Martin dismisses Parrish from caucus

[Lautremont]

http://www.cbc.ca/story/canada/national/2004/11/18/parrish041118.html

Was it the doll-stomping or calling Martin "weak" that was the last straw? The latter, obviously.

[Bill McBlueState]

1. Ohh, he looks so sad...

Poor guy doesn't like being called "weak." *sniff, sniff*

[billyoc]

2. What are the ramifications of "dismissal"?

Does that mean you lose your job, go home for the day, what?

[whirlygigspin]

4. it means she's no longer welcome in the party

to the curb, as it were.

[Maple]

5. She is still an MP

and still stays in Parliament representing her riding. She is just no longer a member of the Liberal party, and cannot attend their meetings.

She would now be considered an Independent.

[billyoc]

6. Oh, wow. I wonder if she'll join NDP?

is that possible? I'm not that familiar with Canadian politics. :shrug:

[Maple]

7. She could well do

She certainly won't be welcome in the Conservative party, nor would she likely go there.

Even though it would give them one more MP.

But if she goes to the NDP, Parliamentary standings won't change.

[iverglas]

9. crossing the floor

It's a grand old tradition in parliamentary democracies. Crossing back again is always fun, too.

Of course, it's usually been done for quite venal reasons. C'mon over, and we'll make you the Minister of Pork Barrels, that sorta thing. And often, particularly in the case of defection from the governing party, by rats deserting sinking ships, wanting to secure their personal re-election without the millstone of an unpopular party/leader around their neck.

Well heh, I'm not the first to have used that metaphor.

http://www.mikecampbell.net/the_campblog_dec01_dec15_2003.htm#2003121201

After his second crossing, Churchill admitted ...

Anyone can rat, but it takes a certain amount
of ingenuity to re-rat.

And come to think of it, I do remember this one:

http://www.winstonchurchill.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=446

But he knew that one has to be very selective in timing and objectives. Commenting on a 1920’s Conservative member who was standing as a Liberal in a by-election, Churchill said it was the only instance of a rat swimming towards a sinking ship.

[whirlygigspin]

3. PM stomps on Parrish

He who stomps last stomps best?

live and learn.

[CatBoreal]

8. She should...

..sit as an independant.

I hope she makes life difficult for Martin, I really do.

Cam

[TO Kid]

10. She already has

She's been an embarassment to the party for a long time. If she runs again the Libs might lose her riding (either she retakes or the party vote splits, giving it to the Tories) but this move has probably increased his support from the rest of the country.

[Spazito]

13. Yeah, right, that's why she was re-elected by her riding

and will be again, as either NDP or independent. Your party will have to go elsewhere.

[CatBoreal]

24. She won't join the NDP...

She'll be able to have more influence as an independent.

Yes, she was blunt, yes she was nasty. But it's not like Canadians were getting anywhere by making nice. It certainly hasn't helped our beef farmers or the softwood lumber industry.

It's about bloody time someone tells the American Government where to go. It'd be nice to see someone with some actual power stand up to the the Bushites for a change.

Imagine, the Liberals with a backbone.

Cam

[TO Kid]

11. Now with Sheila Copps gone...

Parrish had taken Sheila's place as the party's national embarassment. I wonder who's next?

[Canadian_moderate]

12. As much as I dislike GWB and his policies

Carolyn Parrish is an embarrassment. Sure, disagree and criticize, but have a little tact. A lot of peoples' jobs are at stake when you make stupid statement like she did.

[whirlygigspin]

14. video link

http://www.cbc.ca/MRL/clips/rm-lo/vandusen_parrish041118.rm

[iverglas]

17. it's on again tonight, Friday

8:30 pm where I'm at.

http://www.cbc.ca/programguide/program/index.jsp?program=This+Hour+Has+22+Minutes

I missed it, so I'll be there.

[Feathered Fish]

16. If only other MP's could be so honest

All the tactless comments aside, Parrish should feel proud about telling Paul Martin off. The grits are known for tossing MP's to the side when they don't agree with the leader, a practice that's outdated and never in the best intrest of the party (but I suppose, neither was selecting PM as leader). As for an embarrassment, ha! I am not embarrassed by her, I am more embarrassed that everyone else sits in silence and watches her fall from grace while snickering from the sidelines. It's like observing a playground. I really hope she crosses and joins the NDP, it may not change any standings, but it would be a slap in PM's face. Oh yeah, and Canadians need to shut their faces. All we ever do is complain about the feds yet nobody seems to care when the election comes around and voting seems like a chore.

[Canadian_moderate]

18. Parrish joining the NDP...

would basically assure us that she will not be elected as an MP in the next election. She's a piece of trash and an embarrassment. If she doesn't have anything in an intelligent matter she should shut the hell up and sit down.

I'm against the war in Iraq and I'm glad we stayed out of it, but let's be a little more tactful when we criticize our largest trade partner (86% of all our exports representating roughly 35% of our total GDP). If we don't want their business, the USA will gladly deal with China or India instead. It's one thing to respectfully disagree and not involve ourselves in their actions, it's another to be a complete imbecile.

Canada can either be involved in diplomatic relations and hope to have influence in matters, or we can be ignored all-together. Which would you prefer?

[Feathered Fish]

19. So there you go,

if she joins the NDP you get your way. Isn't that great?
btw - "Piece of trash"? A little harsh.
Flame on.

[iverglas]

22. hey, do we get a choice??

Canada can either be involved in diplomatic relations and hope to have influence in matters, or we can be ignored all-together. Which would you prefer?

I'll take door number one! Oops. Where's the doorknob?

We get influence? Not when it comes to anything the US has felt like doing recently, as far as I can tell. Have you been seeing something that's escaped my notice? Something the US has got up to, or wanted to get up to, that we've managed to influence?

Oh, that's right ... you said "hope to influence", not "influence" ... . Well, there's a waste of time if you want one, eh?

Where we *do* have influence internationally is in a lot of places that the US either actively seeks to undermine (international organizations) or doesn't give a shit about (Africa).

And as a result of our activities in those kinds of places, we gain more influence with other influential interlocutors on the international and bilateral stages (Europe).

On the other hand, being respectful obsequious in our dealings with the US isn't likely to get us much influence in any of those places.

And it's never actually got us anywhere with the US either, as far as I can tell. Even if base self-interest were the only motive worth having in such matters.

Don't forget: we're either for 'em or we're agin 'em. So unless and until we start sending cannon fodder to Iraq, I wouldn't be expecting any favours. Or even any beef sales.

Of course, sending target practice subjects to Afghanistan didn't actually get us anything, so even that might be kinda pointless ...

[CHIMO]

25. How Does That Saying

Go now?
Something, something...so we are arguing about the price. Right.

[MrPrax]

15. The most appalling part of all this...

The most appalling part of all this is that a mere handful of editors in the CanMedia© (esp the increasingly toady CBC) have decided she's an embarassment...

Lemme see if I get this--polls here indicate that as many as 83% of Canadians have absolutely no use for Shrub and Parrish's comments are mild compared to most...

Yet she is the ONLY MP out of 300 to even remotely close to popular opinion on this particular subject...

Didn't these people learn anything from the Charlottetown Accord referendum?

P.S. Hey Jack--you better cut the Broadbent act, buddy or next time around you guys won't even have a tax status after the NEXT election--ain't nobody votes NDP in 2004 so you can arrange golden parachutes and play moderate Liberal--step up to the plate

[iverglas]

20. the CBC's part

This morning, Harry Forestell on Newsworld repeatedly referred to "anti-americanism" in reporting on Parrish's ouster.

This is obnoxious. And I'm about to email the show and say so ...

http://www.cbc.ca/morning/

Here I go ...

[e-mail]

subject: Friday 19 November 2004 news -- Carolyn Parrish

I was perturbed to hear repeated references to "anti-Americanism" in this morning's news reports concerning the ouster of Carolyn Parrish from the Liberal caucus.

This language is inflammatory, inaccurate, and highly inappropriate on the CBC.

In the very first instance when Parrish's views hit the news, the allegations that her comment regarding "Americans" referred to USAmericans in general or in total was simply equivocation. She was plainly referring to particular individuals, and it was dishonest of anyone who "interpreted" her comments as referring to the population of the US to allege otherwise.

There are millions of Canadians who regard George W. Bush with utter contempt, and who strenuously oppose just about every policy he has ever espoused and everything he has ever done, and who have little respect for the voters who have recently re-elected him. This does not make us "Anti-american" any more than contempt for Ralph Klein, opposition to his policies and lack of respect for voters who elect him make one "anti-Albertan".

I wouldn't be surprised if a person were described in some quarters as "anti-Catholic", for instance, for denouncing child abuse by RC clergy. But I would not expect to hear it said in a CBC newscast.

I would very much like to see an end to characterizations of opponents of the Bush administration as "anti-American".

Thank you.

I got CTV to stop saying "Communist China" a few weeks back -- let's see whether my powers work on the CBC. ;)

Anybody who wants to join in, feel free!

[MrPrax]

26. Right Behind You...

I am a CBC listener...(radio) and check Pete out a couple of times a week...

And I send e-mails to give con-grats wehn progressives get one across (all too rare) and e-blast them when, as you point out, when their phoney pseudo-journalism/cheerleading get really insulting to their core users/supporters...

Your letter is pure gold, dude...much better than the snotty 'slams' I send...

As you point, being against Americans and their 'way of life' is somehow be vaulted to a charter rights issue...makes you think Harper and CRAP is writing their copy (actually makes Harpy even worst coz his 'core' is western Canada and their bearing the brunt of the 'trade war' and Harpers party of clowns are so fixated on power they have forgotten their own angry roots)

This minority gov't has simply produced an Opposition that is trying to tap it's liberal roots...including the NDP--which hilariously is trying to distance itself from the whole Parrish affair and the whole time say--'their are ways of criticizing US foreign policy and expansionism'...LOL

OK which is the alternative?

(note: CBC coverage over the sub fire--it was practically the PMO reporting the spin courtesy of taxpayers)

[hermetic]

21. Just remember

There is a difference between having character and being one.

[Wat_Tyler]

23. The Americans aren't buying our products out of good will.

They buy them because the price and product is right. No MP, no comment will change that.

[CHIMO]

27. Our CBC Commentary

Carolyn Parrish ran as a Liberal candidate in the June federal election, and both before and after the election she has been very vocal in her opposition to U.S. President George Bush's agenda. She has called Bush and Star Wars defence system supporters a "coalition of idiots," "bastards" and more recently on a TV satire show she stomped on a George Bush doll. At the same time Parrish has denied she made certain comments and attempted to convince the media not to report certain of her comments.


With George Bush on his way to visit Ottawa in less than two weeks, Parrish's actions challenged Martin to take a stand. While his decision to kick Parrish out of the caucus technically does not break his leadership campaign promise, it will send a chilling message to other Liberals that those challenging the party line will risk being punished.


Whether or not you agree with Parrish's positions on George Bush and the issues, if her goal is to influence the Liberal cabinet then her actions are completely, strategically unintelligent.


First, she made the mistake of thinking, with the Liberals controlling only a minority of seats in Parliament, Paul Martin would tolerate her actions in order to keep her vote. But Martin knows that on almost all issues one vote won't make or break the government.

http://www.cbc.ca/insite/COMMENTARY/2004/11/19.html