Why is Honesty so hard to find?

[Robert Cooper]

Call me naive. Call be stupid. But it seems to me we're all taught to be honest as kids.

Somewhere between there and the seats of power, honesty and its associated traits such as sincerity, integrity, honour, loyalty, service, humility seem to evaporate.

They say power can corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely, but why must it be so?

And can it be changed, or is it inherent in the species?

Will those who deceive be the ones to rule the planet?

This is my first topic, so I hope you find it thought-provoking.

[brainshrub]

1. It's such a lonely word, everyone is so untrue.

[Robert Cooper]

5. "everyone is so untrue"

But doesn't that keep honest people out of office? After all, why should they volunteer themselves for that kind of assumption?

Have we become so cynical we can no longer conceive of an honest person seeking to serve the public?
And is there no way to retrieve the need for honesty amongst our politicians and their staff?

[TheFarseer]

2. because the truth sounds worse than your lie

And you have to look as good as possible to get elected or whatever we're talking about.

[justiceischeap]

3. I have a theory about politicians and honest

That when you get to the level of US government and become a career politician, you automatically have lied or done something corrupt to stay there.

You will NEVER find a honest career politician.

[napi21]

4. I would agree with you, except for one.

I really believe Jimmy Carter was the one politician who was and still is a very honest man. I don't know if you can consider him a career politician, but he is honest.

[justiceischeap]

12. Actually I view Jimmy Carter as a fluke

More than anything. He is so unlike any US president we've had in modern history.

[Donna Zen]

6. Because people vote for liars

...and believe the lies that the liars tell about those who are honest.

Until the people reject the liars, they will have no reason to stop. In fact, the votes actually encourage them because they know they have nothing to lose. Of course there are those who argue that the liars are just "good politicians" that Washington is a tough place. Horse hockies!

This has had the effect of honest brilliant people rejecting politics knowing the experience is mind-searing.

[applegrove]

7. I don't think most people are untrue. For sure there are some lying liars

nepharious monsters. And if they get ahold of people they will "remake" them in their own lying liar image.

But that is rare. And it happens. But it is not most people.

I'm sorry. Most people try to be true to themselves.

US is having a run of bad luck. It is heartbreaking and soul-stealing. And it hurts. And it hurts more as time goes on. But it is not the norm in humans.

[Robert Cooper]

10. media and politics

I wasn't applying that statement to the human race, Applegrove. Wouldn't be fair, given there are over 6 billion of them and I've met less than a thousand or two.

But Republicans control the two houses, the WH, and will soon likely control the Supreme Court. DeLay is/was their Majority Leader in the House. Frist is the majority leader in the Senate. Bush is in the WH. All three are dishonest and are fully supported by the elected members of their party. The debacle over Terry Schiavo is a clear case of dishonest manipulation involving all three.

In a nutshell, this demonstrates the power deceit has over America and the world. The developing story of CIA Torture/Cheney's defense of torture is likely to be far worse than the Schiavo incident.

And then there is the media, such as FOX, seeking power through manipulation of the truth.

These clearly beg the questions: what has happened to the value of ethics, why, and what needs to be done to restore their original value.

[applegrove]

13. Like you said: the problem is not most of the people. The problem

is in the cabal at the top. The focus needs to be on them.

I'm sorry but there is nothing wrong with people living in a democracy and voting with their hearts. Voting for the public good. That does not need to be changed. Neocons hate it because it results in less power for them and ignores their brilliant Utopia that they want to create out of the world.

The world has done some amazing stuff. And created some amazing institutions. The problem is not in the ethics of people but in the narcissism of the group that leads. And that includes many MBA schools.

The problem is narcissists.

The neocons very much want to remake the world into a place where ethics are only found outside of governance and in our churches and small groups as communities. The ethics belong where they are located currently - in government regulation.

It is not the people who have some work to do (the vast majority as Katrina demonstrated). It is the WH and the neocons and the corporations and the uber-rich. And some in the fundie right. Those who lead mega-profit churches.

[kentuck]

8. Because it can be harmful and painful to some people...

Extreme wealth would have a difficult time if everyone was honest with themselves...

[bonito]

9. Hay, welcome to du!

I will call you trusting, not stupid at all. Its just shocking and overwhelming to wake up and see all the crap that goes on in the world. Carry on my wayward son there will be peace when you are done. Peace

[Robert Cooper]

11. They stand with their hands in their pockets

I'm afraid I woke up to "all the crap" back in the '70's.

Back then there was (almost) an entire generation who were going to change things.

Today, that generation (and their children!) supported a war of aggression against Iraq. They stand with their hands in their pockets while the Vice-President of the United States says he needs a special permit to allow the CIA to torture foreigners on foreign soil.

They stand with their hands in their pockets...!!!

Waiting for the media to feed them the latest talking points or distractions (reality shows??)

What happened to "Make Love, Not War"? Why are the ROTC-guys running the government and not the Hippies?

Edit - add: Thanks for the welcome :-)