Should Sebelius be fired.....

[WCGreen]

It's a legitimate question. It's like someone at a large corporation publicly muddied the water before a law suit, saying yea well, we did let some toxic waste leech out of the container and we did know about it but.

No mater how much the "slip" is "walked back", it is still out there, still percolating in the right-wing echo chamber, still raising most doubts in the minds of those on the fence about the whole idea of Health Care Reform, excuse me, Health Insurance Reform.

So I ask you all, should she be fired?

If I was in charge, she would be pursuing other interests by now.

But that's me. I'm mercurial. I have that luxury.

[wndycty]

1. NO!

:kick:

[countingbluecars]

2. Ridiculous. n/t

[WCGreen]

9. Is it....

They are running a five minute piece on CNN about Obama Walking away from a public option.

This is why he should consider letting her go.

Plus, it emboldens the right as they smell weakness. They are like sharks. Never forget that.

[tridim]

3. She should be replaced with Dr. Dean IMO.

Someone who obviously cares about health care reform and has real, non-political knowledge about it.

That said, I don't think yesterday's comment is a firable offense.

[damonm]

35. I'll agree with that...

and further say that Dean should have been in that office in the first place.

[Dinger]

44. Me Too (nt)

[BlueMTexpat]

52. Me three! n/t

[anneboleyn]

53. I agree. Excellent points. He would be a superb spokesperson.

He is very articulate on this issue -- I saw him on Charlie Rose and he made a series of well-argued points about the necessity of health care reform. It was impressive -- and he knows what he is talking about!

[Tippy]

59. Dean should have been his first choice.....n/t

[CaliforniaPeggy]

4. It's a question worth asking, for sure.

I honestly don't know.

I'd have to hear what Obama thinks. She is certainly useful to him, and he'd be smart to weigh her benefits vs. her drawbacks to answer your question.

Being mercurial is a luxury, and I'm sure Obama wishes he could exercise his right to it as well. But he has to consider the long-term consequences of such an action!

Good morning!

[BobRossi]

5. Was it a "slip"?

Or was it a "leak"?

[WCGreen]

6. It could very well have been a plant to show how committed

Obama is to a public option...

And then again, it could just be a slip.

Either way, I'm glad I don't have to make those decisions.

I still think it is important to discus this.

[Clio the Leo]

11. I'm goin' with "leak"

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8593077

[Bragi]

39. Or was it a "trial balloon" that didn't float? /nt

[harun]

61. It was a trial balloon, but it may have been what they intended. They may have

been trying to show that the Pukes don't really support co-op's either. They just want the status-quo. If that was their plan it was stupid. They should be attacking the Puke lies with everything they've got. They need to go on serious offense.

[Zodiak]

7. He should not have picked her in the first place

Have any of these conservadems helped his administration yet? All I see is them going off message, pissing off the base, coddling the Blue dogs to defy the President, and otherwise creating an enthusiasm gap between us and the pukes.

Dean would have been 1000 times better.

But as far as firing.....no, she has not done anything that awful yet, but she hurt him politically if that is not what Obama wanted said. If Sebelius was floating a trial balloon for Obama, well then, I guess she is just following orders and it is Obama that needs to get his message straight.

[MissDeeds]

34. Good post

I agree with everything you said. :thumbsup:

[MgtPA]

36. And I agree with everything you said!!

[HopeOverFear]

8. Obama should at least sit her ass down and give her a good talking to

[Doremus]

10. Don't be so naive.

I highly doubt she "misspoke." There was a reason she said what she did.

I just wish I knew what it was.

[WCGreen]

12. I can assure you I am not naive...

Perhaps a tad bit cynical, but never naive.

I presented an option, a viable option in my humble opinion, in order to discus the various outcome possibilities.

[demwing]

16. Obama wants to get the bill out of the Senate

1. You pass the House bill with the Public Option.
2. You pass the Senate bill without the Public Option to avoid the filibuster.
3. Then, in Reconciliation (a budgetary process which does not allow filibusters), the Public Option goes back in, and passes with only 50+ votes.

Get the bill the fuck out of the Senate, and we'll fix it in Reconciliation.

[PhilosopherKing]

18. Sounds good to me.

Call your congressmen people. Keep the pressure on.

[WCGreen]

20. Well, that sounds like a way to go...

But what about the reconcilliation between the versions.

Could it even get out of committee if the Senate feels it is being rolled...

[demwing]

33. Which is why you play up the other options now

instead of laying your cards out on the table and saying "Go ahead and vote no now, it won't matter in the end"

You know that Obama prefers cooperation when its available...

[WCGreen]

47. I hope you are right because the Co-op's are not, as Ezra Klien pointed out

on the Ed Show, a solution to the health care problem.

[PhilosopherKing]

17. Maybe they did it to light the fire under the base so that

we can show up at these stupid town halls and DEMAND A PUBLIC OPTION!

[Abq_Sarah]

22. I honestly believe

She was sent out to make that statement as a way to test the mood of the congress. Do we gain or lose votes without a public option? I've heard dropping a public option would cost us more votes in the House than we'd pick up by dropping it. I suspect that's a pretty accurate assessment. They've got two choices now. Either back off and hope we pick up enough of the 18 repub Senate seats to give us a firm majority or pass a watered down version that can be readdressed and improved in the next couple of years.

[GarbagemanLB]

13. It wasn't a 'misspeak', it was a trial balloon. The Obama administration clearly is thinking of

dropping the public option and they wanted to see the reaction.

[demwing]

21. There are other ways to view what happened

such as Obama is trying to get the bill out of the Senate, and into reconciliation, where it will not be subject to filibuster

[elocs]

14. I don't know how you misspeak about something so important.

This White House and Obama had better get their act and their message together. Healthcare reform is way too important for amateur hour.

[Bluenorthwest]

15. If not replaced, she should be relived of media duties

and a person with strong abilities in this very important area should take over that aspect of her job. Her communications abilities are not good, and on TV she stinks. So, maybe she's great in the office, I doubt it, but she is lousy on camera and should not be doing that in the future.
Our Party has a tendency to think of media appearances as rewards for the big shots, when they are actually moments of great value to the process. The GOP uses specific people for specific media roles, fully trained and ready to strike. We put forth the likes of Sebeleus, or others that I see who frankly seem annoyed to be there, as if explaining their position were beneath them. The message is what is important, and sending those incapable of speaking that message out into national media spotlights is just stupid. This is a Party wide phenomenon.
They need to start up a school in which Debbie Wasserman Schultz trains them to stop being failures in of of the most important aspects of their job. Sean Penn can guest lecture. But they need help. This is a serious lacking in the Party and the administration, they need to respect the importance of communications, and get some talent out there, ready and able. Train them if you must.
But when speaking is a huge part of your job, and you do not do it extremely well, you most certainly should not retain those duties, if not lose the entire job. It is not a minor thing. It might not be termination time, but it is most certainly time for a rethinking of how this message is being sent out, and by whom.
Send only the best to do the hardest jobs. Selling health care reform in America qualifies as a hard job. But we get mediocrity when we need brilliance. That part must be addressed. In order to retain power and pass law, that part must be addressed. We need better communicators on our side, media ready and highly skilled.

[ProSense]

19. Yeah, Obama is going to fire a cabinet member because

some people are freaking out over a comment that's being being twisted by the idiotic media.

Ludicrous!

[countingbluecars]

26. I listened to her entire comment again,

and I do agree that the media is twisting her words.

[WCGreen]

30. I just posed a question....

BTW, Health Insurance stocks are on the rise today because of the comments made and how they were dissembled by the media...

[ProSense]

31. Why? n/t

[WCGreen]

48. Traders believe, according to those on CNBC, that the Health Insurance

Inustry looks as if they have dodged a bullet.

[masuki bance]

56. You should let the WH know that, they are the ones who said she misspoke. nt

[WI_DEM]

23. Why?

[MarjorieG]

24. Media's fault at analysis, so no. Eliminating reasons for denial of coverage important and

overlooked, because public sounds like gov't, which for 30 years has been a bad thing. So public option is demonized more than anything else. Insurance had promised to self-regulate and didn't, so that is something to stress.

Dean is great as advocate. Imagine him muzzled at this before bill stage, spokesman for Congress and not himself?

[jefferson_dem]

25. C'mon, get a grip. This place has grown downright embarassing.

n/t

[WCGreen]

28. So we shouldn't explore possibilites...

Toe the line.

No breaches allowed.

Dismiss a valid question cause it doesn't fit your narrow view of the world.

That's sounds like freeper land to me...

[jefferson_dem]

32. Put your straw men back in the barn.

I'm sorry if I offended you but calling for the resignation of the Secretary of HHS over this "story" is just nonsense...and the narrowest view of all, in my opinion.

Of course, this was a fairly annoying communication breakdown. I said that last night. But let's not get crazy about it, eh.

[WCGreen]

46. Remember that I just posed a question and did not call for her

job. I said if it was me I would fire her but parsed that by saying I was mercurial.

[alcibiades_mystery]

27. Oh fer chrissakes.

What it is it, National Stupid Week?

[WCGreen]

29. Answering a valid question by suggesting it is stupid is well, stupid...

[ArnoldLayne]

37. No

She's doing alright, although she might be in need of a little trip to the woodshed . :kick:

[QC]

38. This dustup was probably an official trial balloon.

Why fire her for following orders?

[kenny blankenship]

40. I remember some groaning that went on when she was nominated. Something about her being too close

to insurance companies.

I don't care anymore. She's doing the job she was put up to do. That's not going to change if someone else gets her place in the Cabinet.

[WCGreen]

50. Not now...

[AlinPA]

41. Not for her remark, but after seeing her in action she seems a lot like Harry Reid. Not a leader.

How in the hell did she get elected to governor in Kansas?

[TheKentuckian]

42. First, from listening to her response I'm surprised that it blew up into this

but King and then the OP put it on the spin cycle.

Second, to me that would seem like a drastic overreaction. She was on message and got a redirect and simply used less than the best messaging mostly in an effort to not repeat herself.

Her message is that the option is not the plan but a component of it. It is nothing but a control mechanism to help make sure the regulation works or to give the public an escape pod if private insurance reform is a huge fail. It is good messaging to back the focus off the brakes enough to allow us to talk about the car more.

Not that the option isn't key to making a real go of making this work, especially over the long term but I do think it is silly to conflate it with being the plan.

[WCGreen]

49. I understand what she said...

I didn't spin this, I reacted to what was happening with the News Cycle today. Ed was still talking about it today at 6:00 so the message is put there whether she mis-spoke or not.

It's the reality. Or to use a suddenly hoary description, gone viral.

[Robbins]

43. Yes!

The president when returning from vacation should ask for her resignation.This does nothing to help
Helath Care reform.Pissing off the Democratic Base during a critical time Is not a good Idea.This Is
not Kansas where a Dem has to act like a Republican to get elected.

She Is helping Republicans with this.Killing Helath Care reform will help Republicans.

[NJGeek]

45. Yes - she is impotent

poor spokesperson for the administration

[Egnever]

51. Yes we should fire everyone who mispeaks

We could easily double the unemployment roles in a few days. It would be awesome!

[kayla9170]

54. YEAP and Enter Dr. Dean!!

[saltpoint]

55. I don't think there are grounds for dismissal, especially given the

fact that the president's own advisors appear to have fluctuated in their own positions.

I think former New Jersey Senator Bill Bradley would have been the best pick for this job. Inasmuch as Kathleen Sebelius holds it at the present, her job seems safe.

[democracy1st]

57. hell fvckn No, Its this dayum Pres sending mixed messages

[Vidar]

58. Most of his cabinet/advisors should be fired, starting with Rahm.

[harun]

60. I gotta say I agree with you. Get progressives in there, not a bunch of closet neo-cons.

[Hippo_Tron]

63. That statement kinda runs contrary to your sig picture, doesn't it?

[smalll]

62. I just think she needs to do something better with her hair.

She has a pretty but aging face. Now there's nothing wrong with going resolutely gray at her age, in fact, it's positively inspiring. But her 'do is hardly what she needs right now. We need to see more effort. :shrug: ( "I'm just sayin'." )