Where The Dems Have Blown It...

[SeekingTruth]

For almost four years I have sat back and continually watched where the Dems have blown opportunities to move forward. Much of it has to do with guiding thought and opinion.

For example, we have all known from 9/12/01 that the Bush Administration would exploit the attacks of 9/11. We have KNOWN it. And what have we done? Nothing. For the past few years we should have been quietly addressing that Bush would exploit this AMERICAN, not Republican, tragedy, but we have failed to do so. We should have been so effective at this that every time he did something even close to exploitation, the American people would have called him on it. But our strategists failed to lay this foundation.

Next, here is a link to an article of a credible source that shows anywhere from 40-42 percent of the American people believe that Saddam Hussein was directly linked to 9/11. The article points out that this is the SAME amount of people who believe he didn't.

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/columns/pressingissues_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000628367

My point is that we have failed to clear up this misinformation fabricated by the Bush Administration.

Democrats continue to fail to understand how language and the media works. Take this CBS/Memo story for an example. Enough misinformation has been thrown out there that no matter what happens, if the documents were shown to be accurate and original, it would not matter. The media has allowed enough static to enter into this story because those in the media did not do their job right. And this is how the media works. And the damn Dems are too frigging worried about nuance, being right and being the most intellectual person around.

We have got to learn how to eat red meat, but more importantly, to damn well enjoy it!!

[BillZBubb]

1. I agree with this post

Democrats are way too cautious (trying to be right on the facts) when dealing with the media. The modern media is not interested in facts. They are interested in controversy. That's what the public watches.

We should take the facts and extrapolate them to the worst possible interpretation of the Repugs every time on every issue. Make the Repugs try to explain away our interpretation.

Maybe one day we'll learn the game.

[deutsey]

2. The Democrats and the Left need to learn how to frame the debate

Check out stuff that George Lakoff has written about this.

[barb162]

18. we better learn it in the next few days.

[mmonk]

3. Yes

and one of the reasons I was so mad at the House Dems yesterday concerning the 9/11 resolution. To me, the uninformed public is a great crisis facing this nation.

[Name removed]

4. Deleted message

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[mmonk]

5. wow

[blondeatlast]

7. Not the prevailing opinion here. Thoughtful debate among our supporters

is welcome.

[jonnyblitz]

9. a bit touchy are we?

this is worth discussing and sure as hell beats DENIAL.

[jab105]

6. ST, totally agree...it's all about accountability...

been lengthy on it on this thread, this is honestly the only thing that will swing those swing voters...there was never a question that Kerry was tough enough to serve...the question should ALWAYS have been When are we going to hold George Bush accountable for what happened on his watch?

He's never been held acocuntable for anything...its time we start...

Most important:

In mid 2001, Bush said that being president was a 24/7 job. 24 days a month, 7 months a year. Two months later was 9/11. We need to hold the president accountable for thinking that being president was a PART-TIME job!!!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x789798

[deutsey]

8. "being right and the being the most intellectual person around"?

There are a lot of legitimate complaints against the Democrats, but this is a pretty lame and bizarre thing to say.

And regarding failing to clear up the multitude of misinformation and lies the Busheviks have spewed onto the American consciousness: it's hard for anyone left of Hitler in this country to receive significant airtime on corporate-owned media in this country.

Surely in your four years watching all this, you have observed this.

[mmonk]

10. So the plan

would be to ignore these issues of grave concern? Anathema to a real patriot's concern about this.

[deutsey]

16. If that's what you want to do.

I'm just saying I'm one of the Democrats' harshest critics (I no longer count myself as a Democrat, in fact...I'm a progressive independent) and them wanting to be right (as in correct, I assume) and intellectual are low on my list.

Now, if the poster means being right in the political sense, then I agree. The Dems have been trying to veer too far to the right and too corporatist for way too long.

I could list many other more important critiques I have, but that's not the point of this post.

[SeekingTruth]

11. "being right and the most intellectual".....

What I mean by this is that we liberals are arrogant and elitist at times. Kerry is the epitome of this at times. It's like we continually say, "Nah, nah, nah. I'm smarter that you are. I'm smarter than you are." The point is, in many cases we may be, but recall that smartass kid from school that was right all the time and rubbed our faces in it - sure, he or she was right a lot, but no one liked him or her. And this is how we act too often (maybe it is our way of getting even).

And let's be honest here and face our difficulties head on - yes, it has been very hard to break through all of the lies of the Bushies. I bang my head against the wall of lies every single day (my work supervisor is a Vietnam vet who pounded Clinton in 96 for dodging the draft and now pounds Kerry while lauding Bush - how is that for showing what we are up against).

Kerry showed his enormous potential for warmth and people skills at the start and near the end of his rally speech the last night of the Repug convention. I was amazed and wanted more.

And I'm not saying, let's be like the Repugs and sell our souls for power, but instead, learn how the damn game is played and be willing to play it.

[mmonk]

12. But if the information gets through

it could do the most damage to the bush admin. Having the people to accept it automatically puts the dems at a disadvantage.

[deutsey]

13. And neocons are arrogant and elitist all the time

:hi:

Regarding playing the game, my beef is that the Dems always gear up to play a rough game of hockey while the Republicans are out on the ice waiting for them in machine gun nests.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

14. Our difficulty is that the drain on education has caught up with us

which is why BRAINS are now subrogated in place of the asshole you'd rather drink a fucking beer with and you are busy reinforcing that shit.

Jesus fucking christ...how many of you are anti-intellectual when it comes to choosing a fucking brain surgeon? Which of you would chose the cancer specialist you'd most like to have a beer with over the more intellectual THINKING one? What a motherfucking pantload.

[Hello_Kitty]

15. A-friggin-men to that!!! n/m

[SeekingTruth]

17. tactics and strategy...

NSMEM,

See, we are closer than you think - our strategy is the same, but we need a change in our tactics. Our old tactics of the past are ignorant of the modes of the new. We don't understand image and bullshit like the Repugs do.

Here is a great example - I believe that both groups, liberals and conservatives are equally patriotic - but when choosing a symbol to show patriotism, ask yourself what singular symbol do liberals pick and what singular symbol do conservatives pick?

Liberals mostly pick the US Constitution, while conservatives grab the flag.

My point is, that while we both have a strategy to show our patriotism, we both are using different tactics to get our message out. And in the age of electronic media and imagery, we are behind the Repugs and we must change our tactics to succeed at carrying out our strategy.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

20. Yeah well here's one for strategy

a thread like this would last two seconds on freerepublic but can last for DAYS on DU...why? because of respect for that constitution but also because Dems think having fisticuffs is more effective than banding together...guess what Seeks's? WE ARE THE MEDIA. THERE IS NO TELEVISION STATION THAT BROADCASTS DU PROGRAMMING....therefore, I request you walk that line with the rest of us...rather than use your posts to VALIDATE that perception of Bush/Cheney being manly...how about using your very erudite perceptions to rip the rug out from under it? Otherwise, you just play into THEIR strategy....see how that whole fucking morass works?

[SeekingTruth]

22. Offerings?

NSME,

And how do propose people do that? This is one of our problems.. I'm already on board with the Kerry campaign..

As far as these posts staying around...well, to get around faults, people have to acknowledge they exist and there is just too much preaching at the choir going on around here...

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

23. Sorry Seeks...to get around facts, Repukes manufacture new ones

I thought you said we should adopt their strategy? (Really I am not flaming you, I TRULY AM out to demonstrate HOW they do it...this thread isn't HOW they do it)

[SeekingTruth]

25. No, no, no...

This might sound minor or petty, but there really is a huge difference...

Strategy is the plan; tactics are the ways to carry out the plan and to get it done.

I don't want to adopt their corrupt strategy, but to understand how their tactics are used and which ones work and which ones don't.

Here is wonderful thing I've noticed about the Repugs - when it seems like they have pulled off a major coup, it turns out to bite them in the ass bigtime. Take the Medicare bill for example. Or the proposed marrige amendment. Or the war in Iraq. I think those in the Bush Whitehouse thought Iraq would be simple and mostly bloodless (for the US).

And I'm not saying use the tactics based in lies...for example the manufacture of the pulling down of the Hussein statue. Hell, most Americans believe that shit still.

But we must understand how imagery works and how to use it.

Here is how we one.....recall the embarrasing NASA pictures of Kerry? Do you recall how we fought back on that one? The Kerry campaign flooded CNN with the video clip of Bush picking his nose. So here is one way to use their tactic against them - and video trumps still photography.

This is what I'm after.....

[buycitgo]

21. you're right

pugs have made a graduate-level study of Machiavelli, Bernays, Geobbels, Ellul

they know what they're doing, and it's a masterly amalgam of cynical exploitation of public fear, ignorance, greed, xenophobia.

IOW an appeal to the lowest common denominator, the worst in all of us, topped off with a transparently emotional appeal at all levels, designed to short circuit all critical analysis of any topic of discussion

the question becomes one of how to effectively combat this approach without becoming as reprehensible as they are

[Misunderestimator]

19. If you have some criticism of the Kerry campaign...

I would suggest you write them a letter. Why are you posting this bullshit? And why the fuck should I eat red meat.

You accuse people of doing nothing, and you offer no solutions other than to do something, which people are doing. How do we clear up a "misunderstanding" of the false link made between Saddam and 9/11, other than what has been done which is to tell the truth. So, some people are still stupid enough to believe everything from their messiah... there won't be any convincing them, when all the news sources have already exposed the truth. Apparently they don't read or watch news. All you accomplish in posting this is to try to divide.

What was your point again?

[SeekingTruth]

24. Not at all...

My point was to show that Dems have let the game get away in simple areas we should not have....

For example, Dems need to be more aggressive in sticking to our own talking points. We have this great fragmented party - which is one of the wonderful things about it - we really are the true big tent party - but wandering ways weakens us. Our own "agendas" lead us astray.

As for the Bush link of 9/11 and Hussein, maybe that is coming, but one thing our party leaders could have been doing all along is asking their counter part on the talking head shows, "Did Hussein have a link to 9/11 or not?" Of course, the majority of them will have to say "no" - just like Bush did in the Whitehouse briefing. And it must be repeated. I suspect Kerry will address this in a debate.

Then, we should have framed the exploitation of 9/11 better. We've done a terrible job in that area.

Now we are starting to see that the Repugs are trying to build the belief that the Russian school take over is similar to that of 9/11. Sure, al Queda may be involved, but the true meanings have little to do with our terrorism problem and more of an Russian internal issue. What the repugs are doing here is using the horrific acts of murdering children to their benefit.

So my next question is, how much of the American people realize this if it is not pointed out?

And these are my intentions - not to tear apart the Dem party or create divisions...we must fight smarter and tougher...that's all...

[Misunderestimator]

26. Ok, back to basics then ... Why did you title your thread "Where The Dems

Have Blown It...?

Why use such derogatory and pessimistic language if you are actually trying to solve a problem? Why not title it "What I think the Dems need to do to Win the Election?"

Why the defeatism of the phrase "Blown it?"

[Name removed]

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