Dean supporters raise your hand if you're sick of being called names.

[AntiCoup2K4]

Or if you're sick of those who never bothered to research all the candidates but wrongly declare Kerry is the "most electable"

Or if you're sick of those who never paid attention to Dean or his progressive policy positions now claim that he stole them from a career waffler who consistently enabled Bush for the last 3 years.

Or if you're sick of people who say you shouldn't vote your conscience if you want to beat Bush.

Or if you're sick of people who claim that Kerry has a spine and stood up to the Republicans. (These same people claim to know all about BCCI, IranContra, CIA drugrunning and the illegal wars in Central America and claim that they were all exposed by Kerry, but have no answer as to why he nver brought down Nixon, Reagan or Bush Sr., either.)

Or if you're hoping you can carry on with the task of getting Bush out of office while fools with no knowledge of the last 30 years are just jumping on a bandwagon.

[curlyred]

1. you beat me to it

and you left out:

Or if you're sick of Dean's continuing grassroots effort being compared to Nader's organization.

[blm]

22. Too bad this thread has no basis in reality.

.

[AntiCoup2K4]

27. It certainly has more basis in reality than

the thread it was modeled after :)

[sangh0]

31. True, we all know Dean supporters never engage in name-calling

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449569#449897

[Nicholas_J]

103. Right

I remember being subject to all sorts of personal attacks by Dean supporters for posting articles from Vermont Newspapers and Vermont Progressives and Democrats about Deans not very Democratic Record and being subject to all sorts of personal attacks, anything from being called a "turd floating in a punch bowl" to having one Dean supporter on DU stalk me around the Internet and post graphics on DU from a personal web site that I put up on the net as a project for a Web Design Class.

For the most part, during my long history on DU, it was largely a number of Dean supporters on DU who began the personal attakcs on people who questioned Dean or put up researchedinformation about Dean that indicated a political history that was anything but progressive, in fact, one that indicated that Dean himself has neve engaged in actively supporting any politically progressive stance while he was in office, and only has taken that stance as a political means of gaining support as a presidential candidate. Even articles out of Vermont from Vermont Democrats who pointed out that Deans record as Governor did not in any way shape or form resemble his platform as presidential candidate were subject to attack, and then Deans very non progressive acts defended.

Eventually, given the frequency of personal attack from Dean supporters, I can see why many supporters of other candidates decided to play the same way that Dean supporters did.

My own post, for the main part were always directed at the candidate and not individual Dean supporters. Bur that did not every post I put up from resulting in dozens of personal attacks by Dean supporters, followed by dozens of "message deleted" posts following my posts.

[AmyStrange]

104. Wrong...

it was because you called Dean a liar, which had no basis in fact except for your newspaper sources and other opinion pieces which were not the popular opinions you made them out to be.

They can now be seen as false sources and opinions, because if they were correct, why did Dean get so much support from his fellow Vermonters during the nomination process?

Dave (AmyStrange.com) Ayotte
Please, regularly check the One Missing Person (is one person too many) searchable website for the latest (and archived) missing person news stories:

http://NEWS.OneMissingPerson.org/




Serious Serial Killer discussion:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SK-Cafe/

[wyldwolf]

2. Other DU'ers, raise your hand if you're sick of...

..whiney sour grapes Dean posts...

[dsc]

3. You might want to speak to blm

I absolutely guarentee this thread would never have been started but for hers.

[wyldwolf]

5. so?

[dsc]

well if you are going to bitch

then bitch at the right person. In this case blm. on edit this isn't in response to the original post.

[wyldwolf]

8. did blm start a whiney sour grapes Dean post?

[dsc]

10. No she started a whiny sore winner post

[wyldwolf]

14. The operative word being "winner."

And her post was actually factual. Unlike the start of this thread.

[AntiCoup2K4]

28. Do you know the difference between fact and opinion?

I realize facts are hard to come by at DLC headquarters, but her post was all opinions and spin. As 75% of them are. (the other 25% being personal attacks)

[sangh0]

32. Do you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449569#449897

[Name removed]

96. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[wyldwolf]

50. of course I do... a simple comparison of the two initial posts in the..

...threads will show which speaks of facts and which spins.

My favorite?

Or if you're sick of people who claim that Kerry has a spine and stood up to the Republicans. (These same people claim to know all about BCCI, IranContra, CIA drugrunning and the illegal wars in Central America and claim that they were all exposed by Kerry, but have no answer as to why he nver brought down Nixon, Reagan or Bush Sr., either.)

Amazing spin there --- love of Dean so blind that he/she spins away documented facts about Kerry.

[AntiCoup2K4]

52. There was no spinning at all.

The fact remains that, despite all of Kerry's supposed knowledge of the Bush Criminal Empire, they (the BCE) were not wounded in the least, and are in fact bigger than ever. You could speculate a number of reasons why this is the case, but for Kerry's part, he happens to be bound by a lifetime oath which would prevent him from harming Bush Sr, Bush Jr, or anyone else who happenned to be a Skull & Bones member.

[sangh0]

54. Is that why Kerry got them convicted?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449569#449897

[BuelahWitch]

84. So Kerry did it all by himself, did he?

Wouldn't have had any help there would he? :eyes:

[sangha]

89. Kerry led

all by himself

[lastliberalintexas]

102. Jack Brooks

and several other Congressmen would be interested to hear that. :eyes:


on edit- This is not a slam against Kerry, who did some good work on the Iran Contra fiasco. But good God people, he didn't do it alone. There were many others who went after Reagan and his crew as well.

And we Dean supporters are called cultists or idol worshipers. :eyes:

[wyldwolf]

56. I'll underline the spin part

Or if you're sick of people who claim that Kerry has a spine and stood up to the Republicans. (These same people claim to know all about BCCI, IranContra, CIA drugrunning and the illegal wars in Central America and claim that they were all exposed by Kerry, but have no answer as to why he nver brought down Nixon, Reagan or Bush Sr., either.)

This attempts to do a number of things.

1. Call a certain DU'ers credibility into question. I've seen his/her research, all completely sourced and documented. There is no "claim" here. This person knows their stuff.

2. Kerry did expose several deeds by the rightwing entities in question. That is not a "claim." That is a fact.

3. Exposing them wasn't enough for you because they were not "brought down." That must mean - if the implied message above is to be believed - that Kerry's work did not good, was not needed, and was meaningless.

Good old fashioned Dean love -inspired spin.

[sangh0]

57. Well, bear in mind

all the BFEE-ers Dean got locked up

[wyldwolf]

58. yeah, and how many did he merely expose?

[sangh0]

59. Dean doesn't "merely expose"

He has a super-secret hit squad that assasinates them.

[chocolateeater]

18. This is the thread he is refering to.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449740
Just to bring you up to date on who is flaming who around here.

[blm]

12. Horsefeathers. Read these threads calling Kerry supporters "assholes"

and sheep and bandwagonjumpers.

If THOSE threads hadn't been so plentiful this past month, MY THREAD would not exist tonight.

Since when is it OK with you that Kerry supporters get attacked as something then what they are...Democrats who appreciated Kerry's lengthy record of service and reward him with their trust.

[dsc]

16. Do I really need to compare names

I have been called a fag, ingrate, liar and all kinds of other things by Kerry supporters. You don't see me posting whiny threads.

[Cheswick2.0]

21. I will be bringing new voters to the polls for the candidates I am working

for. Most of those people will be voting for Kerry too. You can thank me now.

[Exgeneral]

34. what is it with Kerry Supporters

the usual suspects on this board, dying to mix it up, spiteful, venal, what is it?

The HORSE IS DEAD. YOU CAN STOP BEATING IT NOW

[sangh0]

39. Kerry, Kerry, Kerry

.

[Forkboy]

44. Butterflies

[sangh0]

49. fishbait

.

[RetroLounge]

68. poop

x

[sangh0]

70. Get your own line

"poop" belongs to LibertyChick

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449740#450090

[Forkboy]

71. imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

I thank you all for your love.

[sangh0]

72. fishbait

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x450138#450177

[Forkboy]

76. You should thank me for my love

[sangh0]

78. butterflies

.

[Forkboy]

79. you're welcome

[BuelahWitch]

85. Is that the same as saying

Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice? :D

[XanaDUer]

4. Hey!

:hi:

[bigwillq]

11. My response:

:thumbsdown:

[Sushi-Lover]

13. Almost as much as I am sick

of whiney sour grapes Kerry posts. I think this is like a big sour grapes throwing fight, mostly between only a few on each side.

[bigwillq]

25. I think I got a seed in my eye n/t

[Sushi-Lover]

30. A great mystery solved

sour grapes are a seeded variety :)

[bigwillq]

53. Shocking isn't it

People could lose an eye. Let's be careful with all this "hand-raising" this and that. Kerry's going to be the nominee, face it people, we've know this for weeks now, let's do some real good and kick some fucking Shrub ass!


edit: spelling

[lurk_no_more]

74. So tell me.....Just what are you trying to say?

Main Entry: whine
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): whined; whin·ing

a : to utter a high-pitched plaintive or distressed cry?
b : to make a sound similar to such a cry?
c : to complain with or as if with a whine?


And then there were none!
” JAFO”

[donco6]

6. Yawn.

Dean who?

(and that's coming from someone who donated several hundred dollars to his campaign, appreciate his work, but good lord get over it.)

[stepnw1f]

7. Grow up!

[bigwillq]

9. They need a new Smiliey logo

If they added a "Hand" raised logo, it would be all over my post!:thumbsup: This is the best I could find!

[Raya]

15. We all luv ya and support ya guys. Lets just do it this year and get Bush

[AntiCoup2K4]

17. One minute you call us "Naderites" and the next you beg for our support?

So which is it?

And I've made my position clear on voting for Kerry. He's got to earn it. But some of his supporters really aren't helping his cause at all.

[lastknowngood]

26. Kerry and his "supporters" are doing their best to divide the

democratic party so the shrub can get reselected. How else can you explain these arsine anti dean people. Dean in right on every issue and Kerry is waffling on every issue. If you people would listen to Dean instead of the crap coming out of the DLC lovers who are Trying to throw this election you would learn something. That however would take some intellect and research and it's so much easier to slam the only democrat who criticized the shrub for over a year. Kerry to this day says the shrub provided great leadership after 911, how the hell does he expect to beat the shrub when he has agreed with him on everything?

[AntiCoup2K4]

29. That's a damn good question.

And I agree with you on what the unfortunate conclusion will be :(

[littlejoe]

82. That's not true. We just don't believe that the

tail should be wagging the big dog.

[sangh0]

33. One minute you engage in name calling and the next you complain about it?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x449569#449897

[donco6]

38. Look.

It's not our job to convince you to vote at all. You need to use your own mind and make a decision. If it's Kerry, fine. If not, fine. It's totally, absolutely up to you. But don't be yelling at us for not being able to "convince" you well enough. We don't have to.

[curlyred]

37. why would you say that?

seems like a.......flip flop.

[sangh0]

40. Speaking of flip-flops

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x414994#415051

[curlyred]

42. here you go

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=449489

[sangh0]

46. What's your point?

Someone else is being nasty so it's OK for anti-coup to call others names while complaining that people are calling him/her names?

How's that working?

[curlyred]

94. the point is

this person is talking out of both sides of his/her mouth.

[sangh0]

95. And

this thread starter is not?

[Faygo Kid]

19. Got knowledge of the last 40 years. Wanna talk?

Actually, back to Nixon-Kennedy, 1960, nine years old, my earliest political memory. Sorry you're bitter. Tell me, what did you expect 27 year old John Kerry to do to bring down Nixon, besides being a principled and highly respected voice against the war? Bush is the worst and most dangerous president in American history, by multiples of 10. Sorry it hasn't gone your way, and I hope you feel better by posting. Suspect I am wasting my time here, but the moderators are letting you vent, and maybe that's a good thing.

[wyldwolf]

24. I doubt anyone will take you up on your challenge...

...but I would love to see it.

[DemMother]

41. I agree

I was 7 in 1960 and was the only kid on my bus for Kennedy (I lived in one of the more notorious red states). I grew up with right-wingers, moved to Chicago and then to California. I've worked in Democratic politics for 35 years, and I completely agree about Bush. Nixon never raised my hackles the way W does--he is a completely craven--a despicable, nasty, arrogant little bully. The image of his pinched, silly face makes everything else fall away...

The Magistrate has it right--the best slogan on DU. It always gives me a lift when I see it...

NOW LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS. (hope I got it right)

[Cheswick2.0]

20. That about sums it up

I will be spending my time and effort getting three Pa Democrats elected. Turn out for them will likely help Kerry at the polls. He should be thanking me and all his supporters should be thanking me too. :hi:

[Exgeneral]

35. That's where I'm at too

we're using our Clark org to GOTV for democrats in Washington State.
Kerry might possible benfit once they get to the polls, don't you think?

[EXE619K]

23. I enjoy it!

It's fun being the scourge of the Democratic Party!

[sangh0]

36. Dean supporters - raise your hand if you're sick of calling others names

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x414994#415051

[Darth_Kitten]

47. Let's not play the martyr.....come on everybody!!

this infighting isn't helpful. :(

Dean "didn't do himself in" as some people want to believe. He was on message when it wasn't politically correct to be so. He took chances, and quite frankly, the reason the democratic party is enjoying it's present popularity with the american public is because of Dean's efforts.
There was a perception that there was little difference between Kerry's and Dean's views, and since Kerry was seen more as "establishment" and Dean the outsider, the "establishment" candidate took more of the votes. JMHO.
Dean's time will come. :)

[sangh0]

48. Why don't you apply that sentiment

to post #45?

[Darth_Kitten]

83. I'm applying it to everyone.......

not to you specifically.

[Larkspur]

60. I'm estatic about calling you names sangh0

so I guess I'll keep my hand down.

[sangh0]

66. Gee, how special

.

[JNelson6563]

80. I'm a Dean supporter & don't call names

but thanks for the broad generalization anyway! :hi:

Julie

[emulatorloo]

43. "Dean has been very clear he wants to be part of the team. . ."

<snip>

"Dean has been very clear he wants to be part of the team, he wants to help win," Kerry said. "John Edwards has been very clear he wants to be part of the team."

<snip>

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=694&ncid=703&e=2&u=/ap/20040309/ap_on_el_pr/kerry

[Forkboy]

45. I've said all along there was little difference..

..between the Clark/Kerry/Dean camps.

These threads show how correct that is.

[Forkboy]

51. ..

:nopity:

[sangh0]

55. Kerry, Kerry, Kerry

.

[Forkboy]

61. Butterflies

[BuelahWitch]

86. Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice, Beetlejuice! n/t

[salin]

62. title and text don't quite match

works more to do the exact thing to others that the thread title decries.

Wish folks would stop feeding into this tit for tat antagonistic threads.

[sangh0]

64. Gee, ya think?

Salin, when will you realize that some people WANT to feed the tit for tat? It's not going to end because someone breaks out a guitar and strums Kumbaya.

[salin]

67. no offense

but you feed it from one of the directions - and in my opinion that helps keep this crap going on. No kudos from me on that point.

[sangh0]

69. Yes, I do feed it

but you can't starve that beast

[salin]

73. I sure would like to see it tried

that beast needed to starve a while ago.

When I see you taking on those baiting from the other direction... as the behavior is AS disruptive and distracting.. then I will take you on this point a little more seriously. Your suspicions... I share... but sometimes think that this particular beast does come from both directions... sort of a shape-shifting beast.

75. does it make you think of Yeats'

second coming?
just a thought

[sangh0]

77. Oh, it definitely comes from both directions

There are people on the left who hate the Dems every bit as much as the Freepers.

Ignoring them is not an option. There are too many people here who would find their arguments sympathetic if there wasn't anyone to refute them. Not that *they* believe their tripe, but since it is fashioned to attract dissatisfied, yet not very knowledgeable, liberals it would do exactly that, and there would be no response if we followed your advice. Silence = complicity.

The problem is that DU is what it's owners make of it. If they want free speech and diverse ideas, then there is a cost. If they want a different effect, they will have to implement other policies.

[HalfManHalfBiscuit]

63. Kerry is certainly looking more electable than Dean

A good sign of this is Kerry's lock on the nomination. IMHO, getting the Democratic nomination is a strong step towards winning the presidency.

[sangh0]

65. Hey!

It's possible

:shrug:

[littlejoe]

81. Sounds like you all need a lifetime supply of barf bags.

[AmyStrange]

87. Interesting that there are more Kerry Supporters here slamming...

Dean Supporters, then there were Dean Supporters slamming Kerry supporters in BLM's thread. Makes one wonder why Kerry Supporters are bitchin' and whining so much about being slammed when (if this thread and BLM's thread is any indication) Kerry supporters are doing more of the slamming all over the DU as compared to the Dean Supporters.

Kerry Supporters in this thread (not ALL Kerry Supporters) remind me of a big bad wrestler slapping around a little kitten and then crying like a little baby when the kitten fights back and makes one little scratch.

REMEMBER: Vote for Kerry in Nov or you'll be blamed if Kerry loses. That won't be the real reason, but that won't matter to those whom only know how to blame other people for their mistakes.

!!! GO KEERY !!!

and ((((HUGz)))) to all the Kerry Supporters and everyone else who don't stoop to such tactics,


Dave (AmyStrange.com) Ayotte
Please, regularly check the One Missing Person (is one person too many) searchable website for the latest (and archived) missing person news stories:

http://NEWS.OneMissingPerson.org/




Serious Serial Killer discussion:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SK-Cafe/

[slinkerwink]

88. hear! hear!

[Anwen]

90. *raises hand*

:hi:

[BinkieGirl]

91. Enough!

Enough with the infighting!

With friends like these we don't need the Republicans and that goes for ALL sides.

Stop baiting, stop responding. Just stop.

[Julien Sorel]

92. Somebody get me a waaambulance!

[AntiCoup2K4]

93. .

:kick:

[CoupdEtat2000]

97. I think its best to get past this

It's also not appropriate to hold Kerry responsible for Deans loss, or for thousands of voters in several states deciding on Kerry instead of Dean.

It seems to be a consistent choice, something you need to reconcile with.

[DaveSZ]

98. You guys

don't deserve to be called names.

You saved the soul of our party! :)

[CoupdEtat2000]

99. Thanks, I think!

I looked to Dean at one point. I'm just being realistic and saying it's time to move on.

I don't have a problem with Kerry, or a pathological addiction to Dean.

I have a pathological hatred for Bush.

[Hav]

100. ??

What's with that habit to kick old threads???

[Atlant]

101. There are alternatives to DU...

My money and my voice now goes to...

http://www.peopleforchange.net/