Dem Strategist: Using Political Judo against Swift Boat Liars for Bush

[Dem_Strategist]

DEFINITION:

"Judo, which is translated as the "gentle way", teaches the principle of flexibility in the application of technique. This is the flexible or efficient use of balance, leverage, and movement in the performance of Judo throws and other skills. Skill, technique and timing, rather than the use of brute strength, are the essential ingredients for success in Judo. For example, in Judo classes you may learn how to give way, rather than use force, to overcome a stronger opponent."

The attack was coming, we knew that. The equation is always the same with these types of smears: respond and publicize? Or ignore and risk leaving accusations to fester?

Solution in this case involved a well-timed response with a hoist-on-their-own-petard strategic focus. It seems to be working, as they are falling upon the sword of their lies.

Political Judo. Won't say much more.

[T Roosevelt]

1. Aren't there times when Political Karate is more appropriate?

You know, boot to the ass kind of response. Just seems to me (and many others) that a quick and hard strike can prove more beneficial.

[Dem_Strategist]

2. Yes. This was not one of those times

.

[T Roosevelt]

7. I realize the Swift Boat Liars were going to implode on their own

just hope not every lie put out by Bush is met passively. The judo way takes some time and presents opportunities for failure. For example, the IWR vote (still vague in people's minds), the 87B (which Kerry seemed to take a pass on by not clearly making the point - listen to Randi Rhodes on this one), and now there's the "sensitivity" and taxes below 200k riffs - they are not likely to implode, just sit there nagging...

[ibegurpard]

10. That is my concern as well.

A strategy has to be adaptable depending upon the situation.

[Dem_Strategist]

22. Each of these is handled differently

However, always keep in mind the media filter.

[shugah]

82. hi dem_strategist!

nice to see that the big boys take an interest in DU!

i'll be upfront - so you can just skip reading if you want ;-) - i will be voting for kerry, but i'm not a democrat. i'm a liberal. kerry is hardly left enough for me! call me a kucinich dem, if ya like ;-)

anyway - all that aside, and kerry getting my vote whether he wants it or needs it - i don't think you need to tell DU about "the media filter." i've seen you here in the GD campaign forum but have you checked LBN? DU kicks ass finding the real news. no day could possibly be complete for a liberal or progressive voter without (at minimum) a scan of DU LBN.

we already know about the media D_S. even knowing about it, i can still fill in the blanks on your "Kerry is______" thread.

you're not actually preaching to the choir here... it would be nice if your man could make us all "feel at home."

we already know about the media.

[Kahuna]

99. Jeez. I wonder what it would take for you guys to get tough..

it seems reasonable to me that you should nip this crap in the bud right now. Ask Al Gore.

[AngryAmish]

3. huh?

Some clarity for us dimwits, please.

[Julien Sorel]

13. Let the media handle it.

At least that's the impression I get. The charges are so outlandish, and so poorly grounded in facts, that the media have begun doing the Kerry campaign's work for it. Had the campaign dealt with the issues directly, then it risks becoming bogged down in defensive mode, plus, the fact that the "impartial" media are deflating the claims has more weight than if the campaign had done it. These guys are rabble rousers; eventually they will fall on their faces on their own.

[Carni]

26. Mathews handed O'Neill his behind last night.

O'Neill looked like a fool on Hardball (you could have knocked me down with a feather...Tweety actually pounced on him a few times)

[tandot]

34. Tweety was great yesterday. He exposed O'Neill for what he

really is: Someone who has a 30 year old grudge against Kerry because Kerry came back from Vietnam and opposed the war.

O'Neill found a couple of veterans like him who were willing to discredit everything Kerry did, even if that means to lie and sign a false affidavit.

[Carni]

51. I agree O'Neill REALLY looked bad

If the moron had a brain in his head he would have toned down his "shot a kid in the back" mantra...

I think he only said it about 20 times.

I was actually PLEASED with Matthews (That doesn't happen too often)

[Walt Starr]

4. Although the Smear boat Vets For Bush have infuriated me

I believe the Kerrry team's response has been well done.

I also think others who are unconnected can get the meme of "Smear Boat Vets for Bush" embedded into people's minds via word of mouth. Other such memes can be implanted into the general consciousness in much the same manner.

Bascially, I believe we can play the same game they play, only with more cunning and skill.

[Dem_Strategist]

20. You're right

.

[The Magistrate]

35. Indeed, Mr. Starr

And in our private spreading of the proper description of these liars, there is an excellent opportunity to spread as well the truth about the fraudulent "service" of the jackanapes squatting in the oval office during the same period: his resolve to escape combat at all costs, the political favoritism that allowed him to do so, the fact that he evaded much of even this limited service, and likelihood that he was dismissed from some of it over failing a drug test....

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[gasperc]

49. the ad, I believe has been on the internet since May or so

they have been looking for donors since and are now playing it in a few key markets

[hippiegranny]

76. I call them the "Not-So-Swiftboat...

Liars for Bush" to anyone I speak to regarding this issue. :)

[chiburb]

5. D_S, 1st a welcome and thanks, but now a question:

Josh Marshall said this:

I just saw a preview of a study that finds the Swift Boat ads quite effective among independents in raising doubts about John Kerry's war record. And that suggests that Karl Rove will want to send more money toward the group running the ad.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/

Do you have any idea what he's refering to? Or if he's wrong?

[Dem_Strategist]

19. Haven't read his post but I imagine he's referring to a Fabrizio poll

(Tony Fabrizio, Repub pollster)

[lancdem]

40. One of the DU posters

posted that poll. Do you consider it an outlier? Also, what do you make of the Gallup polls that are so pro-Bush? The one released today says Bush's approval rating is 51 percent and no president whose rating was 50 percent or above at this point has lost.

[Cha]

78. I can't believe that poll...no way bush is "51%"!

Consider who they're asking and how skewered it is.

[Norquist Nemesis]

6. After yesterday's appearances

it worked well! In the end, you can't please everyone. Right now they have to be looking at those swing voters and the Political Karate wouldn't be as appealing for them. Hurley barely had to say anything last night on Hardball and when he did, it was pointed and had McCain's "dishonest and dishonorable" sentiments each time. On Crossfire, Carville did such a great job I think even Novak was taken back. Try as he did to regain the upper hand, it wasn't working because he knew the points made completely discredited the guy.

[ibegurpard]

8. Fine.

Results are all that matter to me. If recent events succeed in putting this to rest (and it was NOT going away) then I will be satisfied.

[Sporadicus]

9. This Strategy Appears to Have Been Effective

I began my own campaign of discrediting the Swift Boat Veterans as soon as I became aware of their existence, citing John O'Neill's connections to Nixon's dirty tricks campaign and likely connection to Karl Rove's equivalent machine. In retrospect, it appears that all my flailing and cajoling went for nought. The Swift Boat Veterans still had their moment in the media spotlight.

The strategy you mention appears to be more effective, as one media pundit after another heaps scorn and derision on the group. And while Republicans including John McCain and * haven't said decisively that the Swift Boat Veterans are lying, it's implicit that they know it's nothing more than mudslinging.

I commend your judgment in this case, wishing I had spent more time and energy working in areas where I may have been more effective.

[Carni]

John O'Neill's law partner is also representing an Enron Defendant

Joseph Sutton is the Enron Exec...not sure if that is relevant to anything, but it certainly tells me it's more of the same old players.

[cynatnite]

11. I Gotta Agree

With the sword part all the way.

It just seemed like the press was doing all the discrediting the more it was brought up.

With every appearance I hear about, I make a point of emailing that program to make sure they know the facts and not the BS.

I am glad Kerry didn't publicly say anything. He's the presidential nominee and in my mind, these lies are beneath him and he shouldn't have to speak to them. Him doing so would elevate these jerks and the media's given them their voice along with the fact that they lied.


Besides, I believe the media would love to publicly rake these guys over the coals. We just gotta make sure that's what they do with every appearance made.

Cyn:)

[wildeyed]

12. O'Neil had a baaad day yesterday.

tee hee

[cynatnite]

15. Stupid Stupid Stupid

Isn't he a trial lawyer or something?

I find it amazing that he thought people would take him seriously.

Oh, and it was pure sweet justice to see him get what's coming to him. Now, he just needs sued for every last dime he's got.

Cyn:)

[democratreformed]

14. Do you feel like part of this particular move

is an attempt to do away with the 527s? That's the way it seems to me. The Repubs response to criticism of the ads is always to bring up the 527s and say they need to be stopped.

[Walt Starr]

16. It's too late to alter the campaign finance laws for this cycle

:evilgrin:

and, if we can take back at least the Senate, we can have the latering of the laws be fair!

[The Magistrate]

39. The Smear Boat Vets, Ma'am

Are not a 527, but an old style 501c organization. In fact, it hardly matters what is done; money will flow into politics like water to the sea....

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[democratreformed]

48. Thank you for that clarification, sir

I thought they were a 527.

[The Magistrate]

50. Thank You, Ma'am

My source is recollection of a report on the matter shown on the PBS News Hour. It is possible my recollection is in error; it sometimes is....

"On the whole, I'd rather be in Philadelphia."

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[Viking12]

64. Yes, they are a 527

From their (vile) website:

"Swift Boat Veterans for Truth is a tax exempt non-partisan public advocacy "527" organization that consists of and is limited to former military officers and enlisted men who served in Vietnam on U.S. Navy "Swift Boats" or in affiliated commands."

[The Magistrate]

71. Thank You For The Correction, Sir

"No fool like an old fool."

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[BlueEyedSon]

17. "The Media is the Enemy" has become my mantra....

thx.

PS: everyone see "outfoxed"....

[gollygee]

18. I'm glad he didn't respond too strongly

It would have given the lies an appearance of legitimacy. Some people would have thought that if the lies got him very upset, there must have been some truth in them.

[AirAmFan]

21. "Political Judo" seems the PERFECT official response from the Kerry campaign

Kerry HAS to take the high road and continue to be Presidential, and most everything he says should be focused on the PRESENT and FUTURE, not the past.

But the "Swift Boat Vets" smear did not come from the Kerry campaign's counterpart, the Bush campaign. It came from a 527 employing and funded by right-wing extremists.

We know you cannot say much about organizations outside Kerry's official campaign, but we still wonder, where are OUR 527s, and where is the DNC on the Bush campaign's refusal to denounce the "Swift Boat" smear campaign? Every day the media continues to give credibility and airtime to this nonsense, rather than to Dubya's phony military dress-up and Homeland Security photo-ops, gives Bob Perry his money's worth in voter misinformation and doubt.

IMO the DNC and OUR 527s need to strengthen their offensive against White House Homeland Security fear and jingoism, while the Kerry campaign stays on the high road.

[mzmolly]

36. I COULDN'T AGREE MORE.

If as you say, our surrogates are not more prepared in the future, were in for a media "Goring" again. I can't stomach that personally.

People want a fighter, and while this strategy of judo sounds good, eventually you can come out looking like a wimp.

We need a multifaceted plan of attack and defense. We need to be as coordinated as the Bushies are. For example, the Bushies 'SEND OUT TAKING POINTS' to the media and their surrogates daily, WE MUST at the very least, DO THE SAME.

[SangamonTaylor]

46. Sending out talking points is what the Media Corps does....join up!

[mzmolly]

47. I will, thanks!

:hi:

[Blue_Roses]

23. After hearing John O'Neill lie through his

teeth, I saw the tide turn. What I don't get, is how can they say these obvious lies and get away with it. When O'Neill said he voted for Gore in 2000, but yet he has not made one donation to ANY Democratic candidacy, but instead to republican campaigns, his motives became crystal clear. I wish Chris would have had this info in front of him at the time.

[T Roosevelt]

24. How best to handle this perfect opportunity?

Political Judo is one thing in defense, but quite another in attack. Two items have found themselves revealed today that I believe tie together into a great strike opportunity. The first is from the CBO:


Bush Tax Cuts Heavily Favor Rich, CBO Says -Reports
Fri Aug 13, 3:02 AM ET

NEW YORK (Reuters) - President Bush (news - web sites)'s tax cuts have transferred the federal tax burden from the richest Americans to middle-class families, with one-third of them benefiting people with the top 1 percent of income, according to a government report cited in newspapers on Friday.

<snip>

The report said the top 1 percent, with incomes averaging $1.2 million per year, will receive an average $78,460 tax cut this year, and have seen their share of the total tax burden fall roughly 2 percentage points to 20.1 percent, according to The New York Times.

In contrast, households in the middle 20 percent, with incomes averaging $57,000 per year, will receive an average cut of only $1,090, the newspaper said, citing the CBO report.

Taxpayers whose incomes range from $51,500 to around $75,600, saw their share of federal tax payments increase, according to CBO figures cited by The Washington Post.

more



The second is from Paul Krugman:


Bush's Own Goal
By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: August 13, 2004

A new Bush campaign ad pushes the theme of an "ownership society," and concludes with President Bush declaring, "I understand if you own something, you have a vital stake in the future of America."

<snip>

The Bush tax cuts have, of course, heavily favored the very, very well off. But they have also, more specifically, favored unearned income over earned income - or, if you prefer, investment returns over wages. Last year Daniel Altman pointed out in The New York Times that Mr. Bush's proposals, if fully adopted, "could eliminate almost all taxes on investment income and wealth for almost all Americans." Mr. Bush hasn't yet gotten all he wants, but he has taken a large step toward a system in which only labor income is taxed.

The political problem with a policy favoring investment returns over wages is that a vast majority of Americans derive their income primarily from wages, and that the bulk of investment income goes to a small elite. How, then, can such a policy be sold? By promising that everyone can join the elite.

more

[Carni]

25. Political strategist...A thought regarding Iraq coverage

I have noticed that over the last few weeks the coverage by the cable news media of Iraq has been limited.

A couple times a day we hear there was a large explosion yada yada but that's about it.

I have also noticed that bush's numbers seem to have leveled off and it strikes me, that this occurred when the Iraq coverage died down.

I think it would be a legit request to hammer on the media to provide more Iraq coverage... or is the leveling out of bush's numbers not actually tied to the fact that the public seems to have forgotten about Iraq?

Any thoughts on this?

[lunarboy13]

27. For me, I noticed two very important turning points

In the Swift Boat story...


First, John O'Neill looked like a partisan buffoon with no evidence to back up the malicious statements he has made. He was ripped apart by Carville on Crossfire and was made to look completely biased and untruthful on Hardball by Chris Matthews. His whole story virtually fell apart on national television.

And then, later in the night, President George Bush and First Lady Laura Bush, were interviewed on Larry King Live. King is not a hardball-type reporter, so he was lofting softballs all night. But one in particular got my attention. When he asked if he "condemns the Swift Boat ads", Bush repeated the Republican mantra (which McCain apparently never memorized) that ALL the 527 ads should be taken off the airwaves. King said that was fine, but did he condemn the ads....Bush couldn't say it. He couldn't separate the horrendous lies in the ad itself from his party's stance on 527s as a whole.

If there were any undecideds who watched Crossfire and/or Hardball, they came away with a pretty good idea about who the Swift Boaters are and how untruthful they have been. Bush had a chance to clear the air by condemning the ads, but he chose not to. This can have the effect of tacitly connecting Bush to the ads in the minds of some people...In Bush's own words, you're either with us or against us. So far, he doesn't seem to be against the Swift Boaters.

[tandot]

37. Hi lunarboy13

:loveya:


Wouldn't it be good if Democrats on TV would mention the "SwiftVets for Bush" and "Republican Smear Campaign" in the same sentence, over and over again, until it sticks? John O'Neill is supported by a Republican who is a big donor to Bush and the GOP. And isn't that Texas Republican somehow connected to Rove?

[ItsThePeopleStupid]

98. you said what I wanted to say but so much better

I especially like " Bush had a chance to clear the air by condemning the ads, but he chose not to."

I'm going to hang this on * every chance I get.
McCain: "dishonest and dishonorable"
Bush: refuses to condemn dishonest, dishonorable ads. Bush fights dirty.

on edit: it seems to me that if * did condemn the ads, he would further discredit them and they would lose whatever effectiveness they have. If he doesn't, then he aligns himself with the tactics of a bunch of liars. lose/lose.

[John_H]

28. Can you imagine what Carville, et. al would have done to these guys?.

Shouldn't Kerry point out the irony of A guy who might have protected Texas airspace from North Vietnamese invasion, using political hacks to attack legitimnate heroes?

I mean, now it's too late because you'd just be extending the play these guys get.

[Walt Starr]

29. Problem is, this isn't 1992

Political strategies must be tailored to the political climate. Carville's 'in your face' style was appropriate for 1992. It would not play in 2004.

[Jack Rabbit]

30. I'm sure this kind "judo" (good term) will be used much in the campaign

The counter to the Swift Boat Liars has been very effective. O'Neill is licking the egg off his face today.

[Sparkly]

31. Nothing was going to keep these liars off all the TV shows

but it seems their "tour of doody" must be over now. They did Crossfire, they did Hardball, they did all they can do, and it's over, it seems to me.

I didn't see all the appearances, but the veterans the Kerry campaign had out there responding were the best antidote. The gravitas of Admiral Crowe and the outrage of John Hurley carried weight when they pointed out the key points: that this book is a Republican smear campaign, funded by notorious rightwingers, based on accusations by people who wrote and signed documents 35 years ago saying the opposite of what they're saying now, with contributions of people who weren't on Kerry's boat and did not treat Kerry's wounds.

The hint of "where was Bush" largely loomed in the background of the interviews (except when Matthews brought it out and smacked O'Neill with it), but what I missed was a wider point that this is not only despicable politics, it's also a slap in the face to ALL veterans and even the soldiers active today. If the Navy handed out medals willy-nilly without merit, none of them mean anything -- all are subject to question. That smears thousands of soldiers, and I wish more had been made of that point.

[The Magistrate]

41. That Is An Excellent Point, Ma'am

These claims discredit every veteran who received a decoration for combat valor. They also impugn every commaning officer who signed off on a citation, and the whole command structure of every service. That is one hell of a way to support the troops, eh?

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[snippy]

32. We need to accuse Bush of being two-faced on this by trying to have it

both ways. He praises Kerry's service but refuses to criticize or even question those who besmirch that service. I think such an accusation should be started by someone in the media.

[mzmolly]

33. Kerry said in the primaries "you're either on offense or defense"

and I say it's time to go on the offensive.

We've got ample dish against Bush, it's time to pull it out and start firing our own shots.

[mzmolly]

38. Adding, where's the book about the Bush abortion. Where's the media leak?

Why can't we start sending out this story to the media AGAIN:

George W. Bush "Involved"
in an Illegal Abortion??

On CNN's Crossfire on October 20, 2000, Larry Flynt exploded a bombshell: that he has evidence that George W. Bush was "involved in an abortion in Texas" in the early 1970's - when abortions were still illegal.

Here are the details, as reported by Bartcop:

In the winter of 1971 George W. Bush was dating a woman named Robin Lowman (now Robin Garner). Miss Lowman became pregnant by Smirk and he arranged for her to have an abortion - which in the great state of Texas in 1971 was very illegal! Not to mention that George W. is running as a pro-life candidate for the presidency.
The unnamed source of this story, was a friend of Robin Lowman's and the girlfriend of the man who arranged the abortion. His name is Robert Carl Chandler. Chandler is a Bush friend and supporter from way back and he made the arrangements for Miss Lowman's abortion at the Twelve Oaks Hospital in Houston, TX (now the Bayou City Medical Center). The source overheard the call by Mr. Chandler to arrange the abortion and the source visited Robin Lowman at the Twelve Oaks Hospital after the procedure.

The source meanwhile, is afraid of coming forward, saying that she was threatened by Chandler and another Bush friend and supporter named Jim Bath. Bath has longstanding intelligence connections, and played a role in the BCCI scandal. Robin Lowman (now Garner) is married to Jerry Lee Garner who is an FBI agent.

So, that's the story: an illegal back room abortion arranged by the Republican party Presidential candidate who is running on a pro-life ticket.

Course as you can see it's ok to discredit Kerry, but it's not ok to discredit Bush?

The CNN Coverup

Amazingly, CNN scrubbed its own story!!!!

This has all the markings of a cover-up by CNN - just like the cover-ups of Bush's many other scandals, from going AWOL, to using illegal drugs, to corruption in Texas government, to lying under oath.

http://www.democrats.com/display.cfm?id=159\

Why in the hell do the Dems insist on playing nice? Screw that. It's time to play 'hawdbawl'... We've got the ammo, it's time to load it.

[Dems Will Win]

42. Dem Strategist, need to talk about Dem Strategy on another thread

can you click here and reply to my NO-DRAFT Plan for JK and for a Kerry Times newspaper delivered to Undecideds in swing states. (I was hired by the Dean campaign to create the Dean Times, which I can send you on PDFs)

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x613558

Thanks!

Dems Will Win

[quaoar]

43. Dem Strategist:

You have to understand that many Democrats are just sick and tired of the party and its candidates lying down and taking it from the GOP attack machine like a bunch of whipped puppies, year after year -- the GOP has made us look like fools over and over because we let them.

Hence the popularity of Howard Dean, a fire-breather. That's what we wanted -- a fire-breather. Someone who would fight back.

When a gang of thugs has you on the ground, your mind is not mulling the most effective judo move. You're looking for the nearest blunt instrument.

Yes, a judo move is probably the most effective strategy for the Swift Boat Liars. But every once in a while, y'all should throw some red meat into the water for the pack of great white sharks that we have become. We'd feel a whole lot better. LOL

[mzmolly]

44. Indeed.

:hi:

[Joanne98]

45. The damage is already done

the book is going to the best sellers list and the public has such a short attention span they won't know it's been debunked. Kerry needs to send some aids to wander around Wal Mart Stores. the public is dumbed down, tired, depressed and out-to-lunch. they don't bother with the details anymore. you have to use simple language like LIARS. It's short and easy to understand. Tweety didn't do that. they sucessfully planted the seed of doubt, which is all they needed to do. it will now take months for activists to remove the 'implant' from the brains of the public. the press won't help because they won't be tough enough or clear enough. we need someone with a megaphone to yell liar for a week and we don't have that. Kerry may be playing Judo but the people sees weak. Kerry didn't forcefully defend himself which equals, "He must have something to hide". which leads to, "Kerry can't fight back when he's attacked by Americans, how can he protect us from terrorists?" IT'S NOT SAFE. That's what they're doing. the LIE isn't as important as the reaction to the lie.
that's just my opinion anyway. playing defense, even judo, isn't going to work in a post 9/11 period.

[lancdem]

53. Being a best seller doesn't really mean anything

All those RW Clinton-trashing books sold, too. Freepers were going to buy it no matter how Kerry handled the charges.

[Joanne98]

60. Yeah I know but I was surprised that it got that far.

they haven't had a best seller for a while. In fact O'Reilly is the only author on the right that doesn't have a dagger(bulk sales) next to his name. If when the NYT best seller list comes out this weekend, O'Neill's book has a dagger, then I'll feel alot better.

[WVhill]

96. Agreed. Worse, there's more to come.

I hope we have a few more books coming out between now and the election. I'm concerned that the Vietnam era stuff is just getting ramped up. Along with that, the NRA hasn't gotten into the fray yet. And I don't think we've seen the other fringe groups do their thing.

[John_H]

52. I love the judo spin--I'm going to use it the next time I've been

risk averse, late, and ineffectual: "Hey, you don't get it. That was Judo. The Gentle Way, baby."

I'd bet a hundred bucks Rove calculated that the dems would use a little political judo on the swift boat guys instead of taking the opportunity to immediately turn it around on chimp, that the media would take care of the publicity even if Kerry didn't immediately respond, and probably that Kerry spokespeople would actually respond to the content of the ad.

Sadly, he was right across the board.

Should we expect more judo vis a vis "sensitivity," the 9-11 convention, the unsourced pre-election terra scare stories, flip flopping, debates, etc? Will Dem surrogates continue to Gentle Way Paula, Chris, Timmy, Judy, and Joey?

If so, I bet you've got a lock on the silver medal.

[Julien Sorel]

54. Yes, the correct thing to do is to respond to every single

attack, no matter how outlandish, with a press release, an ad campaign, and John Kerry himself calling his detractors liars. Anything less is bowing down to the smear machine. Don't focus on getting out a positive message, don't lay out an agenda telling people what you can do for them, simply defend, defend, defend your way to the "gold medal."

[John_H]

57. No. You're right. You can't do both. If you are being positve

your opponent should be able to attack w/ impunity. "Cause, after all, Team Kerry are smart kids!

[Julien Sorel]

67. Apparently not nearly as smart as you are.

Since you seem to know how the campaign can, oh, what was your phrase in another thread? Let me look it up. Here:

Folks around here also know a good old fashioned ass kicking when we see one, that it's the job of the campaign and the DNC to get the message out through (or around) a hostile filter, that there ware numerous ways to do it, and that it isn't getting done.


There are,it seems, "numerous ways" to get "the message" out through the filter, but you don't point out a single one of them. I suppose it's so incredibly obvious you don't think it needs to be said -- but those idiots in the Kerry campaign, and those buffoons at the DNC, are either too lazy or too dumb to figure them out. So why don't you just spill the beans? Overwhelm us with your knowledge. Tell us one, just one, of these "numerous ways" that the Kerry campaign and the DNC are too dumb to find on their own. Hell, you could become a message board hero, the guy who saved the Kerry campaign, instead of some guy who sits behind his monitor yelling at people for being stupid and incompetent.

[John_H]

92. Nice catch--lack of examples intended.

I love it--message board hero. That's me. And I do love to tweak the arrogant, especially the arrogant who actually do think they're a cut above us poll watching rubes, brainwise.

First, as the mysterious DemStrategist knows if he's "the real deal," the Kerry campaign understands exactly what I'm needling them about. They simply reject the approach that I--and a long and growing list of others--advocate. Why? You can ask them, but since I actually know a few of the folks making calls over there, I'll posit the guess that it has more than a little to do with a combination of playing the status quo, being twenty-four or so years old, and not wanting to be the person who makes an mistake of the falling-out-of-favor variety.

Second, I'm not in the habit of assisting careers other than my own. If DemStrategist wants my specific thoughts on ways to improve the campaign's surrogate operation, I'd be more than happy to help. He can PM me for my number and give me a call.

Even though there seems to be a rash of resume slinging here at DU, I don't feel the need to reveal myself other than to say that, prior to selling myself to the man through running the PR shop at a company you've heard of, I too, have been a real live DemStrategist--at multiple cogs, some even slightly visible, in the big party wheel.

But why listen to me? There are dozens of people far smarter and more well known than me who have semi-privately, even publicly expressed opinions nearly identical to mine. And that circle seems to be getting wider every day.

So, with your permission, I'll keep venting here at DU, since along with some first rate link sleuthing, Doug K. level research, and general good-idea thinking, that's what DU's for.

[Julien Sorel]

93. I think you said it best:

But why listen to me?


All criticism, no solutions: no reason at all to listen to you.

[Chomskyite]

55. Yeah, falling back on his 50 point approval rating petard!

Anymore weeks like this and Kerry will make Dukakis look like a strategic genius.

[59millionmorons]

61. Oh please

The only poll in the planet that has Bush at 50% or beating Kerry is Gallup. The same Gallup that had Bush leading Gore by 13 points three weeks before the election. You are a little to gullible.

[TruthIsAll]

73. TANKING BUSH JOB APPROVAL AT 46.25%; IGNORE CNN BUSHIT!

How often must I repeat this. 

CNN/GALLUP poll numbers are not only outliers; they are out
and out LIARS!

BUSH JOB APPROVAL													
Data source: PollingReport.com    													
													
2004	Avg	Nwk	Fox	CNN	Pew	Harris	CBS	ABC	Time	NBC	AP	Zogby	Qpac
Jan	54.50	50	58	60	56	na	50	58	54	54	56	49	53
Feb	49.67	48	48	51	48	51	50	50	54	na	47	na	48
Mar	48.75	48	48	49	46	na	51	50	na	50	48	na	49
Apr	48.55	49	50	52	48	48	46	51	49	na	48	47	46
May	45.18	42	48	47	44	na	41	47	46	47	48	42	45
June	47.00	na	48	49	48	50	42	47	na	45	48	46	na
July	47.82	48	47	47	46	na	45	50	50	48	50	49	46
Aug	46.25	45	44	51	46	na	44	47	na	na	49	44	na

[Carni]

62. Herr bush was bound to get a bounce

After the swift boat BS!

Considering that was a gallup poll, and taking into account that the public has just been treated to two weeks of Rove's tricks via the swift boat liars... I don't find the poll that alarming.

(Of course I also don't know what the hell I am talking about so take my opinion for what it's worth!)

[lancdem]

69. Actually, the horse-race numbers in the Gallup poll

are basically the same as right after the convention, which was before anyone heard of the Swift Boat Liars.

[molly]

72. Did he get a bounce for his "Sophie's Choice" ad

I found it maudlin and repulsive.

[Elidor]

56. Jeet Kune Do

I would like to hear the Kerry campaign say bluntly that the president hides behind liars and con men to spread lies about his opponent. Why has Bush not condemned the attacks? Etcetera. Bush needs to be directly associated with the people spreading filth on his behalf. The Swifties are already being discredited, but their discredit should accrue more to Bush. For too many busy people, the Swifties legacy will be vague doubts about Kerry's service. I would rather it be an enduring image of Bush, who was too scared to volunteer for Vietnam, hiding behind surrogates and toadies to sling mud.

[kentuck]

58. Food for thought re: Repub polls ?

Don't you think it is to the Repubs advantage to have polls showing their guy ahead or very close, even if he is dropping like a rock? They are in danger of having their supporters discouraged and they need to give them encouragement thru their polling??

[Domitan]

59. This former Democratic strategist disagrees

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/comment/story/0,14259,1282583,00.html

He insists that Kerry will have to fight fire with fire, and not take the high road when combating negative advertising.

[flpoljunkie]

63. On the one hand I find your posts condescending, but I am pleased to see

the Kerry campaign seems to be hitting back more quickly, i.e., the Cheney "sensitivity" smear crap, something which makes Kerry supporters quite pleased. CNN was reading the Kerry campaign response right after they showed the Cheney clips and they even updated the Kerry campaign response as they fine tuned their reponse.

This is progress. If your intervention here can help to dampen the ubquitousness of those who are constantly looking for ways to whine about Kerry, that would also be progress and much appreciated.

[PurityOfEssence]

65. Follow the money, and when they're defeated, attack them personally

Your points about chess are fine, but even a chess player knows when to risk his Queen.

Once these allegations have been discredited, the dangerous thing I see is for us to consider that a victory and move on. This should be turned into an assault to ferret out the party functionaries. O'Neill can feign impartiality all he wants and claim that he just rose to the occasion now since it was a question of Kerry becoming CIC, but he should be flatly confronted about his money sources. Who is this Perry? What other axes are being ground here? Even if "honorable", once the nefarious money boys glomb on, isn't he dancing to their tune now?

It should be discredited thoroughly and then used as an example of how deeply unscrupulous the right is. It also justifies asking all of the "outraged" boaters to have to defend Junior's chickenshittedness in the face of having to go overseas. (It's a handy time to point out that Junior specifically did not offer himself for overseas duty.)

It's not enough to "win", this must be used as an excuse to probe the sick and vicious minds of the monarchists.

The whole incident should be held up as a bloody shirt that illustrates the deep insincerity and moral ugliness that would encourage people to misrepresent their motives to disgrace a hero for personal gain. For shame.

[GumboYaYa]

66. I would not be so self-congratulatory.

The response was a little slow and took some time to break through the media. As a result it seems that the basic premise of the ads did stick with some undecided voters. More importantly, the campaign missed a golden opportunity to begin to plant the pre-convention theme that Bush has nothing to run on but attacks and wacky ideas. You have the trip to Mars and the National Sales tax as two excellent examples of his wacky ideas. The American people want real ideas and not just attack ads. Bush is the one who is out of touch with the American people.

The campaign did a decent job of playing defense on this one, but they should not be simply reacting all the time. What about playing offense occasionally? Bush is down; it is time to start kicking him.

Also, this condescending talk about judo and chess is not the way to entice people to give their time, money and effort to help. Try a little humility, it will go a long way.

[quaoar]

68. The judo analogy

Makes perfect sense from a strategic point of view. And it will probably work in the long run.

But judo isn't why the party is where it is today. Judo isn't what is driving people to see F911 or compelling people who have never voted to register. Judo isn't going to bring out record turnout in November.

It wasn't an appreciation of judo that has funneled hundreds of millions of dollars into the Kerry campaign, the DNC and MoveOn.

It was a raw, seething hatred of everything that Bush stands for -- hatred of the eight-year campaign to destroy Clinton, hatred of Limbaugh and Hannity and the hyenas at Fox.

Judo may just work on the Swift Boat Slanderers, but it won't drive the base to the polls and it won't help us win back Congress.

[molly]

70. Going for the "kill" is timing & brilliant strategy -

the Kerry campaign has it. Timing is everything. I've been without my computer for over a week now, so I've probably missed some of these discussions. I have been a Kerry fan from the beginning.

I did see Chris Matthews level O'Neill last nite - O'Neill looked like a wet cold puppy at the end of the show.

Two of the group are from Delaware - I'm so embarrassed!

2 Del. residents in ad attacking Kerry

http://www.delawareonline.com/newsjournal/local/2004/08/072delresidentsin.html

snip...

"Elder retired from Christiana Bank two years ago and is setting up a new bank in Delaware called Delaware Sterling Bank. Elder said he did not have any first-hand knowledge of misstatements by Kerry about his service, improper actions in Vietnam or problems with the medals Kerry received. "I have knowledge in talking to boat captains that were there," he said.

Elder refused to identify his political party or say if he supports President Bush. "This has nothing to do with any partisan effort. This is a bunch of ex-military Navy men," he said. Elder said he and others remained silent for 35 years because Kerry previously had only sought "local" elected offices in Massachusetts. That changed when Kerry, a U.S. senator, decided to run for president, he said."

snip....

The Associated Press reported one of the largest donors to the group is Robert J. Perry, a Houston homebuilder who has donated to Bush's re-election campaign and gave $3.8 million to Texas Republicans in 2000.

[TheRovingGourmet]

74. I know what you are saying and know that this can be useful

advice but can't we just get some straight answers from Kerry himself the next time he is on a talk show? For example, Boortz had a guy on his show prattling about being the only MD where Kerry served, that the MD on his medical report is actually "hm1" for hospital mate first class, the injury was minor, and that the records for the second and third purple hearts are sealed. Can Kerry just respond to this? Just a simple "here's the deal on that" will be enough.

These accusations do fester. If you wait days to refute them, they are such old news that people won't care that it was a lie to begin with, but the "residue" of the statement will stay with them. If each lie is followed by another lie, your rebuttal will be lost in the noise anyway.

While I'm at it, can we hear about something else besides Vietnam? I know a lot of vets from that "police action" and they have made their peace with those that found a way to not attend and have put the war behind them. It is OLD news. Can we hear Kerry talk about how his support of XYZ bill backs up his Presidential promise of supporting what XYZ bill addresses? As an example, Kerry talks about stopping the outflow of jobs. How? As this has gone on for years and years, what has he done as a Senator to try and stop this?

This is largely a regional thing, but can we hear some speeches that actually have some substance? Hollow statements sound nice but at least some detail would be appreciated. I know most people probably don't mind the "pep talk" type of speeches but can at least a small bone be thrown to the rest of us? For example, the statement "I have always been a supporter of education; education is good" might sound nice, but how the hell does it relate to anything? For all questions asked, please just answer them, not prate for an hour or two.

When errors of fact are pointed out on the Kerry website, could the page be changed instead of the notification just getting ignored? When government information and government sources are sent to back up an error report, the person who sent it to you should not be treated poorly. Then again, if the "error" is there for political reasons, just say so.

Well, this was more than I cared to say but I said it anyway, shortening my time available to enjoy this wonderful weather we are having. I am not a highly paid political consultant, so I am sure that I know nothing at all. If I sound bitter that is because I am.

[KittyWampus]

75. Carville & Matthews Effectively Dissected O'Neil

yesterday.

Kudos to Bartcop for the dirt on Corsi.

:toast:

[Hoping4Change]

77. Former Dem Stragegist argues that Kerry response inadequate.

Philip James in The Guardian argues the Kerry has to aggressively fight back against negative ads.


Two cardinal laws govern negative advertisements. One: they work. Two: the way to combat them is to answer fire with fire. The John Kerry campaign seems to be overlooking both at their peril.
When an attack ad from the Republican slime brigade Swiftboat Veterans for Truth - which claimed that Kerry's Vietnam heroism was a fraud - surfaced last week, the initial response of the Kerry campaign team was to ignore it.


snip


So the initial decision not to respond was plain wrong. Now that Kerry has woken up to the potential damage of this smear campaign, his response so far - to use free news media - has been inadequate and, to some extent, self-defeating.


The news media inevitably frames allegations, irrespective of their merit, in the terms of a legitimate debate...So baseless charges get elevated to a level allowing the viewer to make his or her own judgement.



http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselections2004/comment/story...

[Name removed]

79. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Sparkly]

80. Very funny.

Buh-bye.

[WI_DEM]

81. wow

deep.

[Selwynn]

83. How'd that tactic work for you with Gore... oh but Clinton fought back...

...and he won.

Interesting.

[Rageneau]

84. Put Down the Political Judo and Pick Up the Political Nunchucks

Or the political shotgun, or the political stink bomb. To hell with the "gentle way." That kind of thinking has screwed us for decades. You think we can depend on the likes of Chris Matthews to defend our candidates from relentless republican lies?

Kerry needs to fight back -- both to keep his reputation clear as well as to show that he won't be pushed around. Voters HATE wimps who won't fight back.

On our part, this fighting can be done with the finesse of Judo, but on their part it ought to hurt like Kung Fu. For example, in the case of these Swift Boat liars, all Kerry has to do is point out that even if all the lies they are telling about him were true, he would STILL be a better, more qualified choice for Commander-in-Chief than Bush.

Kerry could concede that even if his VN service WAS less than glorious than originally reported, at least he was THERE. He showed up for duty in a combat zone. His wounds may not have been horrible ones, but they WERE wounds suffered in combat. By those indisputable facts alone, he is superior to Bush. Kerry can PROVE that he was in Viet Nam. Bush can't even prove that he was in Alabama.

IOW, Kerry doesn't have to be positioned as a hero to beat Bush. He merely needs to be positioned as someone who did his duty running against someone who didn't. That way, no matter whether people believe the Swifties or not, they'll still have to concede that Kerry is the better candidate militarily.

It is not enough to merely deflect their attacks; we must strike them as they go by.

[shivaji]

85. I am unable to find "Unfit for Command" anywhere........

I searched all book stores in Portland, OR and can't
find it anywhere. Is it even out yet or is it a sellout?

It is important for me to learn what the enemy is thinking.

[eridani]

86. There may be a reason for that

Regnery has stopped promoting it.

http://www.zeppscommentaries.com/2004/sunk.htm

Not only has this smear attempt backfired and made all the right people look stupid and ridiculous, but if Putsch doesn’t condemn it in strong terms, he will lose a lot of military votes, and it almost certainly will ruin any hope he has of winning this election. It may put him so far behind he won’t even be able to steal it.

Others on the right wing may have already realized this. When researching for material about Corsi and his book, I went to Regnery’s Press website. I found no mention of the book anywhere on the site, which is a very strange omission for a publisher to make regarding a book where all the other promotions, including TV ads and interviews on Faux, are in full swing.

But then, this isn’t the first time Regnery Press has engaged in the Stalinesque habit of making books and authors "unhappen." You can search in vain for their all-time best selling author, the man who wrote three of their top five best sellers: David Brock.

That Regnery has dropped the promotion is the best evidence yet that this is a smear job that backfired. My prediction: if you hear anything more about the Swift Boat Veterans, it won’t be from the GOP and their vast right wing echo chamber.

[Name removed]

87. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[cidliz2004]

88. Lies repeated too many times to soundbite possible voters

may be "formally" adopted as truth, before the "real truth" comes out and by that time it is dismissed.

Flip Flop Flip Flop ring a bell?

[unfrigginreal]

89. It seems to be working?

I hope you're right. I've yet to see any evidence of that. Hell they're getting ready to run a second ad.
-----------

Anti-Kerry group sees rise in donations after airing ads

snip

Democrats have said the group is nothing but a Republican hit squad determined to besmirch their candidate.

Swift Boat Veterans for Truth is registered with the Federal Election Commission as a so-called 527 organization, not affiliated with any party. It got off the ground with a $100,000 donation from Texas homebuilder Bob J. Perry, a prominent Republican donor.

Roy F. Hoffman, a retired admiral and chairman of Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, said the first TV ad, which ran for one week in Ohio, Wisconsin and West Virginia at a cost of $550,000, got so much national news attention that it generated an additional $400,000 from 8,000 donors around the country.

"We are putting together the second ad," said Hoffman, 78, of Richmond, Va. As a Navy captain in 1968 and 1969, Hoffman commanded a unit of 1,650 sailors that included Kerry as a lieutenant.

http://www.charlotte.com/mld/charlotte/news/special_packages/election2004/9396133.htm?ERIGHTS=4239379272662591348charlotte::[e-mail]&KRD_RM=6mmtsvsttutqvpmtsmmmmmmmmn|juanita|N

[incapsulated]

90. "Political Judo".

"Won't say much more."

Well, what more needs to be said? You're obviously quite impressed with yourself and the little nuggets of wisdom and "strategy" you are dropping about this forum. Do you wear Matrix glasses when you post to feel supercool?

God help us.

[Raya]

91. God help us all.

[ColdWarZoomie]

94. I'm Concerned

The "political judo" strategy better be new, because it sure as hell hasn't been working the last few years against the right wing propaganda public address system cranked up to "11."

Can anyone here imagine James Carville saying we should not attack IMMEDIATELY but rather stand back and come up with some intricate judo move while they're sucker-punching us?

I live in Maryland where neither side is advertising and I don't have cable TV, so I cannot judge the impact of this thing or how badly they've been discredited. But I do not feel good from what I'm reading.

[deutsey]

95. Perhaps "political judo" is working in this instance.

Perhaps. However, it seems to me that the Dem strategy in general is "political judo" while the Fascist/GOP strategy is blitzkreig.

Do you think an army of judo experts would have fought off the German lightning war? It's like the old observation that the Dems are gearing up for a tough game of hockey while the Fascists are waiting for them out on the rink in machine gun nests.

[rocktivity]

97. The Kerry response team did a good job, BUT

if Kerry had taken the lead with a direct, immediate and unspinnable response, it would have been a great job: "This is nothing but a desparate, politically orchestrated attempt to divert attention away from the problems with Mr. Bush's own military record."

Just because Kerry wants to stay positive doesn't mean he should "yield" to such attacks, or depend on the response team to handle them. There's a difference between responding negatively and responding factually.

:headbang:
rocknation

P.S. Ever heard of Air Amercia Radio? They're the only friends you have in the mainstream media right now. Why isn't someone from the Kerry camp calling them EVERY DAY????