Arafat’s path: Destroy Israel through ‘peace’

[drdon326]

A respected Arab newspaper editor and Yasser Arafat-confidante said at the weekend the deceased PLO chief had signed the so-called “Oslo Accords” in order to drive the Jews from the Middle East.

Abdel Bari Atwan, editor of the London-based daily al-Quds al-Arabi , recalled an important meeting he had with Arafat at the PLO’s Tunis headquarters in 1994, just days before it was allowed triumphantly enter the Gaza Strip.

"The man told me, 'Listen, Abdel Bari, I know that you are opposed to the Oslo Accords, but you must always remember what I'm going to tell you. The day will come when you will see thousands of Jews fleeing Palestine. I will not live to see this, but you will definitely see it in your lifetime. The Oslo Accords will help bring this about.'"

Atwan also revealed that it was Arafat who had personally established his Fatah party’s Al Aqsa Brigades “military” wing – a group featured prominently on the US State Department’s list of known terror groups.
"President Arafat was the one who established the Aksa Martyrs Brigades in response to the attempt to marginalize him after the failure of the Camp David summit," he said.

Atwan said Arafat rejected the unprecedented offers made by Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak at Camp David “because he wasn't prepared to sign a final agreement with the Jewish state.”

http://www.jnewswire.com/library/article.php?articleid=363

...................................................................

WOW...Whadda shock!!!! Ara-dead saw Oslo not as a peace plan but a way to destroy Israel. *yawn*

[TaleWgnDg]

1. Hey, you forgot one thingie . . . Arafat bilked the many out of

money in exchange for both Jewish and Palestinian peoples' miseries. The man was unconscionable!

Will the world ever see his squirreled monies? I doubt it. The world is a safer place without Arafat's leaderless attempts at panderings to different factions while bilking all of safety and monies and dignity.




.

[drdon326]

2. HEY !! Ara-dead was legally....ahem,cough,cough.....elected.

"Will the world ever see his squirreled monies? "

The grieving widow Suha probably has most of the 5 BILLION.

[TaleWgnDg]

3. Indeed . . . ain't she lovely? n/t

[Violet_Crumble]

4. Since when did this 4 billion turn into 5 billion?

I just can't keep up with these inflating billions! Is any of this based on fact, or just chinese whispers?

Violet...

[drdon326]

6. TaleWgnDg..."Arafat may have billions hidden away "

"In his four decades as Palestinian leader, Yasser Arafat has run a murky financial empire that includes far-flung Palestine Liberation Organisation (PLO) investments in airlines, banana plantations and high-tech companies, and money hidden in accounts across the globe.

Jaweed al-Ghussein, a former PLO finance minister, said it was worth US$3 billion (HK$23.4 billion)to US$5 billion when he quit in 1996. No one will say how much it's worth now - some estimates say as little as a few million. But as 75-year-old Arafat fights for life in a hospital near Paris, Palestinians fear that what's left will disappear or be pocketed by Arafat cronies.

``It's the money of the Palestinian people,'' said Palestinian legislator Hassan Khreishe, adding he would urge a parliamentary investigation."

http://www.thestandard.com.hk/stdn/std/Focus/FK10Dh02.html

...................................................................

BTW.....lovely picture of THE FIRST LADY of the palestinian people.

[Violet_Crumble]

7. Donny, you might like to check yr sources...

Quoting someone accused of embezzling millions really doesn't add any credibility to anything at all...

Violet...

[ashiebr]

10. "some estimates say as little as a few million." N/T

[drdon326]

15. You know.....

Opinions are like "KISS" records....everyone has one and none

are really good.

[Forkboy]

16. You're correct

and that would presumably include yours as well.

[Ardee]

19. Citing liars to prove truths

seldom works. Arafat was a millionaire prior to forming Fatah, I believe...civil engineering contracts to build roads in Kuwait.The article itself calls those "billions" PLO monies, and, as head of the PLO Arafat decided where that money went. Neither I nor the always fair Drdon :+ knows squat about the financial workings of that group. The difference is that I don't jump to the first conclusion that makes Arafat look bad.

Don, you are so consumed with hatred that it clouds any judgments you might make, makes you ignore the unconscionable actions of the Israelis who have murdered countless thousands of innocents with bombs, rockets, missiles, weapons of every description. Long,long ago Israel should have reached an accord with Palestinian leaders, but each and every time they made demands that could not be met, they have stolen land, stolen a peoples birthright, just like they did starting in '48 when they bullied Arabs off choice farmlands and out of their homes.

Israel is a state with a legal and recognized government, Palestine is a collection of refugee camps and small farms with no real central government and no ability to control the various militant factions there.It is all in the hands of the Israelis who, by dealing with justice, reason and sanity could defang the militants and bring peace to that region, but will they?

[Nicky Scarfo]

29. Ara-dead! Man is that witty! I can't stop laughing. Did you come up with

that just now? You're a regular Richard Pryor.

[UL_Approved]

5. Arafat used tactics pioneered by the Zionists

Don't forget that the Jewish Zionists used terrorist tactics to drive the British government out of that area after WWII. This wasn't even to protect land that they were living on. It was a land grab. For all they have done, at least the Palestinians are defending land that they have lived on for thousands of years.

[Lexingtonian]

8. Ooooooh, now _there's_ proof of the Sheer Evil Of That Man

Funny, though, how we don't hear sources of the kind telling us about the same kinds of things being said by Abba Eban, Menachem Begin, Teddie Kollek, or the rest. I hear their private sayings are also quite fabulous and intriguing.

Btw, Ehud Barak famously _didn't_ make a decent offer at Camp David; he made sure to insist on terms that his side knew Arafat couldn't accept anyway. That Arafat would only have taken the very best terms available is also clear, but that doesn't absolve Barak from the fair charge of being a dirty dealer- no matter what his supposed reputation in the U.S.

But most amusing of all is the intent of the article to bamboozle American readers by presenting them with (to the average goy American) lurid horror, because anyone who has studied the history of the Semitic world and its particular patterns knows about its conventions in conflict situations: hyperbolic speech being normal, great "secrets" and massive designs on things being mongered ad nauseum, and-most importantly- psychological destruction of the opposition (the creation of inalterable fear or demoralization in them) constituting an aim/accomplishment of greater or equal importance than achieving their material destruction.

Both peoples have figured out eachothers psychologically vulnerable point. Jewish Israelis have figured out that the Palestinians are still a society of agrarian traditionalisms, so deprivation/theft of land is how that attack goes. Palestinians have learned that Jewish existential fear and internal hyperbole constitute a remarkable psychological vulnerability. And so they damage each other, each out to inflict to inflict maximal pain.

[Forkboy]

9. Damn that dangerous peace!

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Djinn]

12. this'll be interesting

my guess the "state" would amount to nothing more than Bantustans and Israel would continue to have air/sea control, although it may be framed a little more disengenously.

I can guarantee the right of return will not be on don's agenda - and apart from "it'd destroy Israel" I have never got a logical answer from people who oppose the right of return to explain why someone forced out of Haifa 50 years ago can NOT go home but memebers of my family could take out Israeli citizenship (although there is technically no such thing) tommorrow and live there despite never having lived anywhere near the area?

[drdon326]

13. First........keep talking about that woman......and talk slow.

But I digress myself.....

First there can be absolutely no meaningful negotiation while hamas et al are allowed to commit endless atrocities.

Once there,the previous offer Barak laid out ,which by most observers who were there offered >90-95 % with E.Jerusalem as its capital, is a good place to start. Apparently from all reports if that offer was given today, the palestinians leadership now would jump thru hoops at that offer again.

And if the litany of terror were destroyed AS PROMISED BY THE PA BUT SURPRISINGLY NEVER EVEN ATTEMPTED, I suspect Israel would be a whole lot more malleable.

Reparations?....dont know....start with SUHA....I hear she just came into some money. Then go to saudi,iran and syria that paid these terrorists endless amounts of money for the sole reason of keeping the palestinians the hell out of their countries . Looks like they they remember that little something called "BLACK SEPTEMBER".

Right of return??.....that didn't,hasn't and won't happen and i think the PA pretty much should understand that by now.

As for "a problem you would like to see go away", the only times I have heard talk like that that was in the hamas covenant, on PA radio and media that calls Jews "pigs and monkeys", in the hate-filled ISM mental masturbations and of course the now deceased godfather of terrorism exhorting 5 and 6 year olds to become "shaheeds" and "martyrs" simply by KILLING JEWS and destroying Israel.

But darn, I digress too....so about this woman.......

[drdon326]

14. Israel cultivates Nobel laureates, Arabs cultivate suicide bombers

By Farid Ghadry

http://web.israelinsider.com/Views/4254.htm


The Oslo Accords produced a willing Israel and exposed fraudulent Palestinians. Again, we watched as Arab leaders mounted a campaign of deceit to divert our attention away from our own oppression. We, the obedient Arab sheep, followed. We carried banners, objected, revolted and in the end, we created a new cadre of school children with strong arms to throw stones but without the education and discipline no brains to produce Nobel prizes.

Ever since the Intifada, a term that truly spurns our sense of justice, we have achieved the lowest point of our self-esteem. Arab children that throw stones seem to feel an invisible power that is not available to the children of the State of Israel.

That power to revolt consequently pre-disposes to a low self-esteem, which inevitably helps to build the mentality of a suicide bomber.

Suicide bombers feel nothing, understand little, and cannot see the future.

They go on automatic pilot with the brain functioning as a guiding tool to self-destruct literally, as a person and against the society that developed them. Suicide bombers represent the lowest of our self-esteem as people of Arab descent.
................................................................

Someone who understands.

the truth will set you free.

[ashiebr]

17. "Farid Ghadry is President of the Reform Party of Syria...................

................a US-based opposition party".

Says it all really. About as much credibility as my butt!

[drdon326]

18. Says more about your inane post.

Did you even READ the article ??

And if you did, what part did you disagree with?

[Djinn]

20. you don't think the title is a little off don?

"Arabs" also cultivate Nobel winners and Israel has produced it's fair share of terrorists some of whom have become MK's including a former PM, I don't think anyone would argue though if you suggested an article headed:

Arab's produce Nobel winners (and reknown artists, doctors, scientists, writers etc etc) Israel produces IDF child murderers.

[drdon326]

21. Your problem is with the author....I didn't title it.

So did you like the article or do you want to bring up anything

NOT to discuss the post ?

[Djinn]

22. so you'll thoroughly read an article

that I post even if it's title is anti-semitic and clearly biased in a particularly crude way - you'll read it with an open mind?

Please stop with all the crap about "the article not the source" or the new version "the article not the title" if you don't think those 2 things have a crucial bearing on the integrity of the article I suggest a bit of reading here http://www.stormfront.org/ and then you can le me know if you still think all sources and all writers deserve a thorough reading before dissmissal to the trash bin.

[drdon326]

23. Your loss....you might have learned something.....

from PROGRESSIVE muslim who has a unique perspective on what he perceives the sad downward spiral of the culture he loves.

The author is clearly a highly educated person who clearly understands
how there really are no excuses for suicide bombing.

A really great article.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[drdon326]

25. hmmmm....

"being a Muslim or from a Muslim background doesn't actually make someone immune to prejudice."

Lord knows the corollary of that sure is true.lol


"If a Jew posts on Stormfront then you'll accept the article?"

no....but i sure as hell would read it.

[Djinn]

26. yeah sure you would don

just after hitting the alert button furiously no doubt

Sorry this guy has as much credibility with Syrians (in and outside) as Chalabi does with Iraqis

[drdon326]

27. As you wish.....

sadly he speaking to all the middle east.

"So while Israel survives Intifadas, wars, hate, and oppressive Arab rulers, we, the Arab people, must wake-up.

If we pursue the same policies that drove us to the lowest point in our history (Asr al-Inhitat or Era of Despair as opposed to Asr al-Jahyliah or Era of Ignorance that preceded Prophet Mohammed), only we lose.

If we listen to our rulers, we will always be kneeling on the sideline watching Nobel prize winners produced by the Middle East -- but not by us or for us."



While I dont know this author, clearly he is a well eduated progressive muslim. He is against the theocracies that suppress other arabs and limit their potential.

[Djinn]

34. the article is racist, the author is racist, teh title is racist

It's PROPAGANDA. This guy is the Syrian Chalabi - in the pockets of a few influential Americans. Arabs HAVE won and continue to win Nobel prizes.

Israel produced (and still produces) plenty of nutbags and murderers I wouldn't dream of suggesting it was BECAUSE they weer Jewish/Israeli's.

Some people are academic, some people are killers

[drdon326]

38. Sad......

you just don't get it ..... and I was so hoping ,out of everyone, you would. no bs.

eom

[Djinn]

40. whatever

when I post something declaring Jews produce Occupation we'll see if you find it prejudiced.

Try reading up on this reactionary moron. Then tell me you still admire what he says.

[drdon326]

42. You still haven't explained how this guy is a "racist" ?

Thats quite a charge.....what SPECIFIC proof do you have?

[Darranar]

44. "Jews cultivate war criminals." Bigoted or not? n/t

[drdon326]

45. Not racist....just wrong.

could be bigoted but it would depend on context.

[ashiebr]

46. I was minding my own business looking at a few blogs...

.....when I came across this piece about MEMRI, the anti-muslim propaganda site, and I just thought it was relevant:

"................ MEMRI routinely selects articles which show the worst of Arab discourse, even where this represents only a minority of actually expressed opinion, while almost never acknowledging the actual distribution of opinion. As for the Reform Project, it tends to select statements by pro-American reformers who concentrate on criticizing other Arabs, again with little regard for the real debates going on among Arabs. Your selective translations therefore offer a doubly warped perspective on the Arab debates: first, over-emphasizing the presence of radical and noxious voices; and second, over-emphasizing the importance of a small and marginal group of Arabs who share your own prejudices. What you leave out is almost the entire Arab political debate which really matters to Arabs: a lively debate on satellite stations such as al Jazeera and al Arabiya and in the elite Arab press about reform, international relations, political Islam, democracy, and Arab culture which English-speaking readers would greatly benefit from knowing about."

It sounds just like the piece at the top of this thread. Is the Reform Party anything to do with the Reform Project? Hmmmmmmmmmmm!

http://www.juancole.com/2004/11/bloggers-respond-weblogging-community.html

[Name removed]

43. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[drdon326]

47. A-hem...I looked it up.

http://reformsyria.org/Top%20Menu/about_us.htm


Reform Party of Syria (RPS) is a US-based opposition party that has emerged as a result of September 11. The party is governed by secular, peace committed American-Syrians, Euro-Syrians, and native Syrians who are determined to see that a "New Syria" is reborn that embraces real democratic and economic reforms.

RPS believes that political despotism, economic deprivation, and social stagnation in the Middle East have contributed significantly to the increase in domestic and international terrorism, to the tainting of the United States image in the Arab and Muslim worlds, and to an Arab public policy that dilutes the goodwill the US harbors for democratic values in the Middle East.

RPS embraces accountability and transparency, human rights and freedom of expression, pulling out of Lebanon, and peaceful co-existence with our neighbors.

The following individuals represent the Executive Committee of the Reform Party of Syria:

Farid N. Ghadry - President RPS (view bio - download bio)
Dr. Baschar Najjar - Doctor
Dr. Najat Ashkar - Doctor
Abboud al-Sultani - Engineer
Dr. Mohammed al-Gaida - Writer
Chukri al-Samih - Commerce
Ali Hajj Hussein - Writer (Spokesman - Europe)
Oubai Shanbandar (Spokesman - US)
Malek Assaf - Commerce
Dr. Khalid Hakki - Intellectual Linguist
Nawaf Hassan - Journalist
Chabarkoh Hammou - Writer
Dr. Munther Salman - Doctor
Sargon Sarkis - Professor
Abbas Khodr - Architect
Said Salem - Professional
Khalaf Hamdan - Syrian Personality
Mohammed Daham - Syrian Personality
May Salem - Teacher
.........................................................

"RPS embraces accountability and transparency, human rights and freedom of expression, pulling out of Lebanon, and peaceful co-existence with our neighbors."

YEAH....youre right....clearly "racist". :eyes:

PERHAPS.....you were mistaken?

[ashiebr]

48. But then look what they claim...!

"A relative of Syrian President Bashar Assad is hiding Iraqi weapons of mass destruction in three locations in Syria, according to intelligence sources cited by an exiled opposition party ". (WorldNetDaily).

So that's handy isn't it!! Yes, we can trust the Reform Party of Syria all right!! We believe anybody who claims to know where WMDs are stored.

And those bombs in Syria earlier this year?

"The still unexplained attacks in Damascus Tuesday night were a fabrication of Syria's Baath Party hoping for a carte blanche for a crackdown on the regime's opponents, claimed the dissident Reform Party of Syria (RPS) Wednesday".

And as well as being a favourite of the Israli propaganda site, MEMRI, it is spoken of favourably by the Jpost. Add that to WorldNetDaily, National Review, and you begin to see the kind of company kept by the orgnisation.

[drdon326]

49. OMG !!!

Well , that clearly says they are "racist".:shrug:

[ashiebr]

50. I didn't say they were.....

...I say they are a bunch of right-wing dilettantes, straight out of the Chalabi mould......even down to the WMD claim!!

[pelsar]

56. I though that this was supposed to be a liberal website?

let me get this straight this "syrian reform party which talks of accountability and transparency, human rights and freedom of expression, pulling out of Lebanon, and peaceful co-existence with its neighbors is a bad, while the present dictatorship, whos has stolen the country from its own people, has a history that includes shelling its own city is good?

I'm confused...whether israel or europe or anybody else "likes them" is totally irrelvant to what they represent to the Syrian People. It wouldnt be very bright to be against them, simply because israel is "for them".

I though democratic rights were supposed to be inaliable?.....so how is it that a "liberal website" prefers a dictator that continually surpresses its own people as well as the kurds to a more liberal one, (I wont say hes perfect, but compared to the present system?)

this place seems to hold more hate than hope

[Forkboy]

57. "I though that this was supposed to be a liberal website?"

Join the fucking club!

[drdon326]

58. The line starts behind me. n/t

.

[Forkboy]

59. no comment

[Darranar]

51. What do you think they would say on their website?

"We're self-hating Arabs who are servants of US power"?

[drdon326]

52. OK...So you think they're "SELF-HATING ARABS" too, huh?

Any proof of that....or do wish to engage in du libel against these
progressive muslims.....

Farid N. Ghadry - President RPS (view bio - download bio)
Dr. Baschar Najjar - Doctor
Dr. Najat Ashkar - Doctor
Abboud al-Sultani - Engineer
Dr. Mohammed al-Gaida - Writer
Chukri al-Samih - Commerce
Ali Hajj Hussein - Writer (Spokesman - Europe)
Oubai Shanbandar (Spokesman - US)
Malek Assaf - Commerce
Dr. Khalid Hakki - Intellectual Linguist
Nawaf Hassan - Journalist
Chabarkoh Hammou - Writer
Dr. Munther Salman - Doctor
Sargon Sarkis - Professor
Abbas Khodr - Architect
Said Salem - Professional
Khalaf Hamdan - Syrian Personality
Mohammed Daham - Syrian Personality
May Salem - Teacher


without any proof?

[Darranar]

53. No, I don't think that. I was merely pointing out that...

generally people don't criticize themselves on their own website.

A more objective source is necessary for any legitimate argument either way.

[drdon326]

54. "The author is racist" (???)....Brief Biography of Farid N. Ghadry

In October of 2001, Mr. Ghadry, along with several American-Syrians, hatched the idea of the Reform Party of Syria. A constructive and comprehensive program has been put in place to bring regime change to Syria.

Mr. Ghadry and the co-founders of RPS are hoping to return to Syria one day to rebuild the country on the basis of principles of economic and political reforms that will usher democracy, prosperity, freedom of expression, and human rights in addition to lasting peace with open borders with all of Syria’s neighboring countries including Israel.

Mr. Ghadry has been invited to speak at the Washington Institute for Near East Policy, Johns Hopkins University (SAIS), Harvard University, University of Virginia, the European Parliament, the French Parliament, and the Belgian Senate.

Mr. Ghadry is married to Ahlam Ghadry and has four children. He has served on the Board of Trustees of Norwood School in Bethesda, MD and heads the Capital Campaign for a sport program at St. Albans and National Cathedral Schools.

http://reformsyria.org/Misc/bio_of_farid_n_ghadry.htm
.....................................................

still claiming he's a "racist"??

[Darranar]

55. By the same logic...

The President's tax cuts are creating jobs and continuing to strengthen the economy, yet there is still more to do so that every American who wants a job can find one.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/infocus/economy/index.html
....................

Still claiming that the Bush Administration is bad for the economy? (Sarcasm)

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Nicky Scarfo]

33. So racist messages are cool here, but posts criticizing those messages

are not? That's how it works, huh? Some self-hating Arab writes some racist trash about his own people and anyone can post it. Expose the article for being bigoted, get your message deleted. OK, I see DU has the same anti-Arab bias as the DNC. Nice.

[Djinn]

35. especially irritating

given that don ASKED for examples of his prejudice - I can quote several (with links) but apparently even though a comment isn't offensive enough to delete it is offensive enough to quote???

[drdon326]

37. blah,blad,blah

c'mon djinn....the hypocrisy is so thick you COULDN'T cut it with a knife.

The writer talks about the failure of the intafada on the children and that excuses wont cut it.....you cant build a future on suicide bombers. He also talks about how the society are acting like sheeple and not questioning what they are told to believe.

Yet you respond to a post that calls him "self hating arab".

(Even though I still havent seen it) , you decry the fact that you're called a "self-hating jew". but you allow a progressive muslim who talks about the failure of his society, to be called a "self hating arab" without even commentimg on it? Why is he self hating?

I submit to you that the author is right.....he's the progressive one and that those that want to stay with a failed policy are the reactionary forces.

Can you not see the irony??

[Djinn]

41. A man of Syrian descent

who lives in the US - is NOT talking about HIS society as you put it when discussing Palestine.

As for hypocrisy, mmm Palestinian children are to blame if they get shot because they shouldn't be in a war zone. Settlers who live in war zones with the support of the Israeli govt are innocent victims.

Sharon is a brave man trying his best. Arafat is evil.

Palestinian terrorism bad. Zionist terrorism, understandable.

Blah blah blah

[newyorican]

36. Depends...

on whose ox is being gored (you have one guess). Business as usual here in I/P bizarro world.

[drdon326]

39. newyorican....

if it wasn't me , it would be anyone else who didn't agree with you.

hey, newyorican....psssst....

HAPPY THANKSGIVING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

31. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.