do what you want, I'm not telling anybody how to live their life, but I feel more comforatable with a concealed weapon.

[minavasht]

92. Some people

carry 2 guns...