.50 Assault Weapons TERMINATED in California

[CarinKaryn]

For all his other faults, Ah-nold just signed the .50 cal ban in California. I guess his marrying into the family he did had a positive effect on him.

I believe the language of the bill uses the definition that defines the BMG round only. It would have been a much stronger bill with my "Bunker Buster Ban" definition, but it is a start!

No link or offical word yet, will post details when I have them.

:toast:

[skippythwndrdog]

1. I do hope your information is incorrect.

This is another erosion of freedom that we don't need.

[-..__...]

9. Nope, it's correct.

Take note of the typical VPC fear mongering and scare tactics.


http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040914/dctu038_1.html

"California Leads Nation in War on Terror - Becomes First State in Nation to Ban 50 Caliber Anti-Armor Sniper Rifles
Tuesday September 14, 11:48 am ET
Law Comes Less Than Three Years After Violence Policy Center First Identified Threat Posed by These Readily Available Tools of Terror
Governor Schwarzenegger Signs Bill That Bans Rifles That Can Destroy Aircraft, Down Helicopters, and Penetrate Armor Plating

WASHINGTON, Sept. 14 /PRNewswire/ -- California yesterday became the first state in the nation to ban 50 caliber sniper rifles. The bill, AB 50, was signed into law by Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger. The threat posed by 50 caliber sniper rifles, and their purchase in the U.S. by terrorists, was first identified by the Violence Policy Center (VPC) in its 2001 report Voting From the Rooftops: How the Gun Industry Armed Osama bin Laden, Other Foreign and Domestic Terrorists, and Common Criminals With 50 Caliber Sniper Rifles. Subsequent VPC studies have exposed the ability of these armor-piecing rifles -- which are accurate over a mile -- to attack bulk fuel tanks and other high- value targets from a distance, as well as their ability to destroy commercial aircraft. The VPC has also detailed their criminal use in the United States.

[skippythwndrdog]

10. Another sad day in California. n/t

[UpsideDownFlag]

23. i'd be happy enough with the AWB sunset if i was you.

banning .50 cals isn't going to cause the world to end.

[skippythwndrdog]

34. Good thing you aren't me.

You'd likely take something from my collection and shoot yourself for supporting restrictions of freedoms.

[amber dog democrat]

2. This is a cosmetic decision

That serves no purpoise beyond a illusion of acting responsibly.
I believe the .50 is already governed by FFL restrictions. How many people do own one?

[CarinKaryn]

3. Cosmetic

The .50 is an incredibly powerful round that is unsuited for hunting, though it will punch through 2 inches of hard steel.

This bill places reasonable limits on a powerful weapon of war.

[amber dog democrat]

5. Yeah but how many people will have one.

The only one I saw required an FFL, and was priced over 1000.00

I know where I can fire full military machine guns if I want to. I don't see this as a practical law. In fact I would not mind firing one, As far as being a weapon of war,
there are more practical weapons one can fabricate or acquire.

I just don't this this law acomplishes anything. Its such an uncomon and exotic gun.

[skippythwndrdog]

7. Take a deep breath.

The .50 is an incredibly powerful round that is unsuited for hunting, though it will punch through 2 inches of hard steel.

I wouldn't spout that too long and lous about the 2" of steel unless you want to be spouting inaccuracies. I've tried it with a BMG .50 and it didn't work on 10 out of 10 rounds.

All that aside, it is perfectly suitable for hunting in the western states where shots of 1,000 yards or more present themselves. Let's also remember long range, 1,000 yard or more, target competitions.

[slackmaster]

11. It's TWOOO! It's TWOOO!

http://www.geocities.com/robert_frenchu/guns_50cal.html

[-..__...]

13. It's a disgrace that we're arming terraists with these things!

[TX-RAT]

15. Hold your hormones there, Madeline.

[TX-RAT]

12. Come on Skippy

Anybody taking 1000yd shots at game animals is being totally irresponsible. Just because the weapons capable of killing game at that distance doesn't mean a persons capable of hitting at that distance.

[skippythwndrdog]

14. I have done so on a couple of occasions.

Got my mulie both times. I did it because I'm capable of making that shot. Probably some good genes aided by lots of practice.

Weatherby Mk V .300 WBY magnum. Redfield 4X12X50mm. Weatherby factory 150 gr partition.

[TX-RAT]

16. So whats the ft-lbs of a 150 grain at about 1500 to 1600fps?

Not enough, and thats about what you'd have at 1000yds. Don't get me wrong I'm a big fan of the 300, I've shot it for many years. I think it's one of the best canyon rifles I've ever used. But those ballistics at 1000 yds are pretty weak.

[skippythwndrdog]

18. As I recall without looking it up

You're actually down to about 1,200-1,400 ft and in the 400-500 ft. lb. range.

That's plenty for a vitals shot.

I know. It's something we can argue all day. That's part of the fun of being a shooter: the best gun, best load arguments.

Food for thought: when the 30.30 first came out in (I believe) 1893 it became the overnight darling of African big game hunters for everything up to and including elephant, rhino, and hippo. It wouldn't be my choice today.

[TX-RAT]

25. It's something we can argue all day.

That I'm sure of. I definitely disagree on the 400-500ft-lb. Those are 40cal pistol ballistics, hardly anything i would recommend for 900lb elk or 300+ mule deer. I've read a lot of books on African rifles and hunters, Bell, Capstick, Ruark,and others, never heard mention of a 30-30. Africa now requires a 375 min on large or dangerous game i believe.

[skippythwndrdog]

32. I think so on the .375+

As I recall, I read about the 30-30 and big game in either a Winchester history or something similar. It was probably some bathroom reading.

[Zynx]

39. I can't imagine using a .30-30 for African game.

But when it first came out, it was competing with a bunch of much less effective black powder based cartridges, and thus, would be respectable by comparison. Remember, this is also when the Nitro's first came along.

Nowadays, you must carry BY LAW a .375 or bigger for Big Five animals. The professional hunters (guides) got sick of idiots using deer rifles on big things that can kill you. This is somewhat annoying, because I want to go hunt in Africa within the next few years, and the largest thing I have is a .338 WinMag that uses uploaded Federal "High Energy" or Hornady "Heavy Magnum" rounds. Give it as much punch as a .375, but bullet is still too small.

[TX-RAT]

40. I don't think that rule applies to plains game.

[Zynx]

41. No, it doesn't.

And the .30-30 would still work as a brush gun for little plains game. But I want to shoot a Cape, and thus the .375+ rule irritates me.

[TX-RAT]

46. Not sure I'd want to bust a 2000+lb buff with anything less.

Recoil from the 375 is not that bad. Plus you can't guarantee a buffs all your going to have to deal with. Most carry soft points for plains, and solids for dangerous game.

[Trashman]

31. How do you know

that the .50 is unsuitable for hunting? Are you talking about all .50 cal. rifles?

[skippythwndrdog]

4. No Federal restrictions that I am aware of. n/t

[slackmaster]

6. I hope you know how to recognize when you are being pandered

Arnold is an expert. He knows that for best results you have to kiss your victim before ramming his gigantic throbbing unlubricated Johnson into the orifice of his choice. Gun control supporters, you have been warned. Arnold is a Republican and he'll do whatever he thinks will get him re-elected in a couple of years.

Now that he's locked up the "soccer mom" vote and neutralized all of the pending civil harassment claims various women have against him, what Democrat could possibly unseat him? I think Diane Feinstein might be able to beat him but she really likes being a Senator.

Meanwhile the people who really want a .50 BMG rifle and can afford one have until the end of the year to buy one. Better get your orders in quickly folks.

[skippythwndrdog]

8. One more question

When did a single shot, up to 5 shot, bolt action anything become an assault weapon? That's news to me.

[FatSlob]

17. .499 BMG...ON the way.

Easy way to get around the intellectually retarded California Ban. What is wrong with that state? The California Republic is just going majorly downhill.

[slackmaster]

19. It's a certainty

Other large rounds like the .408 Chey Tac, .460 Weatherby, assorted traditional African hunting calibers etc. will see an unprecedented surge in popularity in California as people try to anticipate what caliber will be attacked next on this slippery slope.

[FeebMaster]

20. There's a shocker.

Looks like the pro-gun Republicans strike again.

[Romulus]

21. .308 "sniper rifles" are next

no legitimate honest shooter needs less than 1 MOA accuracy

[Jack_DeLeon]

22. CarinKaryn is pimping for the repugs.

Yeah WTG CarinKaryn, good to see where you really stand on the issues, I'm sure the republicans who love to take away our freedoms love having you on thier side.

[UpsideDownFlag]

24. hmm, interesting that you think

supporting gun control is pimping for the repubs. see, i think of pimping for repubs as dismissing the NRA's influence, bashing Moveon, dissing Feinstein or Kerry, etc.

[FatSlob]

26. Both parties are lousy with Authoritarians.

In my state, the two assclowns running for Senate are both Authoritarians. State Senator Eric Fingerhut is challenging Senator Voinovich. Both are Authoritarian, and neither is getting my vote. Arnold (R)is just as bad as Diane Feinstein (D) is just as bad as Mike DeWine (R) is just as bad as Charles Schumer (D) is just as bad as Voinovich (R). I dislike all authoritarians.

[Romulus]

27. but they're looking out for you

shame -the shame

How dare you question those who only have your best interests at heart? Don't you know they're protecting you from yourself?

</sarcasm>

[FatSlob]

28. I don't think they are being malicious.

I think they are truly misguided.

[Romulus]

29. no malice - just obtrusive (n/t)

[DoNotRefill]

30. Proof that republicans are gun-grabbers too...

eom

[7th_Sephiroth]

33. now from the makers of the .50 bmg rifle

the .499 fuckuarnold

[skippythwndrdog]

35. I like it! I love it! I want some more of it!

[7th_Sephiroth]

36. if they REALLY named one that, i'd buy it

that would rule

[JeremyN]

37. I feel safer already...

It's a good thing CA has banned a gun that has been used 18 times in the entire history of this nation to commit a crime, none of these terrorist acts.

We all know that terrorists can't wait to get their hands on a 30 pound rifle that costs over $6000 to get, and is 4 feet long, which costs around $5 per round of ammuntion. Don't forget that it's very loud and hurts to shoot too. This is much more preferable to those $200 full-auto AK-47's they get in pakistan, the ammo for which is among the cheapest centerfire cartridges you can buy.

And the threat of shooting jumbo jets down? How could we have overlooked something for so long that would be nearly impossible for a well-trained marksman to do, much less a poorly-trained terrorist? Here we are worried about all these horrible things we know terrorists can and will do, when we've got this far-fetched theory about something a terrorist has never done before to worry about.

It's a shame many law-abiding, good Californians will no longer be able to enjoy their hobby of .50 cal marksmanship, but at least we stopped those terrorists from doing something they'd probably never do anyway. I feel safer already...

[MrBenchley]

38. Here's a link....

Funny how the same trigger happy folks leaping around and cheering in another thread about that Republican fuckwit Souder's bill being proposed are so downcast about the Democrats getting this bill through, isn't it?

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=politicsNews&storyID=6234749

[Romulus]

42. still waiting for .308 or .300 to be banned

After all, they can "reach out and touch" up to 1000m away (maybe more if you're good. . .)

[MrBenchley]

43. Feel free to propose it, rom....

the more I hear from pro-gun people, the less I think they ought to be trusted with any sort of weapon.....

[CarinKaryn]

44. The way the bill SHOULD have been written:

Bunker Buster Ban
Part I
This bill bans the manufacture, transfer or possession of any assembled cartridge (cartridge being defined as a bullet, casing, powder & primer combination), that when fired from an 18” barrel, produces total energy (as measured from the muzzle) in excess of 5000 ft-lbs. This measurement takes place at sea level with an ambient temperature of 85 degrees.

Part II
Any weapon capable of firing banned "Bunker Buster" ammunition (ammo falling under the definition above), is also banned.


This definition comes from my earlier thread. I repost now in response to all those proposing the development of the .49 or .499 or .4999 assault rifle cartridge as a way of evading the ban.

[slackmaster]

45. Unfortunately for the ban enthusiasts you don't write their bills

While I believe your efforts would address a non-problem, I welcome your fresh approach. Your model, given enough technical details and caveats, would establish a physical limit to ballistic power.

The .50 BMG ban is destined to fail to achieve its underlying, IMO misguided, purpose.

[JeremyN]

56. This whole law

This whole law is a solution in search of a problem. We seem to get a lot of those laws these days...

[MrBenchley]

47. Telling, isn't it?

"all those proposing the development of the .49 or .499 or .4999 assault rifle cartridge"
Actually obeying the law, of course, is never an option for the trigger happy.

[FeebMaster]

48. Actually, developing a .499 cartridge

would be obeying the law. Just like driving 54mph in a 55mph zone is obeying the law.

[MrBenchley]

49. Actually, feeb....

It's just the sort of scummy thing the gun industry would do....

[FeebMaster]

50. Yes.

Obeying laws is a very scummy thing to do.

[MrBenchley]

51. No, evading laws and being a public menace is scummy....

but what about the gun industry and the RKBA cause isn't scummy?

[FeebMaster]

52. Obeying a law is evading that law?

What would breaking the law be?

[MrBenchley]

53. Evading the law is evading the law....

just like pimping for a corrupt industry is disgraceful.

[FeebMaster]

54. But what about breaking the law?

just like pimping for a corrupt industry is disgraceful.

How about pimping for Republicans and Republican passed laws?

[MrBenchley]

55. Don't worry. I'm sure gun looonies will do that too....

I leave pimping for Republicans to our "pro gun democrats," feeb. That's all they ever do.

Don't tell me you're going to try to pretend that this measure that was proposed and passed by Democrats isn't a Democratic measure again.

[FeebMaster]

57. But is breaking the law just breaking the law

or is it something else as well? Is breaking the law scummier than obeying/evading the law?



I leave pimping for Republicans to our "pro gun democrats," feeb. That's all they ever do.

Yup. Remember back when they were pimping for John McCain as Kerry's VP? Or when they were arguing that John Ashcroft didn't have nearly enough power? Ooops. Nevermind.


Don't tell me you're going to try to pretend that this measure that was proposed and passed by Democrats isn't a Democratic measure again.

I'm not denying some Democrats had a hand in its passage, but a Republican signed it. As far as I'm concerned it's just more Republican gun control.

[MrBenchley]

58. Biullshit is bullshit, feeb....

And if ignorant bullshit was bucks, our "pro gun democrats" would each be richer than Ken Lay

"I'm not denying some Democrats had a hand in its passage"
Gee, feeb, who proposed it? Who voted it through?

"As far as I'm concerned it's just more Republican gun control."
For all your opinion is worth (snicker).

[MrBenchley]

59. Bullshit is bullshit, feeb....

And if ignorant bullshit was bucks, our "pro gun democrats" would each be richer than Ken Lay

"I'm not denying some Democrats had a hand in its passage"
Gee, feeb, who proposed it? Who voted it through?

"As far as I'm concerned it's just more Republican gun control."
For all your opinion is worth (snicker).

[FeebMaster]

60. I thought we were discussing the subtleties of obeying the law.

What does bulshit have to do with it?


Gee, feeb, who proposed it? Who voted it through?

Who signed it?


For all your opinion is worth (snicker).

Like anything, the value of my opinion is subjective to whoever is receiving it.

[MrBenchley]

61. I thought it was typical feeb warbling

unconnected to reality and only fitfully amusing....

[FeebMaster]

62. I'm disappointed.

I thought my posts were more than merely fitfully amusing.

[MrBenchley]

63. You'll get over it.

[FeebMaster]

64. I hope so.

It's been a crushing blow to my self-esteem.

[skippythwndrdog]

65. There, there, Feeb.

Don't let the little misinformed, wrongheaded miscreants of the world get you down. They'll all dry up and blow away eventually. All that hatred is hard on their tiny little malformed minds.

The control crowdwill brn out eventually. We can only pray that if they choose to breed, someone will teach their children the values of those rights given us by our predecessors and the need to defend those rights.

[MrBenchley]

66. "misinformed, wrongheaded miscreants" pretty much sums up the RKBA bunch

The entire cause is dishonest, the politicians and pundits pushing it are the right wing scum of the earth, and the entire movement boils down to making excuses for a corrupt industry that's a public menace.

"someone will teach their children the values of those rights given us by our predecessors and the need to defend those rights."
Not to mention the difference between those actual rights and imaginary ones lied about by extremist and racist crackpots like John AshKKKroft.

[Fescue4u]

70. Yep.. Thats why you get a ticket

for stoping at a red light.

After all, by stopping at a red light, you are evading the law against running it.

[FeebMaster]

71. All drivers are racist, you know

and the corrupt auto industry is more than happy to pander to those racist humholes.

[skippythwndrdog]

67. You've convinced me.

I placed an order today for this:


It's almost $5,000.00 with the extras I got, but I think it's worth it. The value won't drop and it'll be a helluva lot of fun to shoot.

edited to add: For the uninformed, it's a Barrett M95. Yup. .50 cal.

edited again: Good thing the kid's tuition is already paid.

[alwynsw]

68. I did it. I freely admit it.

Logged in on the kiddo's account. Credit the above post to me.

[Fescue4u]

69. .50 sales will go through the roof

This one piece of legislation will do more to sell .50's than anything a marketing department could do. (or as a degenerate freedom hater would say, the scummy gun industry)

While the gun makers are busy selling .50's as fast as they can make them....the engineering departments are busy designing .499's for sale in California where demand will be very high..

But hey...if it puts a stop to non-existant crimes, then its all worthwhile!

[TrasMaster9]

72. .50 cal selling like hotcakes

http://www.serbu.com/">Serbu
(edited to add web address)


Their website says that their .50 sales are going through the roof. I guess the terrorists are stocking up now that they have heard how powerful those rifles are.

[anonymous44]

73. since when

was .50 rifle considered an assault weapon?

lol you should actually do some research before calling something which it's not

Just proves that anti's don't know squat about guns.