Just had a very disturbing conversation with a co-worker

[SharonRB]

I'm so up set I could scream. The gal in the office next to me, who I consider a friend as well as a coworker, is a diehard Repuke (her dog's name is Reagan, for God's sake -- and she's only 35). I usually avoid talking politics with her. Well, I mentioned that I had gone to a vigil last night and talked about the huge numbers of people all over the country. Of course, she made it sound like a small number because of the percentage it comprised out of the total population.

This, of course, led to a discussion about the war. She feels we're much safer because of the war and that it needs to continue. No matter what I said, she wouldn't budge. I told her we're building military bases in Iraq and that we have no intention of leaving. She thought this was a good thing. She's convinced we have a better chance of being attacked here if we leave than if we stay.

I told her about all of the missing money. She thinks the money we spend there is worth it to "keep us safe."

She's obviously following the Repuke line of thinking. I told her I live and breathe this stuff and know what's going on. She said I listen to what I want to listen to and not the other side. I told her I hear both sides and know what's true and what's spin. She said everything is spin on both sides.

I told her there are so many scandals going on and things are going to come to a head. We ended by her saying she hopes everything turns out the right way and I agreed, however, her right way and my right way I'm sure are very, very different.

I just had to vent. I'm so worked up right now, I can't believe it, and I have no one to talk to, so I had to come out here and talk to all of you.

I should really know better, but I guess I wanted to see if she had changed her tune since the election. Obviously if she heard anything about the DSM, the election fraud, the Plame case, etc., etc., etc. she wouldn't believe any of it and would think it was just far left spin. Some people will never come around, and I should just not even try to talk to them.

Wait until she finds out I'm going to the rally in DC next month!

[ernstbass]

1. I have so many co workers like her

they get this glazed over loook on their faces and talk about W sending troops overeas to "keep us safe" - I feel your rage and pain!!

[Stil]

48. I have one at work

who does not like to read or listen to the news. But thinks * is doing great. I've asked him if he ever reads or watches news. No, to much stuff going on. This is your prime repub. likes to stay in the dark.

[bushisanidiot]

2. Do they drink the kool-aid BEFORE sticking their heads in the sand

or do they stick their heads in the sand first and then pour the kool-aid on their asses?

just asking..

[Cha]

35. I think it's the latter..

but I'm just speculating.

[donkeyotay]

52. Should the GOP change emblems from the elephant to the ostrich? nt

[Starbucks Anarchist]

69. I believe they use a kool-aid enema.

[ClassWarrior]

3. How are we "safer here" when Bush** is diverting all our security...

...resources to the ME? Ask her that.

NGU.

[BlueIris]

4. Her dog's name is Reagan. That says it all, really.

About so many things.

I'm sorry you had to endure that hellishness. Reminds me of the few die-hard Republicans in my area; letting go is tough and they're not ready to give it up yet. It's so hard to see people so brainwashed. In a perverse sense, I feel sorry for them.

[SharonRB]

6. I do, too

Because when we get attacked EVEN THOUGH WE'RE IN IRAQ, they won't understand why.

My coworker thinks it's a good thing for us to have bases over there to keep an eye on things. We need to stay there to show the Iraqi people that we're really good people. She thinks the typical Iraqis love us and are glad we're there.

[RaleighNCDUer]

33. And many of them never will let go.

For whatever perverse reasons of their own, there are still many in this country who see Nixon as a hero.

Actually, most of them are in this administration.

[Vinnie From Indy]

37. I used to be able to get an old neighbor really pissed off

He too named his dog Reagan after Ronnie and I would always bring up the similarities between his dog and the actual man. This usually occurred as the dog was licking his balls or crapping on the lawn.

[chapel hill dem]

47. At UVa, bball coach Terry Holland had a dog named "Dean Smith" and he

caught hell from the press about abusing an animal.

[Dr.Phool]

5. My wife works with one like that.

She works in a social sevices agency that was privatized and totally screwed up by Jeb

Her co-worker was on maternity leave, and when she came back to work, announced to all, that she named her new daughter "Reagan". When nobody responded, she said, "You know, after the president".

My wife said, "Oh, I thought you meant the little girl in the exorcist"!

I can't believe my mild-mannered wife said that. Good for her.

[SharonRB]

7. LOL

When I first heard her dog's name a few years ago, I thought it was "Regan," but when I found out it was "Reagan," and was, indeed, named after Ronnie himself, I couldn't believe it. Especially given that she was just a teenager when he was president.

[4morewars]

14. LMAO !!!

Your wife rocks !
I wish I could have seen the look on the freeper's face !

:yourock:

[spuddonna]

32. LMAO!! That's awesome!!

I've gotta tell my hubby that one...

[CitrusLib]

54. LOL! Nice come back.

I am constantly astounded by how many people around me were f'd by both or either Bush brother and STILL support them. Boggles the mind!

[smoogatz]

56. There's also the obvious King Lear reference

Reagan was one of the bad daughters who drove Lear into the wilds, raving and naked. Anyone who's at all literate will make that connection immediately. You have to feel bad about what all this is going to do to the kid's psyche. You named me after WHO?

[0007]

58. I think that would sail right over most freepers.

[smoogatz]

63. Yeah, but every teacher this kid's ever gonna have

And every non-bonehead classmate after junior high, will get the reference.

[0007]

67. How true!

[SaveAmerica]

8. Blinders, read my post about Love Letters to DU, you have to

remain peaceful to maintain your sanity.

[SharonRB]

19. I posted something to your thread

before I saw this post here, SaveAmerica. My feelings are so similar to yours about DU.

[zalinda]

9. Get her a recruitment form

and tell her if she really believes the war is right, she'll join and help them win the war. Or you could just leave one on her desk and watch the fallout.

zalinda

[uppityperson]

15. That is the simplest response to give her.

Sometimes you can't convince someone of what they want to believe, and discussions are only to prove your own way of thought is right. Simply tell her you have been thinking of what she said and it seems like she needs one of these, then hand her a recruitment form. Download one here, print it off and hand it to her with a smile and thank her for continuing to keep us safe.
http://usmilitary.about.com/library/pdf/enlistment.pdf

[SemperEadem]

10. Since the age of recruitment is up to 42

why is she still here and not over there, joining the troops, since it's such a worthy cause to her? Why, she could keep us safe, too, by going over there and showing the Iraqi people just how good a person SHE is!!! And her little dog, too!!! One more American occupying their country, stealing their oil and bombing their children to pieces couldn't be a bad thing, yes?

When the truth does out, because it must, she's the one who's going to be spinning around like a dervish because she chose to drink the kool-aid. It's her world that's going to be turned upside down by the truth... and the whining and delusionment that will come along is going to be a marvel of the ages.

[SharonRB]

16. I'm sure she'd never leave her 22-month-old daughter,

but maybe she wants to send her husband.

[BQueen]

11. I know how you feel

they buy the whole "LIEberal" line and claim *we* live in the echo chamber. Very frustrating. When I tried to convince one guy last Sept to vote Kerry (or at least not for Shrub) I got the whole "you must believe everything you read" song and dance.

I said, I've read that vapor trails from airplanes are really "chemtrails" intended to poison us, and many other oddball theories, but don't buy into stuff without evidence. I have read the arguments at the "reputable" conservative sites and find them uncompelling (but according to his statement I would still believe it). If I could believe so many contradictory things I could be a Republican, but I can't do that. I can only believe what the evidence tells me, and that is that these people are the worst thing to ever happen to my beloved country.

(just for grins, this guy is gay, very religious, thought he had nothing to fear from Asscroft, and called me a "religious bigot" because I objected to Asscroft's being annointed into office and hosting prayer meetings at work. When I took offense at being dismissed as gullible and naive, he said, "but you're the most well-read, best educated person I know! I have enormous respect for you!" How do they live with the contradictions without their heads exploding?)
edit - typo

[Benhurst]

12. Don't waste your time with her. Although it is sexist, the

British term "dumb cow" does have its uses.

Let her chew her cud in peace.

[Jade Fox]

13. How safe does she feel with the economy on the brink?

Point out to her the costs of the Iraq occupation, and the debt which
gives other countries true power over the US.

[rodeodance]

18. "keep us safe." she has the disease!!

[Verve]

17. I felt like you did when I saw the segment on NBC evening news the other

night. They interviewed people in a random small town in a red state about the war. (Sorry, I can't remember where. Kansas maybe?) Anyway, many were complaining about gas prices and the war, but they all still
stood by their president. It was complete lunacy!

It's almost like they have pride in staying set in their ways. How many times do you need to get beat up before you fight back? I fear many Americans would just cower and take it because they feel it's the right thing to do.

[rman]

20. "everything is spin" - yet she believes it.

The RW spin that is.
Amazing.

Somehow i doubt she ever listens to say, Democracy Now. She probably thinks CNN is extreme left.

[SharonRB]

25. I'm sure she does -- think CNN is extreme left, that is

I was afraid to ask if she watches Faux, but I'm sure she does.

[Jade Fox]

28. Interesting mind-set, isn't that?

The Right-wing noise machine has succeeded in convincing many that there
is no longer such a thing as simple truth. So people should just decide what
they believe, and stick too it regardless of the facts that are presented to
them.

[SharonRB]

29. I don't think she'd recognize a fact

if it bit her in the ass.

[photuris]

21. Don't do head miles over her

There's always going to be someone like her. As tired as the saying is, you cannot reason a person out of a position reason didn't put them in.

[SharonRB]

26. Exactly

Which is why I usually avoid these discussions with her.

[Lexingtonian]

22. Uh, don't argue with these people

Yeah, I know how it is. I can't help tussling with them on occasion either, though I avoid it these days as much as I can help it.

The phrase you're looking for is "fortress mentality". They'll cave in time, but they really have to run out of everything that sustains them in their idiocy until they do.

[SharonRB]

27. I don't think she'll admit she's wrong until

everything comes tumbling down and * and the whole administration are impeached and/or put in jail. Even then, she'd probably think they were framed.

[Lexingtonian]

34. at which point

you can explain to her that Denial is not a river in Egypt.

I always find that absurd beliefs systems of the kind are built on a small number- often a single- foolish assumptions about the world. Stuff like white people, or 'Christians' (like themselves), being destined to run the country (and/or the world) for all time, or a lack of formal education entailing virtuousness. Or some other defensive belief that is rationally absurd but props their ego. Be very careful about it if you figure hers out- it's psychologically existential stuff, people never forgive you for exposing their fundamental weaknesses.

Politically, her stance is what is called 'hardline'. The only way these people give up beliefs is when the people who are their champions- i.e. Dubya- publicly refute tenets of The Faith, at which point a Crisis Of Faith arises. Bush Sr. raising taxes was such a Crisis Of Faith affair. Bush Jr. admitting failure in Iraq would be the kind of thing that hits home with them now.

[Ian David]

23. Tell her when the global ecosystem collapses, we'll eat Republicans first

Soylent Green is Republicans! It's made from Republicans!

[blueknight]

24. tell her,

it didnt help keep england safer

[Quakerfriend]

30. Some day we will discover that there is a gene for

being out of touch with reality! My RW family members sure have it!

They also seem to have the "never admit you're wrong gene" that many RWs have!

[Oreegone]

68. Yeah that's right

Since they have done real well, they are the ones eating good now, so they will be good eating later.:hide:

[spuddonna]

31. She's got blinders on, and Kool-Aid on IV tap...

Some people are so identified with their political beliefs that they WON'T listen to anything except the 'party line'. (aka Football Team Syndrome - your team can do no harm, and go kill those bums!)

:pals: You can always come here to vent! :)

[samsingh]

36. the war is not making us safer

and it killing a lot of innocent people.

your colleague is a selfish stupid idiot.

[SharonRB]

44. Well, I don't like namecalling

Unless it's Bush or Cheney or Rove or one of those idiots, but she's not very open-minded.

[samsingh]

70. i don't generally like name-calling

however, i'm at the end of my patience with the right-wing idiots and supporters. Alot of people are getting killed because of their policies. People who support the right wing are enabling this.

Their arguments are entirely hypocritical. While they accuse the left of having few family values, they themselves are tearing families apart.

They win by yelling loudly, ignoring facts, and spewing hatred. If we don't start yelling back, i think they'll stay in power.

[Emendator]

38. Ask her how it feels to be in the minority.

Antiwar people are used to it. But now we're the majority. And it's just getting started.

Then tell her that the only thing that can save Bush is if he starts a war with Iran - whether World War III or just a serious regional war - there will be a lot of chaos and it won't be good. So maybe she should start hoping for another war. That way she can be honest in her bloodlust. Why hide it?

[zulchzulu]

39. Um...terrorism has TRIPLED since 2004...pay no mind...move along...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/04/26/AR2005042601623.html

Snip:
"The number of serious international terrorist incidents more than tripled last year, according to U.S. government figures, a sharp upswing in deadly attacks that the State Department has decided not to make public in its annual report on terrorism due to Congress this week.

Overall, the number of what the U.S. government considers "significant" attacks grew to about 655 last year, up from the record of around 175 in 2003, according to congressional aides who were briefed on statistics covering incidents including the bloody school seizure in Russia and violence related to the disputed Indian territory of Kashmir."

OK, it ain't in Jersey yet.....but...

Ask your friend how she feels that Cheney has made millions from his ties to KBR...how the war was based on lies...does she know about PNAC...on and on...

Naming a dog Reagan certainly is a bit troubling, since he helped spawn Osama and Saddam...

[SharonRB]

41. You know all this, I know all this,

but some people think we just listen to what we want to listen to and our sources can't be right. Keep moving....nothing to see here....

[zulchzulu]

45. Tell her the source for tripling of terrorism is from US State Dept.

Yunno, those guys.... The commie liberals in the CIA, Pentagon and State Dept.

:crazy:

[SharonRB]

46. To be honest, I just don't want to open up the discussion again

It's just not worth it when you know someone won't change their mind.

[zulchzulu]

53. Whenever a co-worker Freeper starts yapping...I yawn and leave the room

They get my point. A nice, LOUD yawn always does wonders.

[Skittles]

40. LOL and you're in MICHIGAN

you should try it here in Texas were TONS of morons think that way

[SharonRB]

42. Yes, thank goodness we're blue

[Roland99]

43. Sounds like a well-taught sheep.

[AngryAmish]

49. get her fired

People like that don't deserve to have a job.

[SharonRB]

51. Let's not get carried away here, Angry

We may disagree, but that doesn't make all of them bad people or incompetent in other parts of their lives.

Yes, I was upset, but I wouldn't get vitriolic with her or wish bad on her. As I stated in my OP, I do consider her a friend. It's just very frustrating.

[Sean Reynolds]

50. Well she was right in naming her dog after Reagan.

Cause that's all he was.

[Duer 157099]

55. I know LOTS of these people, too

only, probably, worse. They believe we should bomb or take over the entire middle east and completely crush Islam before Islam does it to us.

They are out there. They really exist. There is no reasoning with them.

[TumorSupressor]

57. You need to remember

In Germany before and during the war, there were alot of people just like this woman. I think you should let her know that she could be considered of the people in germany that knew what was happening to their friends and neighborhoods who were jews and supported what was happening. They only listened to one side of the story and didn't check their concience.

[Orion The Hunter]

59. Here's what you should say to her:

"So in like 17-18 years from now, when we are still in the Middle East and your child comes home and tells you there are joining the Military to go over there and fight to protect you and the U.S., you are going to let them go proudly, right...?"

[barb162]

60. I have a friend like us. We finally agreed not to talk politics

[City Lights]

61. I have a similar friend.

It's infuriating!

She disagreed with ** on everything, but thought he would do a better job in the terra war so she voted for **. The kicker is she doesn't even support what we're doing in Iraq, and told me if they reinstate the draft she plans to leave the country to keep them from drafting her kids.

:argh:

We don't speak much anymore.

[mmonk]

62. Ask her how we are safer

when the administration outed a valuable CIA WMD tracking asset and has attacked a country for NO honest reason creating rage around the world. Ask her how such stupid thinking can enter someones brain other than blindly believing pure propaganda?

[Capn Sunshine]

64. Wait until she sees us leaving ASAP in early '06

This is boiling down to a damage control exercise.
Those on the take have taken their fill at the trough. The bribes are all done, and the billions have been made with minimal cost ( to them)

Right now, they plan on declaring victory when the constitution is written and getting the hell out.

Private contractors will work the bases, but they are going to try like mad to get the trrops the hell out of there before the mids.

All that remains is the spin, which is going to be funny as hell in a very sad way.

[LittleClarkie]

65. Ask London is "fighting them over there" made THEM safer

Just a matter of time.

And that's what it will take to wake some people up.

Of course the Repubs will find a way to blame us for it when it happens. Clinton's fault, dontcha know.

[Stryguy]

66. Their own little world

It's amazing how the most die hard republicans I meet are often the most un-aware of their surroudings outside of their day to day interactions.

You could tell her about Valerie Plame but most likely she's never heard of the woman.. much less what the whole hub-bub about outing a CIA spy is all about.

Ask her about last weeks episode of Desperate Housewives! She'll know who's sleeping with who though!

[SharonRB]

71. Actually, the whole conversation started when she

was telling me in great detail about the story she heard on the "news" about the missing honeymooning husband. I said I don't pay much attention to those kinds of stories -- like that and the Natalie Holloway story -- there are way more important things they should be talking about. That led to me telling her I went to a vigil and the rest of our conversation.

[hadrons]

73. if you haven't seen the movie Downfall, see it (great film) and recommend

it to her ... one of the things to point out was how many true-believers there were as the Nazi regime came crumbing down and how they still believed they were right when reality should have long woke them up and also how Hitler was totally disconnected with reality right up to the very end

also what I remember was Joseph Goebbels saying he had no sympathy for the German people because they chose to follow them and give them the mandate to do what they wanted (I can see Bush saying 'fuck it, they were dumb enough to vote for me, so screw em')

believe me, you could tie-in what was going on in the film with Bush and the bush-bots and not mention it

[mtnester]

72. You know you will never win with her, so I have something for you

[SharonRB]

76. Yeah, you're right -- that's pretty much what I've been doing.

Thanks, everyone, for all of the advice, but I know none of it will work with her -- it will just make her think I'M the crazy one in my tinfoil hat and it will make working with her more difficult.

[lakeguy]

74. people with their heads in the sand disgust me...

bet she doesn't take the time to even educate herself about the topics she feels so strongly about...

[The Sleeper]

75. What tumor suppressor said...

Your "friend" is just that type. They would stand by and watch you dragged off as an "enemy combatant" and not say a word. They would rather believe the feel good lies than stand up against injustice.
People like this cannot be trusted.....ever.