Gun crime poll

[goju]

Poll question: Gun crime poll

What is the "most significant" contributing factor in gun crime rates in the US?

[amber dog democrat]

1. Human nature. ( other )

You don't need me to weigh in - but i will anyway.
Humans have always been violent. Guns are a good way to project force, but other weapons are employed too.

[billbuckhead]

2. I guess Sweden, Ireland, Japan, New Zealand must all be aliens

rather than humans. America has the most promiscuous gun laws of any advanced nation and the murders and mayhem to prove it.

[amber dog democrat]

4. America has always had a violent culture.

Europe gradually became more civilized ( excpeting a lot of wars and state sponsored religious persecutions ) after the middle ages.
But as Stochley Carmichial once said " In America, violence is as American as apple pie" . Once we got through with the genocide of the indigenous peoples, and began to put restrictions on the most egregious examples of rascist lynchings, the pattern and trend continues - on to this day.

Granted with out guns it'd be harder for some, but violence is still an aspect of American social behavior we have yet to move beyond.

[library_max]

21. Australia began as a prison colony. Its culture is plenty violent.

And yet it has strict gun controls and its murder rate per capita is about one-third of ours.

[Lefty48197]

3. I think poverty is a bigger factor than the availability of guns

but the right wingers who fight against reasonable gun controls, are the same ones who fight to keep people locked in poverty.

[goju]

15. What do you consider "reasonable"?

AWB to me isnt reasonable. Trigger locks are reasonable. "Effective" background checks would be reasonable, but they dont seem to work as currently implemented.

Whats your idea of reasonable gun controls?

[Lefty48197]

24. It doesn't make any difference what I say

some gun nut will say that ANY attempt to regulate firearms whatsover makes me a communist, tyrant, anti-constitutionalist.... blah blah blah blah blah.
Sorry, but I don't play that game anymore. There's too many idiots in here. Let me know if you know of a forum where intelligent gun discussion exists. Every single forum I have ever seen has been taken over by the nuts. The same nuts that cause me and many others to label most NRA members, gun nuts.

[MrBenchley]

25. Hell, in another thread today

we had one of our trigger happy chums trying to make a case for owning a nuclear bomb...

[MrBenchley]

18. Good point....

One has only to look at the scumbags in the Second Amendment Caucus to see that is true....

[FeebMaster]

5. The Drug War. (nt)

[LibraLabSoldier]

6. hmmmmmm

I agree with feeb. The war on drugs is having the same effect as prohibition. Though it is probably a waste of time, i will post links about the statistics of gun crimes.

[LibraLabSoldier]

7. HEre is a link from the DOJ

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/guns.htm

Gee, only two percent of gun crimes were committed with a military style semi auto matic weapon....What a big impact that the AWB is having..../sarcasm off/

If you outlaw all guns, do you honestly think gun crime will decrease?

No. It wont. Besides, more violent crimes are committed with fists, feet, clubs, blunt objects, knives......Maybe we should outlaw all of them too......after all, the second amendment doesnt say you have the right to keep and bear hands.....

[medeak]

9. victim of violent crime

but we have lots of guns...got rid of hand guns however...they seem to be used only to kill people...but have elephant rifles that took down 3000lb big horned sheep.

Nothing like having a gun held to your head to sort of make you think about that sort of thing.

[MrSandman]

10. Every long gun...

Contains a short gun.

[LibraLabSoldier]

11. Good point.

Although, cutting most guns down would do nothing more than ruin the weapon.

[MrSandman]

12. True, unless it was the only way...

a nefarious type could get a short gun. I have seen a 24" or shorter 12 gauge.

[LibraLabSoldier]

13. A sawed off shotgun, yes.

A sawed off rifle is next to useless. I had a contender .30-06 and nearly knocked myself unconcious with the damn thing. Besides a sawed off shotgun is for very close range work. If you try to shoot farther than about 10-15 feet with a 24 inch gun, the pattern would disperse so much you would only get one or two pellets into your intended target.

[TX-RAT]

16. I hope your joking

(If you try to shoot farther than about 10-15 feet with a 24 inch gun, the pattern would disperse so much you would only get one or two pellets into your intended target.)
Most of my Shotguns would need a barrel extension to reach 24"
Most of mine have 22" barrels, with a couple at 20 1/2( strictly quail guns )
Have hunted quail with a 18 1/2" Model 37 Ithaca, those shoots would regularly be 25 to 30 yrds.

[goju]

17. I found that odd too, but I think its overall length

Or am I wrong here?

[TX-RAT]

19. I believe your right.

I was thinking barrels. My mistake.

[goju]

20. Coach gun

My wife bought me a Stoeger double barrel last Christmas with 18 in. barrels. I wondered how it would do for grouse. Youre getting good shots out to 30 yards with 20" barrels? Possible duck gun then?

[LibraLabSoldier]

26. 24 inches

Refers to entire weapon length.

[library_max]

22. Before the ban, it was more than eight percent.

Re: the big impact that the AWB is having.

More violent crimes, maybe. More lethal crimes? Where are your figures?

[MrSandman]

29. And look at the gun show loophole...

According to the 1997 Survey of State Prison Inmates, among those possessing a gun, the source of the gun was from -

a flea market or gun show for fewer than 2%
a retail store or pawnshop for about 12%
family, friends, a street buy, or an illegal source for 80%

[LibraLabSoldier]

30. But we have to shut down gunshows....

That would be two percent less crime!!

[Zing Zing Zingbah]

8. Poverty and lack of education

[goju]

14. Poverty...

I agree, in fact I wish I had included that in the poll. Good point.

[gatlingforme]

23. Good Points! Poverty and lack of education go hand in hand with

gangs and drugs, put those 4 factors together and you have a great scenario for crime.

[LibraLabSoldier]

27. It is far harder

to deal with the social causes of crime than to go after so called crime facilitators. If we take all the guns off the streets, A)the criminals will have to spend more to get guns, and B) they will find alternative deadly force weapons.

[MrBenchley]

28. Too too funny....

"It is far harder...to deal with the social causes of crime than to go after so called crime facilitators."
And yet the people trying to deal with the social causes of crime are those people like Carolyn McCarthy, Chuck Schumer, Dianne Feinstein, etc. that our trigger-happy chums are always raging and spitting at.

But then it's easier to pimp for the gun lobby and repeat their right wing horseshit than to think for yourself.

[LibraLabSoldier]

31. Are they just waiting for the right time

To fix these social evils? And "pimping for the NRA" is not what I am doing. Most of how I feel about guns comes from the fact that I have spent my entire life hunting, and shooting. It is part of my family traditions. It is kind of stupid to blame guns for the problems of society. After all, they are only metal, and plastic, and wood. It takes a person to use them. Personally, I am in favor of stiffer penalties for gun crimes. But did you ask that? No.

[Barry123]

32. Inanimate objects

You know that is the second time you have used that analogy of inanimate object and guns. I have heard this same tripe espoused for years and still we have thousands killed with these inanimate objects every year.
Guns are made for specific purposes.To kill. The inane comparison to an SUV or swimming pool does not give credibility to your argument. It in fact diminishes it. Accept the fact that SUV's (cars) are transportation devices, swimming pools are for guess what? When you deal with the subject of guns use intelligence and address the actual subject.
Recently, on a radio talk show in Chicago a gun advocate used that very same tactic and a caller (doctor) put him in his place. He asked about the comparisons that could be drawn from a gunshot wound to the face and how the person that did it could use the inanimate object as a defence and a injury from a car accident. Would a judge rule differently in either case? Since they are both inanimate and you use them as examples. Is there a distinction? There is and you know what it is.

[LibraLabSoldier]

33. Welcome to DU, now listen up.....

The distinction is that a car can no more kill someone than a gun can. It takes a person behind the wheel, and a person to pull the trigger. If someone wants to kill a person, does it matter what he chooses?

Here is how I feel about guns.

I will not give mine up. I have used them responsibly for years. I dont see myself suddenly losing my mind and killing someone just because I have a gun.

It kills me that people want to point to guns as one of the evils of society. There are many things that kill people everyday. If you dont want guns, fine. Dont own any. If you are afraid someone will use a gun to harm you, vote for stronger penalties for gun use. If that doesnt help, buy a bullet proof vest, and hide in your home.

Violence is a problem in America with many, many root causes. Poverty, alcoholism, drug abuse, gang violence, unemployment, ect....Guns are used in many violent crimes. So are knives, clubs, fists and feet.

Deal with the disease, not the symptom.

[iverglas]

34. tsk tsk, now calm down

The distinction is that a car can no more kill
someone than a gun can. It takes a person behind
the wheel, and a person to pull the trigger.

Odd, to call a similarity a "distinction". Perhaps some sober second thought is needed from time to time.


If someone wants to kill a person, does it matter
what he chooses?

If someone wants to succeed in killing a person, it might matter a great deal what s/he chooses, doncha think?

Isn't it just odd how very few people actually choose a car for the task ...

Not to mention how few people choose a car when their goal is to rob someone ...


If you are afraid someone will use a gun to
harm you, vote for stronger penalties for gun use.

Damn right. At least that way you can be sure that AFTER YOU DIE somebody might be locked up for a while. And then people can say "s/he did not die in vain", and everything will be okay.


Deal with the disease, not the symptom.

The symptom of many diseases is fever. I think there are a whole lot of doctors in the world who need to hear your advice. An awful lot of them seem to be wasting their time trying to reduce fevers ... so they have an opportunity to treat the disease that's causing it BEFORE THE PATIENT DIES OF THE SYMPTOMS. It's obviously high time they stopped dealing with the symptoms, and you need to start getting that word out right away.